EFI For Big Blue

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Re: EFI For Big Blue

85lebaront2
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That's right, I sent it to you with the TIN3 box and some other items. You just need to finish the wiring including a switch for the key on power.
Bill AKA "LOBO" Profile

"Getting old is inevitable, growing up is optional" Darth Vader 1986 F350 460 converted to MAF/SEFI, E4OD 12X3 1/2 rear brakes, traction loc 3:55 gear, 160 amp 3G alternator Wife's 2011 Flex Limited Daily Driver 2009 Flex Limited with factory tow package Project car 1986 Chrysler LeBaron convertible 2.2L Turbo II, modified A413

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Re: EFI For Big Blue

Gary Lewis
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Yes, you did.  But, you mean the GIN3 box.  (Man, you have me worried!  You are now 2 years older than I am, and look what those two years do to a man!  )


Gary, AKA "Gary fellow": Profile

Dad's: '81 F150 Ranger XLT 4x4: Down for restomod: Full-roller "stroked 351M" w/Trick Flow heads & intake, EEC-V SEFI/E4OD/3.50 gears w/Kevlar clutches
Blue: 2015 F150 Platinum 4x4 SuperCrew wearing Blue Jeans & sporting a 3.5L EB & Max Tow
Big Blue: 1985 F250HD 4x4: 460/ZF5/3.55's, D60 w/Ox locker & 10.25 Sterling/Trutrac, Blue Top & Borgeson, & EEC-V MAF/SEFI

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Re: EFI For Big Blue

85lebaront2
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I couldn't remember which I sent, am am not out where I can check my inventory. All except my unicorn (a real FEZ3 box) were either TIN3 or GIN3. FYI, those are 1996 E250/350 5.8L w/E4OD and also F series same applications. So when you are prowling junk yards look for some so we will both have spares.
Bill AKA "LOBO" Profile

"Getting old is inevitable, growing up is optional" Darth Vader 1986 F350 460 converted to MAF/SEFI, E4OD 12X3 1/2 rear brakes, traction loc 3:55 gear, 160 amp 3G alternator Wife's 2011 Flex Limited Daily Driver 2009 Flex Limited with factory tow package Project car 1986 Chrysler LeBaron convertible 2.2L Turbo II, modified A413

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Re: EFI For Big Blue

Gary Lewis
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This post was updated on .
I'm trying to get my head around your test harness and the Pin-Outs tab on the Electrical/Electronic Engine Control page. Toward that end I've put together this spreadsheet.

Does it make sense? Can you answer the questions, please?

Gary, AKA "Gary fellow": Profile

Dad's: '81 F150 Ranger XLT 4x4: Down for restomod: Full-roller "stroked 351M" w/Trick Flow heads & intake, EEC-V SEFI/E4OD/3.50 gears w/Kevlar clutches
Blue: 2015 F150 Platinum 4x4 SuperCrew wearing Blue Jeans & sporting a 3.5L EB & Max Tow
Big Blue: 1985 F250HD 4x4: 460/ZF5/3.55's, D60 w/Ox locker & 10.25 Sterling/Trutrac, Blue Top & Borgeson, & EEC-V MAF/SEFI

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Re: EFI For Big Blue

85lebaront2
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570 and 875 are both grounds, they go to different ground locations, 570, all 5 go to G101, which is near the battery on the RH fender apron, 875 goes to G104 which is near the left hood hinge. That harness I sent you is from a Crown Victoria, colors are different, use the pin locations for correct function. My test harness is the same way, one of the places Ford was not consistent.
Bill AKA "LOBO" Profile

"Getting old is inevitable, growing up is optional" Darth Vader 1986 F350 460 converted to MAF/SEFI, E4OD 12X3 1/2 rear brakes, traction loc 3:55 gear, 160 amp 3G alternator Wife's 2011 Flex Limited Daily Driver 2009 Flex Limited with factory tow package Project car 1986 Chrysler LeBaron convertible 2.2L Turbo II, modified A413

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Re: EFI For Big Blue

Gary Lewis
Administrator
Bill - I've updated the spreadsheet to capture your comments.  But, I assume for test purposes that all the grounds can be tied together and go back to the power source.  And, that the two VPWR leads can be tied together as well.

Also, do I have the connections to the data link connector figured out correctly?  I'm assuming that the cable I get from Core Tuning will connect to the DLC - right?  And that the computer program, Binary Editor, will read the ECU over the two data link wires and then program the ECU by flashing the PCM wire.  Correct?

Are there instructions with the kit I'm getting from Core Tuning?
Gary, AKA "Gary fellow": Profile

Dad's: '81 F150 Ranger XLT 4x4: Down for restomod: Full-roller "stroked 351M" w/Trick Flow heads & intake, EEC-V SEFI/E4OD/3.50 gears w/Kevlar clutches
Blue: 2015 F150 Platinum 4x4 SuperCrew wearing Blue Jeans & sporting a 3.5L EB & Max Tow
Big Blue: 1985 F250HD 4x4: 460/ZF5/3.55's, D60 w/Ox locker & 10.25 Sterling/Trutrac, Blue Top & Borgeson, & EEC-V MAF/SEFI

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Re: EFI For Big Blue

85lebaront2
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Yes, all grounds to negative source, if you use a battery charger, put a lawn tractor or motorcycle battery as a wave damper for the power. VPWR needs to be switchable as you will need to turn the key on and back off as the flash sequence is executed. On the OBD-II connector, 2 is 914, 10 is 915, 4 and 5 are grounds, 13 is 107 and 16 is 12V power (not needed as far as I remember, I will have to look at mine tomorrow).

914 and 915 are the comm leads, the flash enable is 18V applied to 107, this puts the EEC in a receive state. Once this is done the PC will load the tune into the EEC and the software will instruct you to turn the key off.

When flashing in situ (you should understand British) I found that you need to unpower the KAPWR, I do it on Darth by pulling the underhood maxi fuse #9 which saves disconnecting the battery.

No instructions, Adam will walk you through and log in on your PC and show you what to do. I had my EEC set up with the bench flash rig so it could be worked with.
Bill AKA "LOBO" Profile

"Getting old is inevitable, growing up is optional" Darth Vader 1986 F350 460 converted to MAF/SEFI, E4OD 12X3 1/2 rear brakes, traction loc 3:55 gear, 160 amp 3G alternator Wife's 2011 Flex Limited Daily Driver 2009 Flex Limited with factory tow package Project car 1986 Chrysler LeBaron convertible 2.2L Turbo II, modified A413

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Re: EFI For Big Blue

Gary Lewis
Administrator
Ok, got it.  But, where does the 18V come from?  Does the cable they supply derive it via a flying capacitor arrangement?
Gary, AKA "Gary fellow": Profile

Dad's: '81 F150 Ranger XLT 4x4: Down for restomod: Full-roller "stroked 351M" w/Trick Flow heads & intake, EEC-V SEFI/E4OD/3.50 gears w/Kevlar clutches
Blue: 2015 F150 Platinum 4x4 SuperCrew wearing Blue Jeans & sporting a 3.5L EB & Max Tow
Big Blue: 1985 F250HD 4x4: 460/ZF5/3.55's, D60 w/Ox locker & 10.25 Sterling/Trutrac, Blue Top & Borgeson, & EEC-V MAF/SEFI

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Re: EFI For Big Blue

85lebaront2
Administrator
I have no idea what it uses and don't plan on taking it apart to find out.
Bill AKA "LOBO" Profile

"Getting old is inevitable, growing up is optional" Darth Vader 1986 F350 460 converted to MAF/SEFI, E4OD 12X3 1/2 rear brakes, traction loc 3:55 gear, 160 amp 3G alternator Wife's 2011 Flex Limited Daily Driver 2009 Flex Limited with factory tow package Project car 1986 Chrysler LeBaron convertible 2.2L Turbo II, modified A413

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Re: EFI For Big Blue

Gary Lewis
Administrator
Did quite a bit of running around today, but did manage to get one thing done towards EFI for Big Blue - found a "data link connector", aka OBD-II connector.  Turns out that's not the easiest thing to find.  Went to all three auto parts stores in town - nada.  Finally called my friends at the salvage near here and they pulled the one below for me from an Aerostar, which means the wires are the right color.  In fact, comparing it to the one shown in the '96 EVTM, this one has all the right wires and an extra to boot.  

I'm hoping tomorrow to marry the test harness Bill sent me with this connector, add a couple of switches for vehicle and keep-alive power, and it'll be ready for when I get the package from Core Tuning.


Gary, AKA "Gary fellow": Profile

Dad's: '81 F150 Ranger XLT 4x4: Down for restomod: Full-roller "stroked 351M" w/Trick Flow heads & intake, EEC-V SEFI/E4OD/3.50 gears w/Kevlar clutches
Blue: 2015 F150 Platinum 4x4 SuperCrew wearing Blue Jeans & sporting a 3.5L EB & Max Tow
Big Blue: 1985 F250HD 4x4: 460/ZF5/3.55's, D60 w/Ox locker & 10.25 Sterling/Trutrac, Blue Top & Borgeson, & EEC-V MAF/SEFI

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Re: EFI For Big Blue

grumpin
Good find!
Dane
1986 F250HD SC XLT Lariat 4x4 460 C6-Sold
1992 Bronco XLT 4x4 351W E4OD
1998 GMC Sierra SLE K1500 350 4L60E
Arizona
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Re: EFI For Big Blue

85lebaront2
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In reply to this post by Gary Lewis
Gary, I thought I sent a connector with the GIN3 box and EEC-V plug.
Bill AKA "LOBO" Profile

"Getting old is inevitable, growing up is optional" Darth Vader 1986 F350 460 converted to MAF/SEFI, E4OD 12X3 1/2 rear brakes, traction loc 3:55 gear, 160 amp 3G alternator Wife's 2011 Flex Limited Daily Driver 2009 Flex Limited with factory tow package Project car 1986 Chrysler LeBaron convertible 2.2L Turbo II, modified A413

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Re: EFI For Big Blue

Gary Lewis
Administrator
Now that you mention it, I think you did.   

Well, this one will be either the one I wire in for Big Blue or Dad's truck.  
Gary, AKA "Gary fellow": Profile

Dad's: '81 F150 Ranger XLT 4x4: Down for restomod: Full-roller "stroked 351M" w/Trick Flow heads & intake, EEC-V SEFI/E4OD/3.50 gears w/Kevlar clutches
Blue: 2015 F150 Platinum 4x4 SuperCrew wearing Blue Jeans & sporting a 3.5L EB & Max Tow
Big Blue: 1985 F250HD 4x4: 460/ZF5/3.55's, D60 w/Ox locker & 10.25 Sterling/Trutrac, Blue Top & Borgeson, & EEC-V MAF/SEFI

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Re: EFI For Big Blue

Gary Lewis
Administrator
Bill - I'd like to pick your brain on various things about Core Tuning as what I read on their site is very confusing.

For instance, I ordered the Direct Flash package as that's what Adam recommended.  In fact, after reading further on their site I was concerned that it is the wrong package and called him back.  But he checked what I'd ordered and assured me it is the right thing.

The package includes:

1) Binary Editor w/Dongle
2) Includes All Supported Strategies
3) Pro Direct Flash Cable
4) OBDII License

But when reading the Getting Started document on Binary Editor it says "Supports multiple hardware types ie Moates, TwEECer, EEC Tuner, Drew Technologies, ELM 327, ELM 320."  There's no mention of "Pro Direct Flash Cable".  What am I missing?

Then in Section 2.2 of the document it says "plug in the hardware device".  I'm assuming that is the Pro Direct Flash Cable - right?  If so, again there's no mention of that cable in the 2.2.1 table, and therefore no URL from which to get the drivers.

Am I looking at old documentation?  What cable do you have?
Gary, AKA "Gary fellow": Profile

Dad's: '81 F150 Ranger XLT 4x4: Down for restomod: Full-roller "stroked 351M" w/Trick Flow heads & intake, EEC-V SEFI/E4OD/3.50 gears w/Kevlar clutches
Blue: 2015 F150 Platinum 4x4 SuperCrew wearing Blue Jeans & sporting a 3.5L EB & Max Tow
Big Blue: 1985 F250HD 4x4: 460/ZF5/3.55's, D60 w/Ox locker & 10.25 Sterling/Trutrac, Blue Top & Borgeson, & EEC-V MAF/SEFI

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Re: EFI For Big Blue

Gary Lewis
Administrator
Update: While the file linked to above, Binary Editor Getting Started, is what is available via the Core Tuning web site, it is dated 12 Aug 2009 and is Revision A.  However, by doing a Google search I found a file called Binary Editor Help that is dated April 1 2019 and is Revision 5.166.  The latter file contains the 17 pages of the first file and adds 69 more pages!  And both were written by Clint Garrity, the 3rd person in Core Tuning.

I haven't, yet, fully read the larger of the two, but will do ASAP.  Perhaps it answers some of my questions, but is sure to raise several more.......
Gary, AKA "Gary fellow": Profile

Dad's: '81 F150 Ranger XLT 4x4: Down for restomod: Full-roller "stroked 351M" w/Trick Flow heads & intake, EEC-V SEFI/E4OD/3.50 gears w/Kevlar clutches
Blue: 2015 F150 Platinum 4x4 SuperCrew wearing Blue Jeans & sporting a 3.5L EB & Max Tow
Big Blue: 1985 F250HD 4x4: 460/ZF5/3.55's, D60 w/Ox locker & 10.25 Sterling/Trutrac, Blue Top & Borgeson, & EEC-V MAF/SEFI

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Re: EFI For Big Blue

85lebaront2
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The pro direct flash cable is only for the EEC-V/OBD-II systems and is the interface between your laptop and the vehicle, the other equipment listed are primarily for use with EEC-IV systems where the EEC cannot be reflashed and requires a piggyback tuner (Moates, TwEECer etc.) The software supports these, but, in order to use any of them the license has to reflect it.
Bill AKA "LOBO" Profile

"Getting old is inevitable, growing up is optional" Darth Vader 1986 F350 460 converted to MAF/SEFI, E4OD 12X3 1/2 rear brakes, traction loc 3:55 gear, 160 amp 3G alternator Wife's 2011 Flex Limited Daily Driver 2009 Flex Limited with factory tow package Project car 1986 Chrysler LeBaron convertible 2.2L Turbo II, modified A413

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Re: EFI For Big Blue

Gary Lewis
Administrator
Makes sense.  Thanks.  But, it would be helpful if the Core Tuning web site or documentation, and preferably both, would explain that.  

I sent Clint, and cc'd Ben and Adam, an email this morning explaining who I am and what I'm doing - both using their kit to do Big Blue and Dad's truck as well as documenting it as I go.  And I asked why there are two versions of the documentation on Binary Editor, both authored by Clint but 10 years apart, and why their web site only links to the old one.  Further, why neither document says that Binary Editor supports the cable they just sold me.

And, I gave them a link to this thread as well as the forum/web site.  Perhaps from my experience they can understand what is missing in their documentation and upgrade it.  And, I hope that by thoroughly documenting what I/we do on Big Blue, whomever comes behind can do it much more easily.
Gary, AKA "Gary fellow": Profile

Dad's: '81 F150 Ranger XLT 4x4: Down for restomod: Full-roller "stroked 351M" w/Trick Flow heads & intake, EEC-V SEFI/E4OD/3.50 gears w/Kevlar clutches
Blue: 2015 F150 Platinum 4x4 SuperCrew wearing Blue Jeans & sporting a 3.5L EB & Max Tow
Big Blue: 1985 F250HD 4x4: 460/ZF5/3.55's, D60 w/Ox locker & 10.25 Sterling/Trutrac, Blue Top & Borgeson, & EEC-V MAF/SEFI

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Re: EFI For Big Blue

Gary Lewis
Administrator
I'm capturing this so Core Tuning can know what issues their customers may run into, as well as the work-around I found.

I just tried to install Binary Editor.  The first thing the documents say to do is to install Microsoft's .NET package but that was already on the shop computer.  However, when I then tried to install BE I got this error message:



So I tried installing Microsoft's 2007 Office System data connectivity components - to no avail because Microsoft said that I don't have any 2007 Office System applications on the PC.  True, mine are all Office 365.  

So, with quite a bit of Googling and several other attemps I did find a writeup that explains that installing Microsoft's 2007 Access database engine should work as it doesn't look to see what applications you have loaded.  That installed nicely and then Binary Editor installed.  Having said that, I don't know that it will work with Office 365.  But at least BE installed.  

Meanwhile I texted with Adam and have a 9:00 call with him set up on Monday.  However, I won't have the dongle that is coming in the mail, and that's needed in order to make BE fully functional.  So we may have to reschedule.  We shall see.

And, I now have a test harness, thanks to Bill and a bit of solder, heat shrink, tape, and convolute.  



Gary, AKA "Gary fellow": Profile

Dad's: '81 F150 Ranger XLT 4x4: Down for restomod: Full-roller "stroked 351M" w/Trick Flow heads & intake, EEC-V SEFI/E4OD/3.50 gears w/Kevlar clutches
Blue: 2015 F150 Platinum 4x4 SuperCrew wearing Blue Jeans & sporting a 3.5L EB & Max Tow
Big Blue: 1985 F250HD 4x4: 460/ZF5/3.55's, D60 w/Ox locker & 10.25 Sterling/Trutrac, Blue Top & Borgeson, & EEC-V MAF/SEFI

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Re: EFI For Big Blue

Gary Lewis
Administrator
To help me get my head around what the "system" is that I'm working on, I created the block diagram below.  The dashed lines indicate things that aren't always there.  In other words, the EEC-V system will always be there, as will the Innovate wide-band AFR meter - until I move it to Dad's truck for tuning.  But the Windows computer won't always be there.  In fact, once the tuning is done and I'm happy with the way it runs then the it'll probably not be used again, unless I want to tweak something.

However, not shown is the Arduino computer I plan to use to convert the later fuel level sending unit's output to match the Bullnose gauge's input.  And, it turns out that there's plenty of ways to interface an Arduino to an OBD-II port.  For instance, this guy has a kit and says the Arduino can get and display the following info:

Vehicle speed
Engine RPM
Throttle position
Calculated/absolute Engine load
Engine coolant temperature
Intake temperature
Intake pressure
MAF flow pressure
Fuel pressure
Barometric pressure
Ignition timing advance
Engine running time
Vehicle running distance

So, that might be a way to get the additional info I was planning on having the Arduino display - potentially in a display housed in a F600ish radio bezel.  And, I could have switches in the switch openings for things like the air compressor, PTO input to the EEC to up the idle, parallel the batteries, etc.  

Gary, AKA "Gary fellow": Profile

Dad's: '81 F150 Ranger XLT 4x4: Down for restomod: Full-roller "stroked 351M" w/Trick Flow heads & intake, EEC-V SEFI/E4OD/3.50 gears w/Kevlar clutches
Blue: 2015 F150 Platinum 4x4 SuperCrew wearing Blue Jeans & sporting a 3.5L EB & Max Tow
Big Blue: 1985 F250HD 4x4: 460/ZF5/3.55's, D60 w/Ox locker & 10.25 Sterling/Trutrac, Blue Top & Borgeson, & EEC-V MAF/SEFI

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Re: EFI For Big Blue

FoxFord33
Man, alive! Cool stuff! I know it will work, just a matter of grabbing all the handles.

I use the ELM 327 for OBDII. It was like $6 a few years ago. I have only ever run free software from my android with it, and it does all I need, but there is capacity for quite a lot, depending on what you can make the ship's computer plus the Arduino glean from sensors (factory or additional). I think you might remember that we found out Apple (at that time) did not play well with the way the bluetooth connection code stacked, and therefore wouldn't communicate. But I don't know if they have changed anything with that. Anyways, in future, someone with a popular interface will be able to talk to the truck.

I'm going to be looking into what it would take for me to go from OBD to OBDII on my 93. Just for curiosity's sake, unless it's not too difficult.
Ford Grand Wagoneer - 1990 Jeep Grand Wagoneer preparing to receive a Ford drivetrain...

A Keeper - 1993 F-150 XLT Super-Cab 5.0 EFI 2WD E4OD 8.8" with 3.55 gear Sold it for my Grand Wagoneer project!

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