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Nothing Special home ('wheeling) movies

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Nothing Special

Re: Nothing Special home ('wheeling) movies

Gary Lewis wrote

The tires don't seem to have slowed you down or hindered the climbing ability any. If anything the climbing ability may have been better.

Both days look pretty difficult. Very steep and narrow with tight turns. And some mud. Your skills have certainly progressed over these videos.

And the boys certainly seem to like it. Are they into 'wheeling themselves? How old are they now?

I can't say if the bigger, softer tires worked better than the skinny stiff ones or not. As a team the Jeep and I were improving, but I hope some of that was me! But as I said, the ride was much better with the load range C tires.

On my Bronco I've run 33/9.50-15C, 33/10.50-15C and 33/12.50-15C tires. I don't know that there's been a lot of difference in ride between those. The 12.50s have probably been the best off-road, but I don't have much experience with them yet, and they're mud-terrains while the others were both all terrains. So not really a fair comparison.

But I'm going to run the 12.50s for a while now. I don't know what I'll do when these need replacing, but I've got a while before that will happen. Although I do know I'm staying with load range C!

My "boys" are 26 and 27 now. Both are married. My older son, Mike, lives about 10 miles away now (he was living with us through the pandemic) and my younger son, Dan, lives about 80 miles away.

Mike was starting to drive it quite a bit (you'll see that in upcoming videos), but he started seeming less interested as he went through college and hasn't been on a trip with us for a while now. Talking with him more now he sounds like he might be interested in getting back into it, but he hasn't had the opportunity recently.

Dan was getting pretty into four wheeling for a while. He'll start figuring into these videos pretty soon, first as a videographer (and color commentator!), but later as a driver. As he got better at driving it in the rocks I could spot for him and we could get ourselves in a lot more trouble than before! And as he got better yet he could do some of the spotting and I could be the one actually bending the Bronco! (I should've put rock rails on it earlier!) A couple years ago he was talking about getting a Jeep Wrangler Rubicon so he could do this sort of thing in his own vehicle, but after getting married that seems less likely as his wife isn't interested in that sort of trip. But you never know what time will do.

Bob
Sorry, no '80 - '86 Ford trucks
"Oswald": 1997 F-250HD crew cab short box, 460, E4OD, 4.10 gears
"Pluto": 1971 Bronco, 302, NV3550 5 speed, Atlas 4.3:1 transfer case, 33" tires
"the motorhome": 2015 E-450-based 28' class C motorhome, 6.8L V-10
"the Dodge": 2007 Dodge 2500, 6.7L Cummins

grumpin

Re: Nothing Special home ('wheeling) movies

In reply to this post by Nothing Special

Very cool stuff! Bet your kids remember wheelin’!

Dane
1986 F250HD SC XLT Lariat 4x4 460 C6-Sold
1992 Bronco XLT 4x4 351W E4OD
1998 GMC Sierra SLE K1500 350 4L60E
Arizona

Nothing Special

Re: Nothing Special home ('wheeling) movies

This post was updated on .

In 2010 we went on a "last family vacation". Mike was in high school and had started a job. We didn't think we'd be able to get us all together for any more family vacations. So we asked them where they wanted to go. The Black Hills was the unanimous response (although we did add Yellowstone to that trip).

Then in 2014 we went on our second "last family vacation," also to the Black Hills.

In 2015 we went on our third "last family vacation," this time fourwheeling in an OHV park in northern Minnesota.

2016 was our fourth "last family vacation," but this one was a cruise in the Baltic with my parents, siblings and their families.

2017 was our fifth "last family vacation," back to the Black Hills again. And that was our last "last family vacation" (at least so far).

But the point is, they kept coming back for family 'wheeling trips. So yes, you're right!

Gary Lewis

Re: Nothing Special home ('wheeling) movies

Administrator

We've gotten our family together twice so far - Beaver Lake in June of 2017 for someone's 70th birthday.

Then in 2019 for a couple's 50th wedding anniversary. And we are planning another but haven't nailed down what year, much less the month, due to COVD.

I mention that to say that I understand the special memories those kinds of trips generate. So I hope you keep having them.

Gary, AKA "Gary fellow": Profile

Dad's: '81 F150 Ranger XLT 4x4: Down for restomod: Full-roller "stroked 351M" w/Trick Flow heads & intake, EEC-V SEFI/E4OD/3.50 gears w/Kevlar clutches
Blue: 2015 F150 Platinum 4x4 SuperCrew wearing Blue Jeans & sporting a 3.5L EB & Max Tow
Big Blue: 1985 F250HD 4x4: 460/ZF5/3.55's, D60 w/Ox locker & 10.25 Sterling/Trutrac, Blue Top & Borgeson, & EEC-V MAF/SEFI

Nothing Special

Re: Nothing Special home ('wheeling) movies

In 2004 we were still 'wheeling the Jeep, this time around Leadville Colorado. My boys were 10 and 8 now, and my older son, Mike, started driving on some of the trails! I started the engine in gear and he steered while I worked the hand throttle. A lot of fun for us all (and maybe most fun for his younger brother!).

This first trail, South Halfmoon Creek, is one we'd done a few times before.

The next video is much more of a home movie than a 'wheeling video. The trail wasn't difficult and my son drove for all of the video. So feel free to skip this one if you don't want that. If you do watch it, around 2:55 you hear what Mike thinks of fourwheeling and what our plans were for the Jeep at that time. But after my wife and I had talked about it more we decided that a CJ-5 wasn't a good first car for a teenage boy and we couldn't justify keeping two toys, so we did sell the Jeep eventually.

We didn't get any video of most of this next trail. Most of it was in the trees, with steep sidehills and deep bogs. No danger of dying on this trail, but the possibility of getting stuck alone and without a winch was very real, which made it pretty tense for me.

Tincup Pass was the last trail we ran on this trip. I always like trails that get above treeline, and this one has the added bonus of having some rocks to crawl over.

That's it for that trip. Again, thanks for reading and watching!

Gary Lewis

Re: Nothing Special home ('wheeling) movies

Administrator

Mike did well! And he appears to like 'wheeling. And the Jeep.

But I understand the worry about getting stuck while on your own and w/o a winch - with your family along no less. It is one thing for you to get in that position, but not acceptable for you to put your family in the situation.

As for Tin Cup Pass, so that's what it is like on four wheels. Janey and I went over it on my XL350 two-up back in the early 70's and I thought "Man, this would be tough with four wheels!" And, it looks like it is. With two wheels I was able to pick a line that was pretty smooth. But not so for y'all.

Gary, AKA "Gary fellow": Profile

Nothing Special

Re: Nothing Special home ('wheeling) movies

This post was updated on .

On New Years Day 2006 I got an opportunity to go snow 'wheeling with a few people from the Minnesota Trailriders, a local 4WD club. Lesley thought that going outside in the winter on purpose was ridiculous, so it was just me and my sons (ages 11 and 10).

This was on some private land owned by one of the club members.

Thanks for reading and watching!

Nothing Special

Re: Nothing Special home ('wheeling) movies

In 2006 we went to the Iron Range OHV area in northern Minnesota for the first time (also called "Gilbert" for the name of the town it's next to). This is next to a retired open pit mine. The pit is now a lake (Lake Ore-Be-Gone, I kid you not) and the old tailing piles are a rock crawler's paradise!

Lesley and both of our sons (ages 12 and 10) were with me on this trip. And I should warn you that in addition to my younger son doing some driving on this trip for the first time, he also debuted as a videographer and color commentator! He's improved a lot since then. But seriously, there is still some good rock crawling here.

By the way, this ended up being the last trip for the Jeep. It was taking too much time, space and money that was holding up the Bronco project. With the Jeep gone I did get the Bronco out on the roads and trails the next year, but it took another 3 years before it was working well at either.

Anyway, here's this trip.

Thanks for reading and watching!

Nothing Special

Re: Nothing Special home ('wheeling) movies

Our next trip, and our first trip with the Bronco, was in 2007 to the Black Hills. I don't have any video from that trip. At that time the Bronco had an automatic trans and electric cooling fans. That combination was not good. I had overheating problems driving on the roads in the Black Hills, and could hardly do any trail driving without sending temperatures soaring. I also had open diffs in both axles. The result of that combination was that there just wasn't any 'wheeling worth video.

Over the next few years I pulled the automatic trans out and put the stock 3 speed manual back in, and added a Detroit locker in the rear. So when we went back to the Black Hills in 2010 we were able to use the Bronco more and got some video.

This first video is a short section of Prospector Gulch. I had done this trail with the Jeep, and I found it much more difficult in the Bronco. The A/T tires (rather than M/T) might have been a factor. The Bronco might not flex as well as the Jeep did. But another big issue was the crawl ratio. Both had the same 34:1, but the Jeep engine would idle down better while the Bronco engine kept dying if I didn't go too fast. Oh well, room for improvement! Anyway, here's Prospector Gulch:

In this next video we were starting into the Horselt Gulch trails. My younger son (Dan, age 14) was filming and providing commentary while my older son (Mike, age 16) was driving. Mike wanted to stop before this mud but I told him to keep going. Getting back out on our own with only a hi-lift, a come-along and a lot of rope was a different type of challenge than I was hoping for!

Then we went back into the Calamity Canyon trails (with more 14 year old commentary). One sign here that we had turned a corner in our rockcrawling is at 1:30 in the video. I was going to take a bypass but Lesley wanted me to take the harder line so she could get better pictures!

We finished the trip back at Horselt Gulch (but skipping the mud!). We didn't get into anything too challenging here, and no one got out to film much, so most of the video is from inside the Bronco, not the greatest perspective for a video, but it's what I have. And by the way, the hill we go down at the end is the hill the S-10 and I went up in 2001.

Thanks for reading and watching!

Gary Lewis

Re: Nothing Special home ('wheeling) movies

Administrator

In reply to this post by Nothing Special

I'm amazed at where all you could go in the snow with the Jeep.

But at times it looks like a front locker would have helped. However, I'm aware that you lose steering then when they both spin, so maybe it would have been worse?

Gary, AKA "Gary fellow": Profile

Gary Lewis

Re: Nothing Special home ('wheeling) movies

Administrator

In reply to this post by Nothing Special

Yikes! Those were ROCKS! And a lot thereof. But the Jeep made it well, and all the drivers did great as well.

And I particularly liked the running commentary on the video. Especially the "And, cut!"

Gary, AKA "Gary fellow": Profile

Gary Lewis

Re: Nothing Special home ('wheeling) movies

Administrator

In reply to this post by Nothing Special

At Prospector Gulch the Bronco seemed to struggle where I think the Jeep wouldn't have had a problem. And those fans made a lot of noise.

At Horselt Gulch it was difficult to watch. Been there, done that, don't wanna do it again! And, who cleaned up that mess down there? "We have movement!"

Calamity Canyon had a lot of rocks, for sure! The Bronco seemed to be doing pretty well. And I loved the commentary. Especially the "That's not as fun!"

And, back at Horselt Gulch w/o the mud it looked like you and the Bronco are becoming a good team. It seems like you are getting used to it and it is working pretty well.

Well done! Thanks for sharing!

Gary, AKA "Gary fellow": Profile

Nothing Special

Re: Nothing Special home ('wheeling) movies

In reply to this post by Gary Lewis

Gary Lewis wrote

I'm amazed at where all you could go in the snow with the Jeep.

But at times it looks like a front locker would have helped. However, I'm aware that you lose steering then when they both spin, so maybe it would have been worse?

I don't think a front locker would've helped much. Contrary to what people like to say, an open diff does drive both tires, sending the same torque to both. That works really well when both tires have about the same traction. In snow that's usually true, it's just that neither tire gets much traction. So a locker would only add the minimal amount of additional traction the non-spinning tire has, which isn't much. And as you point out, it would hurt steering. Still, I do like having the option with the selectable I now have in the Bronco!

And I was pretty surprised at how well it worked too! We had gone down that last hill, before turning around to go back up. As we were going down I was hoping there was another way up, because I knew I couldn't get back up it!

Gary Lewis wrote

Yikes! Those were ROCKS! And a lot thereof. But the Jeep made it well, and all the drivers did great as well.

And I particularly liked the running commentary on the video. Especially the "And, cut!"

That park was a lot of fun! Not all of the hard places had bypasses, but most of them were on short enough trails that I'd hike it first and decide if it was for me or not. And the hard trails are all connected by easy dirt roads.

And yes, Dan's commentary was colorful! I thought about editing some of it out to be more "professional", but it was just too good not to share!

Gary Lewis wrote

At Prospector Gulch the Bronco seemed to struggle where I think the Jeep wouldn't have had a problem. And those fans made a lot of noise.

I wasn't real happy with the Bronco yet. And while those fans were noisy, at least they were ineffective! I replaced them with a stock mechanical fan.

Gary Lewis wrote

At Horselt Gulch it was difficult to watch. Been there, done that, don't wanna do it again! And, who cleaned up that mess down there? "We have movement!"

Yeah, that day was a much better story than it was an experience!

Gary Lewis wrote

Calamity Canyon had a lot of rocks, for sure! The Bronco seemed to be doing pretty well. And I loved the commentary. Especially the "That's not as fun!"

I was a little surprised at Lesley's response there! I wasn't sure the Bronco was up to that yet, but it was fun to see what it could do (and learn more about what it still needed).

Gary Lewis wrote

And, back at Horselt Gulch w/o the mud it looked like you and the Bronco are becoming a good team. It seems like you are getting used to it and it is working pretty well.

Well done! Thanks for sharing!

I can't say that was all that tough a trail, but yes, both of us were certainly showing potential.

And thank you!

Nothing Special

Re: Nothing Special home ('wheeling) movies

It was a little while before I was able to take the Bronco on another trip, but in 2014 we (Lesley, Mike, Dan and I) went back to the Black Hills. That had given me time to make some improvements. That, along with Dan's driving ability and confidence improving, allowed us to do some significantly more difficult trails.

The biggest change to the Bronco was installing an Atlas 4.3:1 transfer case and NV3550 5 speed trans. That took it from a 34:1 crawl ratio to 71:1. That completely transformed it off-road! I also had replaced the ineffective electric cooling fans, going back to the stock mechanical fan.

For our first trail on this trip we were back to Prospector Gulch. Both of my sons also drove on this trail. As we were playing around with the Bronco's new capability we found our limits, but the Bronco did quite well.

Our second trail was a new one for us, a forest road off Bogus Jim Road. Mike and I both drove this trail. The Bronco took some rather tame damage here, mostly the wipers and antenna were broken by tree branches, but we also crunched both rear quarters.

Trail 3 was another new one for us. No colorful name, just FR 8085 on the map. No big rocks here, but the low gearing was sure nice on the STEEP hills on a somewhat loose surface. And weaving through tight trees was interesting too. Too bad "steep" never shows well on photos or videos...

For our fourth trail of the trip we went back to the familiar Calamity Canyon. But now with a better map and a more capable vehicle we weren't... exploring quite as much. It was interesting to see how the 71:1 crawl ratio did hitting rocks. Even with a manual trans and not touching the clutch the tires hit the rocks, it pauses briefly and then goes right over, pretty much the same speed it was going. I like this setup!

And yes, at about 7:40 the cameraman slips and falls. But hey, at least I kept the Bronco in the picture!

For our last trail we headed right back to Calamity Canyon where we found a couple of short fun sections that we could loop back over with different drivers and different lines.

That's it for that trip. Thanks for reading and watching!

Gary Lewis

Re: Nothing Special home ('wheeling) movies

Administrator

Sorry for the late reply. With that many videos and so many things to do here I had to catch snippets of time to view them all.

Anyway, Prospector Gulch looks easy with that crawl ratio. Man, that obviously made a huge difference. You rarely throttled up and yet crawled over things. And the lack of the fan whine makes it much more relaxed sounding.

That forest road sure seems narrow, and ROCKY! And some of the descents look really steep on camera, so must have been very steep. But the Bronco seemed to take it in stride. The suspension was limber and looked like it worked very nicely.

On FR 8085 the trail really was narrow, but as you said it was hard to tell it was steep - until the 5:40 point, and then it was obvious!

That really was steep and the Bronco went right up it. Well done!

And Calamity Canyon is rocky as well. You didn't take a big tumble, but I heard laughter from the Bronco's occupants.

And that rock at 9:00 was huge! The Bronco did well.

As for the last video, my granddaughter said "Do they just keep looping around that bush?" I told her it was Groundhog Day, but she didn't understand. Anyway, it was interesting how the different lines made a huge difference. On some of them she thought the Bronco was going to turn over.

Cool!

Gary, AKA "Gary fellow": Profile

Nothing Special

Re: Nothing Special home ('wheeling) movies

Thanks! Things were starting to come together pretty well about this time, with the Bronco nearing "completion" and both Dan and I improving in our abilities. It makes a big difference having two people who can drive and spot vs only one. When I'm by myself I need to do my own spotting, so there's a lot of in-and-out of the vehicle, or else just driving by Braille (feeling the bumps!). But starting about with this trip I could spot for Dan and get him through things that I'd have a much tougher time doing on my own. And his spotting abilities were improving too!

Back to the Bronco, we didn't realize it quite yet, but the lack of a front locker was really getting to be its main issue. I think it was in our 2017 Black Hills trip (that I've edited but haven't uploaded yet) where that really became apparent. I installed the front OX before our 2018 Ouray trip, but I haven't had Dan along since then.

Nothing Special

Re: Nothing Special home ('wheeling) movies

In 2015 we went back to the Iron Range OHV park in Gilbert Mn. We were definitely doing some harder trails now, but a lot of the time both of my boys wanted to ride, so much of the video is shot from inside the Bronco. That's not my favorite perspective to watch, but it's what we have.

Most of this video is working our way up a steep hill with kind of loose dirt and a few big rocks. "Steep" never shows up well in pictures or videos, but as you hear the tires slipping it gives some idea. By the top I was wishing for a winch, and if I'd had one I'd have used it. Since I didn't, I managed to drive all the way.

The second part of this series is meandering around on a few different trails. Nothing as steep as in part 1! But a few bigger rocks.

Part 3 is more wandering around, but we did have fun on some rocks. Well, most of us had fun. Starting at 4:50 you can see what Lesley's Cavalier King Charles Spaniel, Kirby, thinks about having "her person" not be in the vehicle with her!

In part 4 we found a few bigger rocks, including a few that stopped us (at least briefly). This was a fun, challenging day for us!

Thanks for reading and watching!

Nothing Special

Re: Nothing Special home ('wheeling) movies

And just for fun I stuck together a video of my Jeep with a 34:1 crawl ratio and my Bronco with a 71:1 crawl ratio on the same trail. This is a trail called The Gorge Rock Crawl at the Iron Range OHV Area in Gilbert MN. I ran it in 2006 with the Jeep (video posted a couple days ago) and then in 2015 with the Bronco (in Part 3 of the series I just posted). After experiencing it wit hthe Bronco it was kind of funny to see how fast the Jeep "crawled!"

Gary Lewis

Re: Nothing Special home ('wheeling) movies

Administrator

In reply to this post by Nothing Special

Man, in the first video it is wild how RED the mud is. Like being in western Okiehoma. And yes, I can tell how steep it is from the tires. STEEP! "Wrong gear." You need a front locker! Or a winch! But, you made it. "Ok. Glad I'm off that trail."

Part 2 starts out looking at BIG rocks. And "Its narrow in here" was very true! But that Bronco just motored on through, around the corners and over the rocks, slowly but very surely. I think I'd have taken the road 'cause Big Blue would not have fit through or over any of that.

Part 3 is ditto, save for the "OH!" at 3:00. And yes, the camera got that. But the Bronco didn't seem to care - right on over. And Kirby seemed cool with everything - except when she saw "her person". As for challenging, man some of those places looked impossible, and you went right on through, slowly. "Nice bouquet of oopsy daisies."

Part 4 starts with what looks really hard, both steep and rocky, and gets harder! At 5:20 and after looks to be a commercial for why the OX locker was needed. At 8:10 there are some wild angles. At 8:30ish "You did it again." But what? Anyway, over it you went on the next try. Well done!

All in all, I am blown away with how you can get that Bronco seemingly anywhere. It goes so much better than the Jeep there is no comparison. Oh wait! There IS a comparison. Let me go watch it.

Gary, AKA "Gary fellow": Profile

Gary Lewis

Re: Nothing Special home ('wheeling) movies

Administrator

In reply to this post by Nothing Special

The crawl ratio makes all the difference in the world! The Jeep was bouncing from one rock to the next while the Bronco was easing up and down the rocks like the little engine that could. I'm sold!

Gary, AKA "Gary fellow": Profile

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