Larry the Lariat - My 86 F150 4x4

Hi. It may not be correct conserning your balancer but on mine the timing marks are on the thin edge of the balancer.
Stein

I have used a flashlight to help me find the timing marks.

I find the marks with the flashlight then hit it with the timing light, I could faintly see the flash, then move the flashlight away.

I seem to remember my old 86 was hard to find.

ArdWrknTrk wrote

You can say that, but most Fords were set up that way, they just had a vacuum restriction in the hose going to the distributor after the thermal vacuum switch.

If you still have your colored plastic vacuum lines you can tell that red is manifold vacuum. (yellow is switched, green is EGR, or emissions, white is timed, etc..)

This is mostly down to how a factory vacuum canister is sprung and how resilient the vacuum diaphragm is.

Getting a truly stuck distributor to turn is not fir the faint hearted.
With a V8 you can pour a pool of oil around the base and start with a torch, strap wrench, moving to a pipe wrench.

There used to be fork or claw like attachments you put on a big slide hammer that would (in theory) jerk an obstinate distributor straight out the hole without working it back and forth.
But of course the objective is to turn the distributor and set the timing.

So the manifold vacuum may be correct then?  I found the diagram I posted while just trying to learn which port was which and thought I was onto something that might explain things.

I’m not sure yet how I’m gonna get that distributer loose. I’m completely a “noob” in this realm. Hopefully I succeed without destroying it. 😜

firefire wrote

Hi. It may not be correct conserning your balancer but on mine the timing marks are on the thin edge of the balancer.
Stein

I’ll have to take a better look then. That mark I was looking at was the only one I saw, but I hope you are correct because I never could see the mark with the timing light. I probably need to pull plug 1 and check for top dead center instead of guessing like I’m apparently doing. Thanks!

I'm afraid I've missed the vacuum routing diagram you posted.
Or did you mean the little photo of a carb on the last page?
If you don't have one on the radiator support perhaps someone else with a similar 351 (Machspeed/John) can post a pic of his????

You're doing a great job!

The dissimilar metals of iron block and aluminum distributor housing cause corrosion.
When the white crusties form, or the O-ring shaft seal lets oil cook in around the column it can become really, REALLY tight.
The fortunate part is that DuraSpark II unlike points distributors don't have parts rubbing that need adjusting.
They are pretty much set it and forget it until the shaft bushings wear out.

Hi.
The markings on the balanser are beaten into the metal so they should be visible. Clean away all dirt and if it is rusted try to polish the flats with fine sanding paper. Then you should see the markings.  On mine the distributer was connected to ported vacuum. On page 4 in my thread ,Fixing Eddie,  you will find my vacuum diagram and more.
I ended up with throwing that old and complicated carburetor out of the engine bay..

I pulled the AC Compressor loose from it's mounting brackets last night, which allowed me to get much better access down to the distributer. I took the opportunity to replace the rubber hose going from the hard line too the carb, eliminating a plastic filter I had added and then become a bit afraid of... Figure I no longer need it here since nearly EVERYTHING is new in the fuel system, including a new Wix filter I can replace via quick connect fittings on the frame rail. The distributer turns easy now. Not sure why since I did ask this just to make it easier to get it unstuck. There was a lot of dirt at the base from dirt dobbers that I cleaned off. Maybe that was all that was making it stick? I dunno. Never had to use penetrating oil, it just turned for me no problem. It got dark on me last night, so today I'll be trying to find the REAL timing marks and hopefully get initial timing setup right. The compressor is back in place now. I had to loosen the bolts holding the front bracket in place to get the compressor Beck between the front and rear brackets but then it was easy to bolt back together.

Super easy to see the timing marks once I found and marked the real ones!

Big hole in the side of the harmonic balancer real close to 10 BTDC makes it easy to find. Long line at 10, half line at 0. Silver sharpie. Black sharpie everywhere else to make it easy to see. Works great like that!

My Bosch timing light has digital advance so I can set any other timings I'm looking for so long as I remember which line I'm watching.



Anti-shock distributer turner, patent pending 😂


I shouldn't need that. New wires and cap, so hopefully no shock potential but I'm a wimp when it comes to getting shocked. LOL

I got the timing to 10 BTDC with the vacuum advance disconnected and the manifold vacuum port it had been on capped. Went ahead and tightened it back down. I connected vacuum advance to ported vacuum and adjusted the idle up so it was sitting on 650rpm at idle. That brought ported vacuum up to about 2 inches at idle which I didn't like. Checked timing and I was at about 8 BTDC (edit, math error, I was actually at 12 BTDC) with vacuum advance on ported vacuum. I'm not sure if that little bit of vacuum would be enough to affect timing 2 degrees but I figured I'd see how things adjusted (this is all a learning experience for me). I reset the idle mixture screws to 1.5 turns out, moved my vacuum gauge to manifold vacuum and I was at about 17 inches before I started making adjustments. Kept turning it in 1/4 at a time, then 1/8 at a time watching vacuum keep going up. Turned it back in 1 1/4 (so both screws just 1/4 out) and never saw vacuum drop off any. It got to about 19-20 inches after 3/4 in, and just stayed there. Maybe my 2 inches of vacuum at idle on ported is throwing things off? I know my gauge is the best because I got it at Hobo Freight! 😂 Knowing how rich I was running before, I let it idle a while there. When I'd put it in drive, RPM's would be 630-680, and would settle towards the 650 that the sticker says it should be at. Here's how it's running now... What do y'all think? Edit: Realized I was looking at cm Hg instead of in Hg on the gauge so I just changed the numbers to reflect 'Murica! 😂 Told you I was new at this!

I read the mail and couldn't understand what scale you were looking at....

If you can see 29" hg you're in space or inside an electron microscope. 😉

ArdWrknTrk wrote

I read the mail and couldn't understand what scale you were looking at....

If you can see 29" hg you're in space or inside an electron microscope. 😉

LOL... Today I learned two things:
1. Big difference between centimeters Hg and inches Hg.
2. You can get email notifications of new posts on these discussions, so my pre-edit posts are saved for posterity. 😂

BTW: I think I did figure out why the inches of Mercury stopped changing as I turned in those screws. I didn't have the hose shoved on the vacuum gauge all the way, and eventually got high enough vacuum that the connection became a leak. Figured that out after hooking these two guys up and noticing I couldn't get past 20 inches no matter how much I pumped. Shoved the hose further on and that was solved.



I'll have to try those adjustments again now that I've learned to use my tools. 😂

Speaking of tools, I need to find a good skinny offset screwdriver to adjust the screw on the driver's side since I can't get a straight shot at it unless I rev up the engine, so I made this out of some scrap metal.

Ported vacuum is no vacuum at idle. If you have vacuum at idle at the ported vacuum outlet your idle adjustment screw is adjusted to high. You are starting to open the throttle blades.. You shall only have vacuum at ported vacuum when you give throttle. Opening the throttle blades . And when vacuum affects your vacuum advance you should have more timing advance. Not less. Something does not make sense 🤔. Good luck further..

firefire wrote

Ported vacuum is no vacuum at idle. If you have vacuum at idle at the ported vacuum outlet your idle adjustment screw is adjusted to high. You are starting to open the throttle blades.. You shall only have vacuum at ported vacuum when you give throttle. Opening the throttle blades .

I started with the idle adjustment screw adjusted so I had ported vacuum at zero but my RPMs were too low so I adjusted it to get the RPM up to 650 which resulted in non-0 vacuum at idle. As I got further into tuning I was able to bring it back down some but never put the vacuum gauge back on ported to see where it ended up. I may pick up a second gauge so I can keep one on each rather than having to switch back and forth.

firefire wrote

And when vacuum affects your vacuum advance you should have more timing advance. Not less. Something does not make sense 🤔. Good luck further..

Thanks for pointing that out, and you are absolutely correct. And now that I’m thinking it through, replaying what I was seeing with the light, and thinking through what I was seeing, I realize now I got the math wrong in my head. It was in fact adding advance, not subtracting. So where I stated I was at 8 inches, I was actually at 12 inches. And that makes WAY more sense!

Of course, such realizations keep happening at 1:30am Monday morning, rather than 1:30pm Saturday afternoon, when I’d be able to go try again and verify my brain isn’t turned around. 😂 Sometimes I feel like a broken clock…I may be off most of the time, but at least I’m right twice a day!  

Been too long since I've posted...

My son and I decided to take Larry for a ride last weekend. Got on the road and it died as soon as I feed it gas. 😖 Then it wouldn't start. And there was traffic. 😂 Thankfully just a country road, but I bet 15 cars had to go around in the short time we were blocking the lane.

Guy pulled off and waved traffic around for us. I got the hood up and finally realized the choke was wider open even though the engine wasn't fully warm. Held my hands over the carb as a manual choke and had my son hit the key. Started right up so I backed it back onto our drive.

Let it warm up and drove it all over our yard.

I think it's just the choke opening too fast but not sure. Did I mention I'm new at this? LOL. Had the opposite problem on my 70 240 with YFA. Carb would shut as soon as the engine was shutoff no matter how hot it was, so you'd have to force it open to start the truck unless it cooked down first.

Also keep having to charge the battery. Not sure if it's a weak battery, bad alternator, or just that I'm cranking it a lot while messing with it. Hopefully either 1 or 3. 🙂

Yes, the choke opening too fast could do that.  But be careful holding your hands over the carb as a backfire could cause a serious injury.  I'd use the choke linkage on the side of the carb to manipulate the choke instead.

Hopefully all the cranking is what drained the battery, but you can see if there's something that's on by pulling the positive battery cable and placing a test light between the post and the cable.  An incandescent test light shouldn't light, although an LED light probably would.

Well I think I found my issues.  After adjusting the choke, which was needed (it was popping wide open as soon as the engine was started, hence not starting again if it died), the engine was still dying if you mashed the gas. It finally occurred to me to check the accelerator pump linkage, and it had a TON of play in it, so the accelerator pump wasn't able to do its job on sudden acceleration.

Two 3/8" wrenches and five minutes later, I can get on the panel and the 351w just roars!

So I was then ready to take it for a yard drive to be sure before going on the road. Backed it from its spot, then put it on drive, and it died. Wouldn't crank. Finally got it to fire if I fed it through the carb but it would die as soon as I stopped feeding the carb.

Solved another problem... Gas gauge ain't broke...I was out of gas!  😂😂😂 Amazing timing. 🙄

I thought there was plenty...I had put probably 6-8 gallons in from cans, and had only actually driven a few miles. But I had gas pouring out when the old fuel line was bad, and I've ran it a LOT on the driveway. Didn't realize I'd ran it that much!  I suspect I lost several GALLONS to that leak I had. Sure stained the driveway. 😖 Last month is assumed the gas gauge was bad since it showed empty. Maybe, or maybe it was almost empty!

Rainstorms (that we've DESPERATELY needed) kept me away this evening, but I'll plan to gas it up and hopefully be ready to take it for a spin this week.

Progress!!!!  

You be on the road soon. 🤞

Been a while since I've posted. Larry's running pretty decent around the yard. I need to get him out on the road again.

Put him to work on yard duty this morning. About time he starts earning his keep!

Wow!  It looks like he IS earning his keep.  But I'll bet he'd like to stretch his legs a bit.  

Here's something I need to figure out. Parking brake likes to pop back off when I set it, often repeatedly. Sometimes it will set, only to pop off later. Being in Tennessee, parking on hills is the norm, so I'll need to solve this. Shortly after it finally set, I opened the door and it popped off again. 😖