Lugging at speed/No power at WOT

Before rebuilding the engine, assuming that a leak-down test suggests that's needed, I wonder about slipping in a DS-II dizzy and harness, coil, and box.  That would bypass the ECU and determine if that's the problem.

Or, maybe just run the initial timing up to as far advanced as it'll idle with, leave the timing locked w/the SPOUT, and take it for a drive.

Missed this.

Moving from 10 BTDC and 30 BTDC would change the idle, right? My comment was to indicate that the ECU was indeed changing the timing. When I bought the truck, the timing was over-advanced like it was adjusted to "good" idle (~30BTDC) with SPOUT disconnected, not the 10BTDC specified. Not sure if such may have burnt something up...

----

Due to my ranger blowing a brake line during a pre-trip oil change, I had the fun task of driving this truck for a 1460 mile drive across the midwest... From my home in Madison, IN, to a friend in Salem, MO, to Manhattan, KS (Brother inlaw graduating from Kansas State), and then back home, partially though a snowstorm.

She struggled on the way home. Ran into issues with the alternator belt slipping to the point of the battery going dead (had to  attempt to tighten it up, get a jump, and then balance my electrical loads to stop the squeal). Had issues with intermittent misfiring under low-RPM torque loads- cylinder 1 suspected- pulled the plug at one fuel stop to see if it was the problem, but dropped the plug in the motor mount where i couldn't get to it. Good thing I had the box of four extra plugs with me in the cab. I also suspect that my exhaust issues got worse because I'm hearing more exhast noise, but since it's only on a couple cylinders (from the sound), I'm hoping I didn't crack the manifold. Once I escaped snowpalcaplse, it got better... but due to lots of interstate hills and an engine that won't provide stable torque, I was constantly shifting in and out of overdrive.

Based on this, I'm thinking something is mechanically toast since the misfire is only one one cylinder, and is torque related (all my compression blowing by rather than pushing the engine forward)... So much so, perhaps a short or long block may be a safer bet since I don't know what I'll find and machine shop fees add up. Dunno. Would be a later winter/spring project no matter what I do. Need to get a proper engine stand/hoist first.  

The ignition timing changing would definitely change the idle speed, that's why you always have to adjust curb idle after reconnecting the vacuum line with a DuraSpark setup.
Same same with spout on EEC-X, I'd assume.

I would do a leakdown test and see why that one cylinder seems to be acting up.

What's up with the alternator being so heavily loaded?
Or is it just a glazed belt?

At least you got snow!
I had a half inch of ice on my truck..

Will do a leakdown the next time I have compressed air access with the truck (Xmas?)

I can't get the belt tight enough. Too much deflection. Belt probably isn't too good from slipping (was replaced right after I bought it, the old one was tattered) No provisions to attach a serpentine belt tool (breaker bar) like on the AC and PS... and levering it with a bar helped but not enough to matter. Is there some deep secret to tensioning the alternator?

I drove through ice too. Going through eastern MO on Monday was snow, which changed to freezing rain/sleet in western IL (on I-64), which became rain from Mt. Vernon onward. At least I put fresh tires on the back (didn't trust my racing baldini's on a long winter trip). I agree, 1/2" of ice is indeed worse... :(

Well, that isn't right, the belt shouldn't be slipping.

And you shouldn't tighten too much, it will kill the bearings.

Belts are cheap.
Get a good one. Gates or Dayco.
Sand the sheave clean while you have it off.

Dad had a trick to make v-belts quit slipping.  He laid a round file or rasp in the sheave and hit it with a mallet.  Turned the sheave and did it again, until there were serrations all the way around.  Probably didn't help the belts live a long and happy life, but they didn't dare squeal after that.  

Probably didn't help the races of the alternator bearings either, getting their balls smashed like that.

But that's why I said use sandpaper, to give it some tooth.

I think I'd suggested sand blasting yours in the cabinet, Gary.

Ratdude says too much deflection, so maybe he needs a 1/2" shorter belt?

No, it probably didn't help the bearings.  But I'm not sure which was worse - that or over-tightening the belt.

As for blasting, the media I'm currently using is so fine that it wouldn't leave much tooth.

I think it was in one of the 3G threads regarding chirp.

Yes, I know you're not running black beauty, or stone dust like we use in a 100# pressure pot to clean stone.

At any rate, too much deflection can't equal too tight.
So, my mistake.  
He's asking for a better way to tension it..

Im sorry if this has already been discussed and eliminated as a possible source of the problem but I read that the stalling occurs when cold.
My transmission is a little tired and when I push the truck up a hill when the trans hasnt warmed up it will stall and die.
Does your trans slip at all while driving?

While he doesn't have a C6 like you, the AOD is very touchy with the adjustment.

If it's set up wrong it will try to be in two gears at once.

I don't think either of these have a true lockup converter.
But I see what you're getting at with sluggish shifts when cold, and a lot of drag

Gary Lewis wrote

And speaking of rebuilding it, someone on here has to try Scotty The Mad Porter's 300 build.  He's one of the premier gurus on the 460, but he says he does a mean 300 as well.  

I will just so happen to have a spare

Go for it!  And make sure you let him know you are coming from here. He’s a member, but probably won’t see this.

AOD, and nope, no slipping as far as I know. The TC lockup does work, too.

Got a compressor for Christmas, so I was finally able to do a leak-down. And.... Yep, Cyl 1 is leaking into the oil. Looks like I get to pull an engine some time soon.

I bought an engine stand for cheap today ($25), but it needs work before I dare use it (the mount shaft is way too small for the rest of the stand, need to get/make an adapter bushing). Still need to get a hoist.

Question: what is the best option here: short block, long block, or rebuild what I have (or pull it and tear down, to see what sort of shape cylinders are in)? I've never built an engine for real (I did rebuild a moped engine, but that was a 100cc DOHC single cylinder thing), but I also wouldn't mind learning to do so (I know mostly what needs to happen, I just haven't done it myself before). I assume this is worth fixing; the body might be dented and the interior trashed, but she's mostly devoid of bad rust (some surface rust, bed floor is nasty), and other than a bad tie-rod end (which is why she's parked at the moment), everything else mechanically is good.

Before you divulge into those kinds of questions, you have to answer these for yourself first.

1. Is this your primary vehicle and do you need to be able to commute with it?

2. How much money are you looking to spend, realistically? Think about this one long and hard, because this can be the difference between having it back on the road in a week and it being 5 years. What is your goal.



If I were you, since you've never done an engine before, I would pull the one in it and throw it on the stand for now and find yourself a suitable used replacement and drop it in and drive it. Then, you can enjoy the truck while learning to rebuild an engine without having a truck just sitting around waiting for a heart. That's how projects that never end start, and the next thing you'll know in 2 years you'll still be sitting here with a half torn down engine and a truck that doesn't move.

Angelo Voltura wrote

Before you divulge into those kinds of questions, you have to answer these for yourself first.

1. Is this your primary vehicle and do you need to be able to commute with it?

2. How much money are you looking to spend, realistically? Think about this one long and hard, because this can be the difference between having it back on the road in a week and it being 5 years. What is your goal.



If I were you, since you've never done an engine before, I would pull the one in it and throw it on the stand for now and find yourself a suitable used replacement and drop it in and drive it. Then, you can enjoy the truck while learning to rebuild an engine without having a truck just sitting around waiting for a heart. That's how projects that never end start, and the next thing you'll know in 2 years you'll still be sitting here with a half torn down engine and a truck that doesn't move.

True and only will know how to go with it.
If you are close to GA I might know of a 300 that came from a truck that was wrecked, don't know what he wants for it.
Trying to find a good used one can be hard to come by. I was lucky and found both my project truck and parts truck, less motor and some other parts, on Craig's List at the same time.
Good luck on your hunt.
Dave ----

Angelo speaks truth.  You could easily be w/o the vehicle for a long time as you work on the engine.  So a used engine might be a good alternative in the interim.

As for working on it, I've come to the conclusion that I'm going to farm the bulk of engine building out.  On the engine for Dad's truck I spent months awaiting the machine work to get done.  Months.  And then it wasn't done correctly.  I finally sent it to Tim Meyer to fix the mistakes and then assemble and test it.  Had I not had Tim check it out I'd have had an engine that didn't have the appropriate oil pressure.

Then there's the engine the previous owner had built for Big Blue.  It took four years for him to get it back from the machine shop and when he did it leaked oil everywhere.  Not only didn't it have valve cover gaskets, there were other significant mistakes.  And on top of that, I'm convinced that they sold him a worn out engine from the salvage.

So in future I'll be buying either a complete engine or at least a short block from a reputable source.  On Big Blue's replacement engine I bought a short block from Scott Johnson, aka Scotty The Mad Porter.  But, if I'd not already had the heads done locally I'd have bought a long block instead.  In fact, I probably would have had him break the engine in on the dyno before shipping it to me.

But we are talking about big money.  An engine is going to run an absolute minimum of $2k if you do a lot of the work, and probably more like $4k or more.

Gary, I got my 460 long block for $1,600 delivered, with a three year warranty.

That was March 2008
I beat that thing every day (No joke) and it's still hauling loads or going 100 without breaking a sweat.

I can't see something with 3/4 the cylinders and only one head costing that much.

IIRC RockAuto has long blocks (before shipping) at just over 1K. Budget wise, dunno. $2k tops. I'm not looking to build farm truck or bigfoot here (although Blown 640 would be nice ).


To answer the question: The truck isn't "needed"... I have my 1995 ranger back on the road (albeit with a questionable radiator, but that's an easy fix), and there's always my wife's 2002 escape if I really get up the creek. Being out for a while isn't an issue... Ideal? No. But not a deal breaker.