Gary Lewis

Yes, it is scary that these systems are so delicate. But it is easy to see why they are proprietary in their connections. They don’t want you to be mucking about with them - for good reason. Anyway, I got the relays and project boxes on order tonight. Hopefully I’ll order the cameras tomorrow.

Welcome! Where’s home? We have a map (Bullnose Forum/Member’s Map in the menu) and can add you with a city/state or zip.

Sounds like a good group of people to be close to.

I don't know that I need to switch ground. I measured the black wire back towards the mirror with power off and got 8 ohms. And measured it towards the camera, before blowing it up, and got 2 ohms. So I think I'll be fine taking the black wire from the camera to ground permanently. But I'd actually suggested switch both power and ground to Pormido and it was that arrangement the engineer approved. So I've been wondering, aloud mostly. But, as said, it worked taken to ground, although it altered the currents. I'm guessing that the "drain" wire was being used as ground and by creating a better ground that current came over to the black wire. And yes, it is a shame they didn't have a better clamp. But it is my fault. However, I'm going back with the same camera. It will work and they are "only" $50 each.

So, how far is it home? How far do you have to go to get the things you forgot to take? I ask because I considered a shop some distance from our house, and have often wondered how that would have worked out.

Welcome! Glad you joined. But you mean you bought an '84 not a '94, right? That's what your signature says but not your post. Anyway, show us some pics! Where's home? I ask because we have a map (Bullnose Forum/Member's Map in the menu) and can add you if we have a city/state or zip.

Did some more testing today by cutting the red and black wires in the cable to the rear camera. Here are some notes: If you disconnect the black wire while the system is powered up you have to power it down to get the rear camera's output back on the screen. But if you disconnect the red wire while the system is powered up the view comes back on as soon as you reconnect the red wire. The red wire is carrying 258 ma from the mirror to the camera, but the black wire is carrying 156 ma from the camera to the mirror. IOW, it is a ground. If you connect the black wire directly to ground the system boots up perfectly. But the black wire is then carrying 189 ma. However, with that connection the red wire is only carrying 232 ma. IOW, the black wire is up 33 ma and the red wire is down 26 ma. And now for the bad news. I realized that while I'd tried grounding the black wire from the rear camera instead of connecting it to the mirror's black wire I hadn't tried taking the red wire from the rear camera to power. So I did - to 12v instead of 5v. And I blew the rear camera up. Dead. The smell, if not the smoke, came out. But the mirror and the front camera still work. So hopefully the input to the mirror from the rear camera is good as well. Anyway, I'm wondering if I should use a DP relay and switch both the ground and the power to the camera. I checked and with the system and camera off but always-hot power supplied to the mirror there's a few ma of current for several seconds, like a capacitor bleeding off, but it soon goes to zero. Thoughts?

Yes, I see what you mean about insulation not being very effective. But the foam might provide some strength, although there may be easier ways to do that, like with a thin sheet of plywood. And no OSB! Man, that is a problem waiting to happen. Sounds like you can significantly improve the integrity and the usefulness of the camper by just a bit a reasonable thinking. Access doors that seal to ahead of the wheel arches would be a big improvement. As for going quiet, be careful - we've been known to send the local constabulary out to investigate when a regular goes AWOL.

I do have a small crimper and can easily put ferrules on the leads. But I like solder connections better than screw terminals. As for the power supply for the Pormido mirror & cameras, it is named Hardwire Kit for PR996,PR998,D50 and the output is rated at 5V & 3.0A. It is a pretty fancy unit as it has cut-off voltages of 11.3V, 11.8V or 12.1V. In other words, when your battery voltage gets to the preset it'll turn the mirror off. That's for when you set the mirror up for constant recording while parked, during which it'll be pulling ~650 ma. However, with the relay module pulling another 100 ma (90 for the relay and another 10 for the opto coupler?), I won't be leaving it in that mode very often. Anyway, at 3 amps for the power supply we should be good.

Fingers and toes crossed!

Bummer! Sorry about that.

I understand biting off as much as one can chew. I seem to always have a mouth full. But stripping the camper sounds like a big task. Have you thought about spraying the framing with foam insulation after you put the exterior siding on but before you put the interior paneling on? That might give it a bit more strength and even more insulation. On the winch, I like that tray. And there is plenty of room under there to mount it. But I agree with you, some reinforcement seems appropriate. But you might consider buying a small welder. It would sure be handy to be able to put things in place and at least tack them, if not do all the welding yourself. Also, I'm thinking someone on here put a winch behind the stock bumper, but I didn't find it in a search I did. Perhaps you can as it might save you a bit of trouble. But it worked out nicely from what I remember. And I think he put the fairlead in the spot for the front tag. As for chiming in on my project, I understand. But I got word back from the manufacturer that my relay idea will work. So now I'm searching for the right "relay", and if you have any guidance I'd appreciate it, here.

Well, we are on a roll!!!! Got this back from Melissa at Pormido: In addition she sent new firmware that allows zooming the rear camera. Not sure I need that, but why not? I must say that I highly recommend Pormido for a company to work with on things like this. I've lost track of the number of messages Melissa and I've traded, but it must be around 70. She's always been quick to respond and both courteous and helpful. And the timing is working out well. Our kids get here on Wednesday and we'll have company until January 5th. So no mirror/camera work will get done during that time. But I will get the 2nd camera on order and should easily have it by the 5th. Also I have to order a relay. That's 'cause all of this works at 5v and the Bosch relays don't always pull in at that voltage. And I'm thinking about this HiLetgo 2pcs 5V One Channel Relay Module Relay Switch with OPTO Isolation. As it says it used an opto isolator so there's no chance of hurting the mirror from back EMF. But the downside is that I probably ought to put it in a small box. Anyone have a better idea?

Yippee! I'm glad it is all starting to come together. But that is a bummer on the floors. Sure glad the guy took responsibility for his actions. That is probably an expensive process to hire done. You'll have to post a pic of the hinge for the door. Better yet, maybe your friend will share the file?

How would you feel about drilling an actual hole through the spot you just tried to polish? I'm wondering if you could epoxy or hot-melt a 1" acrylic disc behind there. You'd have a perfectly clear view then. You can get discs like this at hobby/craft stores and online (Amazon/Ebay). I use them for all kinds of things and it occurs to me they might help here? This may help or hurt, but thinking through Pormido telling you that you can't use the rear on the front made me think of another camera install I did on my camper. It had 5 wires that may line up with some of your mysteries. Three were what you already know, power, ground, and video. The other two were an additional power line and a "mirror" line. So the thing is, all these cameras follow basically the same signal standards, so don't take my advice as gospel but I bet you won't blow your mirror hooking it up. What made rear-view cameras special was two things: 1. They typically were "turned on" by going into reverse. This was not done by a signal from the driver's area, to minimize wiring requirements. Instead, they were hooked to the back-up light and when they start producing a video signal, THAT tells the mirror to start displaying the feed. Sort of an "auto on" feature. But a lot of these cameras, they didn't want to draw main power from that back-up light so they provided an extra "real power" input. The back-up light line was just sort of the "on switch". If you read reviews on things like this https://www.amazon.com/NATIKA-Backup-Camera-Waterproof-Reverse/dp/B07H852D49?th=1 you'll see comments like "current draw from camera turning on has blown 2 backup lamps" that plagued cheaper units that lacked this option. The other wire is "almost" certainly a "mirror" function, usually you'd tie it to +12V or GND (and I have no idea which) to "flip" the image on your camera. I wonder if this is why Pormido thinks you can't use the rear camera on the front - they might figure the image will be backwards. But if you have 5 wires you might have the ability to control this. The other thing it could be is an audio line. Lots of backup cameras are made generically, for lots of uses, then just bought in the 100,000 unit lot by integrators and "packaged" into a rearview camera... or a camper camera. So it might be a function you don't need on a car but it's just there... because... These are all guesses, but maybe some of it will help a little. :D I think the clear disk might work, but I think the hole may need to be 1/2” in diameter and I don’t think that will look very good. Which gets me back to the waterproof rear camera - man that would be a much easier and cleaner installation - if it works. And I think it will. And I’ll bet you are right on the “mirror” wire. It will surely be the white one as both front and rear can be reversed. But it will be tied to 5v or ground as the system never sees 12v. As for the backup circuit, the backup camera wiring can be connected there, and that does two things. First, it brings the rear view on the screen. Second, it puts guidelines on the screen. But it doesn’t power anything. The cameras are actually powered all the time the mirror is on as it always is recording their output. Anyway, thanks for the input!

I've not done any rattle-can painting on one of these trucks, but you might want to read a bit in this thread about the # of cans it took. But, it would hide a lot of "issues".

Thanks, Scott. Pormido hasn't confirmed nor denied anything, except to say you can't use the rear camera in the front. But I didn't try the relay idea on them until yesterday and they are gone for the weekend. Perhaps in the morning I'll have an answer. But I've played with the power to the rear camera when it is plugged into the rear connector and both red and black have power all the time the mirror is turned on. Pull the power to either and the camera's view disappears. Add the power back and it comes back on. So I'm fairly sure the relay will work. As for placement, when I get the camera working I'll play with it in various places. But I need to remember that there's no option in the setup to turn the front camera's input over like there is for the rear camera. So I can't turn the camera upside down and let it hang from a crossmember of the grille. In order to mount it at a downward angle I'll probably have to make a wedge and mount the wedge to the grille and the camera to the wedge. Sliding oval? You mean the DB7 arrangement where the machine gun comes out?

This was my sixth 'wheeling trip, so I hope I'd learned at least a little by then! But yes, I was starting to get more confidence. But the trail itself wasn't all that hard back in 2000 either. I never even made it to this part of the trail when we tried it in 2018. I couldn't get past the "Don't stall it!" point from an earlier video. So I think passing on it now is a good idea! As to the bumper moving, that's just a little frame flex. The core support / grill on a CJ5 is attached to the front crossmember with one bolt in the center of the vehicle. Other than that the entire front clip is cantilevered off the tub. So any frame flex from the front body mounts forward shows up as movement between the front bumper and the grill/fenders. I'm not saying it was just a love tap! But it's not the same as if you saw that kind of movement on Big Blue! And my hitting that same rock twice is a learning experience for anyone watching. You can see me lean out to the left to get a better view of what was going on there. But I had no idea why I couldn't get past it. After the second time I got out and saw what I was dealing with. My right front was dropping in a hole and setting the front bumper on the rock. I had no chance there and couldn't see it from the left side. After seeing it I moved a foot or so to the left and made it pretty easily. And this is another place where the trail looks pretty level in a video or picture, but is actually going up a really steep hill. You get some sense of that from how much I roll back on restarts Yeah, two lockers makes a big difference. And although I've never tried it, I'm beginning to think that a single locker in the front would be of more benefit that one in the rear. I won't have an automatic locker in the front of a vehicle that will be driven on snowy freeways. And from the little experience I've had with a front auto locker on trails I know it's pretty noticeable (not in a good way) just about all the time. Still, if I was building another trail rig I'd be pretty tempted to try an auto locker in the front and a selectable in the rear. Those are two of the benefits of watching other's 'wheeling videos: learning and motivation! I've learned a lot from watching other people's videos. It's nice if I can pay some of that forward. I didn't realize how the core support is held on. So it makes sense that things would rotate when you hit the rock. Or, rather, dropped onto the rock as the tire dipped down. Man, that made a CLANG that come through the headphones I was using very well. On the lockers, I don't think I'd like a single locker in the front. But, you are right not to go with an auto locker up there. No way, Jose! I feel Big Blue's rear Truetrac "work" as I make a corner and the tires go over paint stripes. Apparently that is enough loss of friction to engage the locker, and if that was up front it might be a problem. I'm extremely happy with the Truetrac in back and the OX up front. The Truetrac just does its thing w/o requiring any input, and we made almost all of the trails in CO w/o engaging the OX. But there were a couple of times that it felt like the right thing to do was to engage it to ensure we'd get over whatever we'd encountered w/o issue. Not sure it was needed, but it sure felt good to have it available with the flip of a switch. Anyway, thanks so much for the education you've given me on 'wheeling. Your help setting Big Blue up as well as the trails to try made a huge difference. And now watching the videos I am learning even more.

Yes, I always use a thin smear of RTV around the coolant ports. And I lower the intake on studs so it goes on straight and won't slide around. Good luck! Hope it works perfectly!

Well, there sorta is such a list. Go to Documentation/Electrical/Standard Wire & Color Code Charts. Ford was pretty consistent with their color code. You can download that pdf and search it on your own for specific colors. And, there is another way to search for electrical things. Shoot me an email and I'll explain. And the email system on here plays like it doesn't send the email, but usually does. Just copy your self on the email to know if it goes. As for the steering wheel, those are cool but I really like the speed control and those don't have the switches for that. But they are pretty. Headlights - have you thought about upgrading? Have you read the Lighting Upgrades thread, and especially this post? I intend to go with the Koitos and the +120 bulbs Daniel recommended. But I've not done that yet as I'm knee-deep in the mirror camera work. Speaking of which, as an electrical guru I'd LOVE to have your input on my plan as outlined here.

If I had a piece of some rod that was dead flat on the end I might be able to use it to polish the emblem's "window" flat. I'll check tomorrow to see if I have a 3/8" drill bit that is dead flat and, if so, give it another go. But I'm doubting I do, and if I do I'm doubting it'll work to make it optically "flat". So that leaves testing the relay approach. But I don't really need to add a relay just yet. Instead I can put the red and black wires of the rear camera to the battery and connect the rest of the wires to the front input. Assuming that the mirror doesn't need to sense something on the red wire that should work. If it does then I'll add the relay just to give it a load.

Well, things are starting to become clear, so to speak. Basically, what is becoming clear is that I don't know how to polish a round spot on the back of the Ford oval. What I did was to glue a piece of felt on the end of a 3/8" dowel, chuck that in the mill, and use chrome polishing compound to take the blue off of back of the plastic. And as you can see below, the view through is anything but clear. In fact, when you look at the plastic at an angle you can see concentric grooves polished in it from imperfections in the "pad" - in spite of me having trued the end on the lathe. And given my doubts that shooting at an angle through a piece of plastic that isn't flat on the front will give a good image, I think I'm going to abandon this approach. Unless someone has a Better Idea - after all, it is a Ford. So, you might ask, what is the plan, Stan? And that is to see if I can use a waterproof rear camera in place of the front camera. You'll probably remember that I discovered that the front camera has 4 wires and the rear camera has 5 wires. And the extra wire carries power in addition to the red wire that carries power, like it does on the front camera. So, I'm going to install a relay, as shown in the diagram below. When the mirror supplies power to the red wire that will pull the relay in. And the relay will supply power to both the black and red wires. Plus, the relay will have a snubber diode so the back EMF of the coil doesn't blow up the mirror. Thoughts? Better ideas? And I think this is where the camera will go. The reason for placing it on the bumper is because if it was on the grille it be obscured by the fog lights when trying to look down.

Nice videos! And such good memories of your boys. The first one of Poughkeepsie Gulch sure looks familiar. By then we'd gotten a bit of experience so it wasn't terribly daunting. But it was in that stretch that the little 4Runner lifted a front wheel and he had to engage the front locker to make it through. Either I took a different line or something 'cause BB didn't have that problem in the same spot. Black Bear still looks daunting. But I still want to do it. The second round on Poughkeepsie looks like you'd gotten your "wings" and knew just what to do. You made it look easy. But the Spring Creek Trail sure didn't look easy. I think I'll pass on that one as BB doesn't have the ground, or should I say rock, clearance that appears to be needed. Nor the turning radius. Man, I was about to crush my coffee cup as I watched you hitting that rock with the bumper! And the bumper actually lifts a bit in relation to the rest of the Jeep. The lack of a front locker was evident as well. A couple of times you spun the rear tires and the front tire I could see didn't turn. It is interesting what you can learn when you study a video. Seeing the bouncing with street pressures in the tires, the ground clearance and turning radius needed on some trails, and what the lack of a front locker does sure helps me understand the advantages of various things. Great videos! Thanks! It makes me want to GO!

The '85 "SOLD FOR $13,250 ON 12/16/21". The '80 "SOLD FOR $21,750 ON 12/17/21".