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3G Alternator Conversion Page Upgrade.

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Gary Lewis

Re: 3G Alternator Conversion Page Upgrade.

Administrator

Steve - Please check out the Wiring It tab. (Nothing else should have changed.) I used one of your pics, thank you very much and pared down the fuse pictures. Plus moved things around to try and make it flow better.

Comments, please.

Gary, AKA "Gary fellow": Profile

Dad's: '81 F150 Ranger XLT 4x4: Down for restomod: Full-roller "stroked 351M" w/Trick Flow heads & intake, EEC-V SEFI/E4OD/3.50 gears w/Kevlar clutches
Blue: 2015 F150 Platinum 4x4 SuperCrew wearing Blue Jeans & sporting a 3.5L EB & Max Tow
Big Blue: 1985 F250HD 4x4: 460/ZF5/3.55's, D60 w/Ox locker & 10.25 Sterling/Trutrac, Blue Top & Borgeson, & EEC-V MAF/SEFI

Steve83

Re: 3G Alternator Conversion Page Upgrade.

Banned User

Again: most of these are just style comments.

Gary Lewis wrote

...a fuse is absolutely necessary.

I would say "...some form of circuit protection is absolutely necessary."

Gary Lewis wrote

...you may well have a lack of a solid ground.

That's awkward & wordy. You might reduce it to "...you may lack a solid ground."

Gary Lewis wrote

...the samefrom the case of the alternator to the engine block .

Typo (missing space), and I'm not sure what you're saying is the same.

But more importantly: adding a ground wire to a painted/powdered case won't help because it will still be insulated. And painting/powdering the mount & ground bosses is OK. They just have to be CLEANED down to shiny metal before they can actually ground the case reliably (either by the mounts or by an added wire).

Gary Lewis wrote

...in the picture below, which isrotate (re-clock) your alternator...

Typo (missing space)

I haven't looked at the other tabs because you said earlier you wanted to focus on this one.

Gary Lewis

Re: 3G Alternator Conversion Page Upgrade.

Administrator

Good points, Steve. I'll work on that tab soon. And then we can turn to the other tabs.

Gary, AKA "Gary fellow": Profile

Gary Lewis

Re: 3G Alternator Conversion Page Upgrade.

Administrator

I've now updated that tab with your comments, Steve - I hope. And, I've now replaced the original page with this new one. Please take a look, but we can still upgrade.

Gary, AKA "Gary fellow": Profile

Steve83

Re: 3G Alternator Conversion Page Upgrade.

Banned User

It looks good, but you're still missing spaces in "samefrom" and "isrotate" near the bottom. Are you keeping them like that for some reason?

Gary Lewis

Re: 3G Alternator Conversion Page Upgrade.

Administrator

Steve - I'm apparently not seeing what you are seeing. I've even searched for "samefrom" and "isrotate" and can't find them. Can you take a screen shot and show me what I'm missing? Please?

Gary, AKA "Gary fellow": Profile

Steve83

Re: 3G Alternator Conversion Page Upgrade.

Banned User

This post was updated on .

Here's what I get when I copy that text from the Wiring It tab:

Grounds:
In the picture of the alternator above note that the ground connection, which is tapped 8-1.25mm, was not powder coated. Nor were the threads in the ear at the top. Given that, none of the surfaces that will be part of the mechanical attachment of the alternator, and therefore the ground path, should be painted or coated - or they should be cleaned down to shiny metal if they are. But, another option is to add a ground wire, the samefrom the case of the alternator to the engine block .

Clocking:
The back of the alternator can be attached to the front of the alternator in three different positions, and those positions are called the "clocking" of the alternator. The industry standard for referencing clocking appears to be with the pivot at 6:00 and the clamp arm at 12:00, as shown in the picture above. So in the picture above the alternator has 7:00 clocking, but it could have 4:00 or 11:00 clocking since the positions go in 4-hour increments [12 hours/3 positions]. (Other alternators may have different clocking - I don't know.)

As you can see in the picture below, which isrotate (re-clock) your alternator, and Steve83's instructions for doing so are here.

Gary Lewis

Re: 3G Alternator Conversion Page Upgrade.

Administrator

Steve - We are seeing different things. I think somehow you are looking at an old page. I've compared what is in the editor to what I get when I pull that page (Electrical/3G Alternator Conversion) up, and both show this:

Can someone else check to see what they get? Steve, can you empty the cache on your computer?

Gary, AKA "Gary fellow": Profile

Steve83

Re: 3G Alternator Conversion Page Upgrade.

Banned User

Gary Lewis wrote

I think somehow you are looking at an old page.

I wouldn't doubt it - my computers & phone do that to me. I haven't figured out why, but it happened with the previous computer, and this new one, and on at least 2 phones. I have to think it's something screwy in my Chrome settings since it affects anything I'm logged into, but can't find it. Clearing the cache has never worked; holding down CTRL or SHIFT +F5 does nothing different from F5 alone. It takes about a week of NOT going to a page for it to load the latest version.

The odd thing in this case is: I hadn't visited that page since I posted the first set of comments about it, so IDK how it got the new layout with SOME of the old text.

ArdWrknTrk

Re: 3G Alternator Conversion Page Upgrade.

Administrator

In reply to this post by Gary Lewis

Ok, I'm bringing this thread ttt so if there needs be more conversation on the parts numbers or eccentricitys of 3G's we can stop cluttering BuggTruck's request for advice.

Jim,
Lil'Red is a '87 F250 HD, 4.10's, 1356 4x4, Zf-5, 3G, PMGR, Saginaw PS, desmogged with a Holley 80508 and Performer intake.
Too much other stuff to mention.

Gary Lewis

Re: 3G Alternator Conversion Page Upgrade.

Administrator

And yet the Buggtruck thread continues to have good info added to it.

Anyway, I hope to copy and consolidate some of that info into this thread soon so we can cuss and discuss it. Then I can add to our 3G page.

Gary, AKA "Gary fellow": Profile

ArdWrknTrk

Re: 3G Alternator Conversion Page Upgrade.

Administrator

LMK what you need about Lester numbers, clocking, understanding body diameter, mounting distance, etc .
I will help if I can.

There is already an epic thread over on FSB that details many of the variants and the donors they come from.
Looking up the interchange number if you know the donor is trivial.

Jim,
Lil'Red is a '87 F250 HD, 4.10's, 1356 4x4, Zf-5, 3G, PMGR, Saginaw PS, desmogged with a Holley 80508 and Performer intake.
Too much other stuff to mention.

Gary Lewis

Re: 3G Alternator Conversion Page Upgrade.

Administrator

Perhaps a link to the epic FSB thread would help and I can try to get my head around it.

As for things I need help with, I for sure don't fully understand body diameter and mounting distances.

And, which engines came with what body diameters and/or mounting distances.

What I think would be helpful to the users is to flesh out the spreadsheet, a static shot of which is shown below, on the 3G page to include more sources, more Lester numbers, etc.

Gary, AKA "Gary fellow": Profile

ArdWrknTrk

Re: 3G Alternator Conversion Page Upgrade.

Administrator

https://www.fullsizebronco.com/forum/7-1980-96-bronco-tech/55169-3g-interchange-facts-if-youre-thinking-3g-read-here.html?amp=1

There are four 3G alternators available to us:
90A (135mm) in both 7 & 8.25" c-c

130A(148mm) in both 7 & 8.25" c-c

8.25" fits V-belt 'swing' alternators and the 300-6 efi static bracket.
The 7" fits Windsor efi serpentine brackets.

For 130A:
The 7" spacing is found on the 3.0l V-6.
The 8.25" spacing is found on the 3.8l V-6

For the 90A:
(These are mostly found in trucks and econoboxes)

The 7" c-c can be found in mid-'90's Windsor pickups and E-series.
The 8.25" can be found in the 300-6 and 460 pickups, as well as the same vans.

The Aerostar was mentioned but I forget which spread it had.

Jim,
Lil'Red is a '87 F250 HD, 4.10's, 1356 4x4, Zf-5, 3G, PMGR, Saginaw PS, desmogged with a Holley 80508 and Performer intake.
Too much other stuff to mention.

ArdWrknTrk

Re: 3G Alternator Conversion Page Upgrade.

Administrator

In reply to this post by Gary Lewis

I see you have the 3.0 Sable up there.

It cannot be the same # as the 3.8 since 3.0 has 7" mount.

Where did you source this?

Jim,
Lil'Red is a '87 F250 HD, 4.10's, 1356 4x4, Zf-5, 3G, PMGR, Saginaw PS, desmogged with a Holley 80508 and Performer intake.
Too much other stuff to mention.

Gary Lewis

Re: 3G Alternator Conversion Page Upgrade.

Administrator

I think I got that info from the interchange book that Bill/Numberdummy gave me. But it may be wrong, or I may have misunderstood what it said when I created the spreadsheet. So I'm happy to change it when we get better info.

On the body size and spacing info, is it fair to say something like:

There are two body sizes, 135 and 148mm. Those originally were rated at 90 and 130 amps respectively, but the aftermarket is selling modified versions of them at higher ratings so we will refer to them by their body diameter rather than amperage rating.

Gary, AKA "Gary fellow": Profile

ArdWrknTrk

Re: 3G Alternator Conversion Page Upgrade.

Administrator

Yes, that's good.
But I think a little explanation as to why the 135mm (90A) alternators diode board and heat sink can't keep up with the higher output of a 130A "upgrade".
Or for that matter why the two hole (large case) 3G won't put out 200A for long before melting down.

There is only so much air flow through the case and only so much room inside for a thicker heatsink.

Ryan would build a 160A 3G but nothing larger.
He understood.
Educating those who decide to upgrade helps them avoid costly mistakes.

Jim,
Lil'Red is a '87 F250 HD, 4.10's, 1356 4x4, Zf-5, 3G, PMGR, Saginaw PS, desmogged with a Holley 80508 and Performer intake.
Too much other stuff to mention.

Gary Lewis

Re: 3G Alternator Conversion Page Upgrade.

Administrator

Very good points. I will try to incorporate those thoughts into the writeup, but watch me to make sure I do them justice.

Gary, AKA "Gary fellow": Profile

85lebaront2

Re: 3G Alternator Conversion Page Upgrade.

Administrator

That's what is on Darth, one of Ryan's 160 amp 3Gs. In the years I have had it, I had to replace the bearings after about 2 years, they were cheap Chinesium ones and a set of brushes this year (started acting strange, light would come on but voltage stayed reasonable) I drove it back from Newport News to Exmore like that and lights stayed bright and had no real issues.

Bill AKA "LOBO" Profile

"Getting old is inevitable, growing up is optional" Darth Vader 1986 F350 460 converted to MAF/SEFI, E4OD 12X3 1/2 rear brakes, traction loc 3:55 gear, 160 amp 3G alternator Wife's 2011 Flex Limited Daily Driver 2009 Flex Limited with factory tow package Project car 1986 Chrysler LeBaron convertible 2.2L Turbo II, modified A413

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