Bullnose Enthusiasts Forum

Issues With Big Blue!?!?!

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grumpin
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Re: Issues With Big Blue!?!?!

grumpin
Cruising down a smooth highway is nice with the long wheelbase.

Like you said the potholes and bumps will get you.
Dane
1986 F250HD SC XLT Lariat 4x4 460 C6-Sold
1992 Bronco XLT 4x4 351W E4OD
1998 GMC Sierra SLE K1500 350 4L60E
Arizona
Gary Lewis
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Re: Issues With Big Blue!?!?!

Gary Lewis
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Bill - Do you read lips?  

Grumpin - The 4wd HD 250's are the worst of all worlds.  I think I have the same spring pack in the rear that Bill does with his football field long DRW.  And up front I have maybe 1 1/2" of wheel travel before hitting the bump stop.  So the springs are STIFF!

I've wondered if adapting an F150's coil front suspension to the 4wd 250HD's TTB's wouldn't work, and use the same springs Bill has on Darth.  I mean, the axles and all look the same between Dad's truck and Big Blue, so why couldn't it have coil springs?
Gary, AKA "Gary fellow": Profile

Dad's: '81 F150 Ranger XLT 4x4: Down for restomod: Full-roller "stroked 351M" w/Trick Flow heads & intake, EEC-V SEFI/E4OD/3.50 gears w/Kevlar clutches
Blue: 2015 F150 Platinum 4x4 SuperCrew wearing Blue Jeans & sporting a 3.5L EB & Max Tow
Big Blue: 1985 F250HD 4x4: 460/ZF5/3.55's, D60 w/Ox locker & 10.25 Sterling/Trutrac, Blue Top & Borgeson, & EEC-V MAF/SEFI

Nothing Special
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Re: Issues With Big Blue!?!?!

Nothing Special
Gary Lewis wrote
....  I've wondered if adapting an F150's coil front suspension to the 4wd 250HD's TTB's wouldn't work, and use the same springs Bill has on Darth.  I mean, the axles and all look the same between Dad's truck and Big Blue, so why couldn't it have coil springs?
It certainly could.  But keep in mind that in addition to supporting the weight, the leaf springs also locate the outer end of the axle beam.  With coils you need to add radius arms.  Not undoable, but it does get a little more complicated.
Bob
Sorry, no '80 - '86 Ford trucks
"Oswald": 1997 F-250HD crew cab short box, 460, E4OD, 4.10 gears
"Pluto": 1971 Bronco, 302, NV3550 5 speed, Atlas 4.3:1 transfer case, 33" tires
"the motorhome": 2015 E-450-based 28' class C motorhome, 6.8L V-10
"the Dodge": 2007 Dodge 2500, 6.7L Cummins
grumpin
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Re: Issues With Big Blue!?!?!

grumpin
In reply to this post by Gary Lewis
Doesn't the 460 weigh 720 pounds?!
Dane
1986 F250HD SC XLT Lariat 4x4 460 C6-Sold
1992 Bronco XLT 4x4 351W E4OD
1998 GMC Sierra SLE K1500 350 4L60E
Arizona
85lebaront2
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Re: Issues With Big Blue!?!?!

85lebaront2
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More like 865 lbs dressed and filled. I will have to measure my axle to stop distance on Darth for the records. Every time I think about, maybe converting Darth to 4WD two things stop me (a) turning circle, the crew cabs have different front ends and the inside front wheel goes nearly 90° to the frame and (b) the additional height and weight needed for the 4WD components.
Bill AKA "LOBO" Profile

"Getting old is inevitable, growing up is optional" Darth Vader 1986 F350 460 converted to MAF/SEFI, E4OD 12X3 1/2 rear brakes, traction loc 3:55 gear, 160 amp 3G alternator Wife's 2011 Flex Limited Daily Driver 2009 Flex Limited with factory tow package Project car 1986 Chrysler LeBaron convertible 2.2L Turbo II, modified A413

Gary Lewis
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Re: Issues With Big Blue!?!?!

Gary Lewis
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In reply to this post by Nothing Special
Yep, I could add the radius arms pretty easily.  Make it like a 4wd F150 but use F350 springs.
Gary, AKA "Gary fellow": Profile

Dad's: '81 F150 Ranger XLT 4x4: Down for restomod: Full-roller "stroked 351M" w/Trick Flow heads & intake, EEC-V SEFI/E4OD/3.50 gears w/Kevlar clutches
Blue: 2015 F150 Platinum 4x4 SuperCrew wearing Blue Jeans & sporting a 3.5L EB & Max Tow
Big Blue: 1985 F250HD 4x4: 460/ZF5/3.55's, D60 w/Ox locker & 10.25 Sterling/Trutrac, Blue Top & Borgeson, & EEC-V MAF/SEFI

Nothing Special
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Re: Issues With Big Blue!?!?!

Nothing Special
Gary Lewis wrote
Yep, I could add the radius arms pretty easily.  Make it like a 4wd F150 but use F350 springs.
Or even 2WD F-250 springs?  I don't know what options there are, but just because a leaf sprung F-350 rides better than a leaf spring F-250 that doesn't mean that ALL F-350 springs are better riding than their F-250 counterparts.


And I've posted a link to this thread before, but it shows how far you can go and how good an '82 F-250 with TTB (and coil springs) can really handle the bumps

Which brings up another thought.  GoFastBroncos.com is another resource that might be helpful in converting a TTB F-250 to coils.  Yeah, it's not a Bronco, but that's where that F-250 link above comes from.  He went hog wild on his project, but others there might have tamer builds.
Bob
Sorry, no '80 - '86 Ford trucks
"Oswald": 1997 F-250HD crew cab short box, 460, E4OD, 4.10 gears
"Pluto": 1971 Bronco, 302, NV3550 5 speed, Atlas 4.3:1 transfer case, 33" tires
"the motorhome": 2015 E-450-based 28' class C motorhome, 6.8L V-10
"the Dodge": 2007 Dodge 2500, 6.7L Cummins
salans7
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Re: Issues With Big Blue!?!?!

salans7
In reply to this post by Gary Lewis
Gary Lewis wrote
I've wondered if adapting an F150's coil front suspension to the 4wd 250HD's TTB's wouldn't work, and use the same springs Bill has on Darth.  I mean, the axles and all look the same between Dad's truck and Big Blue, so why couldn't it have coil springs?
I know a guy with radius arm mounts from an F250 if you want to experiment....
Gary Lewis
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Re: Issues With Big Blue!?!?!

Gary Lewis
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In reply to this post by Nothing Special
Bob - That's an interesting read.  Looks like the F150's TTB's and coil springs worked exceedingly well.  

Shaun - The radius arm mounts from an F250 would, I assume, bolt onto any F250 frame.  Right?  If so, the
question becomes whether the radius arms will bolt to the F250 TTB's.  Then the next question would be if the 2WD LD F250's coil spring mounts could be bolted on.  Hmmmm.....

So that brings up the question of the cross member.  Front what I see the 460's and diesels were only available in 250HD's and 350's with leaf springs, and a cross member for a leaf spring truck is quite different than one with coil springs as the TTB's pivot off the cross member.  Right?

But, Bill's F350 has coil spring and presumably swing arms.  Could that cross member be used?
Gary, AKA "Gary fellow": Profile

Dad's: '81 F150 Ranger XLT 4x4: Down for restomod: Full-roller "stroked 351M" w/Trick Flow heads & intake, EEC-V SEFI/E4OD/3.50 gears w/Kevlar clutches
Blue: 2015 F150 Platinum 4x4 SuperCrew wearing Blue Jeans & sporting a 3.5L EB & Max Tow
Big Blue: 1985 F250HD 4x4: 460/ZF5/3.55's, D60 w/Ox locker & 10.25 Sterling/Trutrac, Blue Top & Borgeson, & EEC-V MAF/SEFI

salans7
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Re: Issues With Big Blue!?!?!

salans7
Gary Lewis wrote
Shaun - The radius arm mounts from an F250 would, I assume, bolt onto any F250 frame.  Right?  If so, the
question becomes whether the radius arms will bolt to the F250 TTB's.  Then the next question would be if the 2WD LD F250's coil spring mounts could be bolted on.  Hmmmm.....
The quick answer is no. The holes are all different and basically nothing bolts on. You would have to drill most of the holes yourself, which is the predicament I will be in once I pull the trigger on the Sky kit.
Gary Lewis
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Re: Issues With Big Blue!?!?!

Gary Lewis
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I don't mind drilling holes.  But there are other issues to puzzle through, like the cross member.  It is all well and good to do the conversion on a truck with any other engine, but with a 460 or diesel?
Gary, AKA "Gary fellow": Profile

Dad's: '81 F150 Ranger XLT 4x4: Down for restomod: Full-roller "stroked 351M" w/Trick Flow heads & intake, EEC-V SEFI/E4OD/3.50 gears w/Kevlar clutches
Blue: 2015 F150 Platinum 4x4 SuperCrew wearing Blue Jeans & sporting a 3.5L EB & Max Tow
Big Blue: 1985 F250HD 4x4: 460/ZF5/3.55's, D60 w/Ox locker & 10.25 Sterling/Trutrac, Blue Top & Borgeson, & EEC-V MAF/SEFI

salans7
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Re: Issues With Big Blue!?!?!

salans7
There were plenty of 4x2 Diesel and 460 trucks running coil sprung TIB front suspension, so that should be irrelevant. You just need coils from an F350. The real dilemma would be the coil/shock tower thickness, as well as the radius arm mounts. We all know that the frames increase in thickness the higher the GVWR, so does that apply to the suspension mounting brackets as well? My coil/shock towers were clearly stamped with an F25 on the both, which makes me wonder if there is a difference in thickness with those as well?
salans7
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Re: Issues With Big Blue!?!?!

salans7
Also, check out the below link, this company already produces a kit that does what you describe. Maybe you can get some pointers?

Dana 50 TTB Coil Swap Kit
Gary Lewis
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Re: Issues With Big Blue!?!?!

Gary Lewis
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Shaun - That's an interesting find.  But, it is expensive!

It says it includes:

Dana 50 TTB Cut N’ Turned and Modified to accept Radius Arm ($350 core charge included in price – read more)
1.25″ Heimed Extended Radius Arms with Pivot Brackets and Hardware
Coil Buckets
4″ Coils
Bilstein 5100 Front Shocks (1 pr)
Alignment Cams
3-Piece Extended Brake Line Kit

I'm going to have to study BB's TTB's vs those on Dad's truck to see if I can understand what would be needed to attach radius arms to the 250 TTB's.
Gary, AKA "Gary fellow": Profile

Dad's: '81 F150 Ranger XLT 4x4: Down for restomod: Full-roller "stroked 351M" w/Trick Flow heads & intake, EEC-V SEFI/E4OD/3.50 gears w/Kevlar clutches
Blue: 2015 F150 Platinum 4x4 SuperCrew wearing Blue Jeans & sporting a 3.5L EB & Max Tow
Big Blue: 1985 F250HD 4x4: 460/ZF5/3.55's, D60 w/Ox locker & 10.25 Sterling/Trutrac, Blue Top & Borgeson, & EEC-V MAF/SEFI

Gary Lewis
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Re: Issues With Big Blue!?!?!

Gary Lewis
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Well, the postman dropped the 1990-99 MPC text section off this morning.  Unfortunately it is only the back end of the text section, meaning the soft trim and exterior moulding part, so it doesn't have the cross member info.  

Not sure what the path forward is now.  
Gary, AKA "Gary fellow": Profile

Dad's: '81 F150 Ranger XLT 4x4: Down for restomod: Full-roller "stroked 351M" w/Trick Flow heads & intake, EEC-V SEFI/E4OD/3.50 gears w/Kevlar clutches
Blue: 2015 F150 Platinum 4x4 SuperCrew wearing Blue Jeans & sporting a 3.5L EB & Max Tow
Big Blue: 1985 F250HD 4x4: 460/ZF5/3.55's, D60 w/Ox locker & 10.25 Sterling/Trutrac, Blue Top & Borgeson, & EEC-V MAF/SEFI

salans7
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Re: Issues With Big Blue!?!?!

salans7
Well that's a bummer.

Gary Lewis
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Gary Lewis
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The advert said "1990-1999 FORD TRUCK MASTER PARTS TEXT CATALOG LIGHT TRUCK PICKUP VAN".  But this book isn't nearly all of the "text" portion of the MPC.  In fact, I think it may be less than 30% of the catalog.

So I sent the vendor a message that the product wasn't as advertised and I want to return it.  We shall see.

But in the interim, I'm at a loss as to how to find out which trucks have the right cross member.
Gary, AKA "Gary fellow": Profile

Dad's: '81 F150 Ranger XLT 4x4: Down for restomod: Full-roller "stroked 351M" w/Trick Flow heads & intake, EEC-V SEFI/E4OD/3.50 gears w/Kevlar clutches
Blue: 2015 F150 Platinum 4x4 SuperCrew wearing Blue Jeans & sporting a 3.5L EB & Max Tow
Big Blue: 1985 F250HD 4x4: 460/ZF5/3.55's, D60 w/Ox locker & 10.25 Sterling/Trutrac, Blue Top & Borgeson, & EEC-V MAF/SEFI

salans7
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Re: Issues With Big Blue!?!?!

salans7
That happened to me when I tried to buy a 1980 EVTM. It was only a foldout diagram for Econolines, but was advertised as being a book for F-Series trucks. Seller admitted he sent the wrong thing, but I didn't trust him at this point so I requested a refund and he thankfully accepted.
Gary Lewis
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Gary Lewis
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He's responded that he will take it back, so I'll get it boxed up and off.

And, here's the status of my searching to this point for the cross member and D60+suspension:

I've found the cross member for $50 at a fairly local salvage, and she (Kathy) thinks they can cut the frame right behind the cross member and give me that so I can remove it carefully.  But, it is in a WET area right now and we are to get more rain soon, so it'll be a while before they can get in there.  Plus, it's been there for several years so isn't going away any time soon.

And, while they don't have the '86-'97 D60 & suspension bits I'm looking for, they do have a '05 F350 SuperDuty w/a D60.  However, it is my understanding that that's going to have the different bolt pattern, so my wheels won't fit.  And, the rear axle is gone, so I couldn't swap if I wanted to, so that's not really an option.  But, there are the springs.....

I found a salvage about 3 1/2 hours away that has a 3.54 D60 axle, but it doesn't have the suspension bits.  However, they also have an '88 F350 w/a 4.10 D60.  And, since it was a 460 truck it'll have the right cross member.  So, I've asked if they can cut the frame behind the cross member and give me the front section, but swap axles.  That would give me all the bits for the suspension as well as the cross member in one package.

They were to have called back a few hours ago, so I'm not sure that's going to work out.  

Anyway, I have a cross member available and may have found the whole shooting match.  But, when doing this would there be an advantage in getting the SuperDuty springs?
Gary, AKA "Gary fellow": Profile

Dad's: '81 F150 Ranger XLT 4x4: Down for restomod: Full-roller "stroked 351M" w/Trick Flow heads & intake, EEC-V SEFI/E4OD/3.50 gears w/Kevlar clutches
Blue: 2015 F150 Platinum 4x4 SuperCrew wearing Blue Jeans & sporting a 3.5L EB & Max Tow
Big Blue: 1985 F250HD 4x4: 460/ZF5/3.55's, D60 w/Ox locker & 10.25 Sterling/Trutrac, Blue Top & Borgeson, & EEC-V MAF/SEFI

ArdWrknTrk
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Re: Issues With Big Blue!?!?!

ArdWrknTrk
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Superduty springs are just a plusher ride than regular F-350 with a RSK.

You should find someone with a RSK F-350 regular cab long bed and ask them to take you for a ride.
See how you feel about it v/s Big Blue.

Maybe you will feel the 350 RSK is nice enough without the SD springs.
 Jim,
Lil'Red is a '87 F250 HD, 4.10's, 1356 4x4, Zf-5, 3G, PMGR, Saginaw PS, desmogged with a Holley 80508 and Performer intake.
Too much other stuff to mention.
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