Carburetor feedback needed

[Gary Lewis]

Not sure how the last (first?)half thread could have cracked out unless the bolt threads stretched.

Were you using an impact to put it on the last time?

An interesting possibility for sealant, halfway between thread locker and RTV, is Loctite PST.

I use this anaerobic thread sealant for many things like thermostat and water pump bolts.

It comes it a couple of formulas and is indicated for use on stainless flange bolts in petroleum refineries, so it lubricates and protects against galling before it sets.

It can certainly handle the fluids and temperatures found in an engine.

Yes, I'm guessing that whomever installed the balancer last just barely got the bolt started and tried to torque it to get the balancer to go in. Maybe it was cross-threaded or the balancer was cocked and didn't want to go in, but that pulled the first bit of the thread off the crank.

But I don't think that is going to be a problem at all.

[dirtymac]

Not sure how the last (first?)half thread could have cracked out unless the bolt threads stretched.

Were you using an impact to put it on the last time?

An interesting possibility for sealant, halfway between thread locker and RTV, is Loctite PST.

I use this anaerobic thread sealant for many things like thermostat and water pump bolts.

It comes it a couple of formulas and is indicated for use on stainless flange bolts in petroleum refineries, so it lubricates and protects against galling before it sets.

It can certainly handle the fluids and temperatures found in an engine.

First half thread and no impact wrench on my part. I used a rented puller and installer and a lot of elbow grease. It did take a lot of effort to get the old balancer moving but once it started it came off pretty easy.

[ArdWrknTrk]

First half thread and no impact wrench on my part. I used a rented puller and installer and a lot of elbow grease. It did take a lot of effort to get the old balancer moving but once it started it came off pretty easy.

They can get stuck pretty good.

I only asked about using an impact because I know how threads behave in steel and cast iron.

I agree with Gary.

There's no issue with the crank losing that little chip but I wouldn't use thread locker on the bolt.

[dirtymac]

You can easily check the timing chain w/o removing the cover. Two ways:

• Pull the fuel pump and reach in with a hook and see how much slop there is. 1/2" is max.

• Bring #1 up on TDC by turning the engine clockwise with the 15/16" bolt on the crank balancer. And then remove the distributor cap. With the TDC mark lined up with the pointer gently turn the engine backwards (CCW) and stop when the distributor starts to turn. The timing marks show the amount of slop.

Having said that, if the engine hasn't been rebuilt then the chain has to be worn. Still, checking before you plow ahead is good.

I gave up on pulling the fuel pump to check the timing chain. I was getting prepared to do that next but it looked like I might need to remove the fuel lines to get the pump off and far enough out of the way. I was close to giving up on checking the chain altogether. Last night I stumbled onto a video showing the same distributor process you described previously. For some reason, when I first read your description, it sounded much more difficult.

So, going the distributor and rotor route, I could not find any difference in movement. My spring loaded TDC tool arrived since I started all of this work and it made finding TDC a breeze. After getting there, I pulled the cap and found that I was on the exhaust stroke. I rotated the engine around to the compression stroke and followed the rotor the entire way around. I could not see any difference in the movement.

Once at the correct TDC, I slowly moved back and forth from there and the rotor moved immediately both directions. I honestly could not find any different in the movement. If there is any, it is very minimal, probably less than a degree.

Tomorrow, I plan to start cleaning up some of the exposed bits and then start putting everything else back on.

Oh, and the balancer markings. TDC is not at 0 on the balancer. No more -7 degrees like the old balancer. Also, I checked it again before removing the old balancer and we were still at -7 degrees.

[Gary Lewis]

I gave up on pulling the fuel pump to check the timing chain. I was getting prepared to do that next but it looked like I might need to remove the fuel lines to get the pump off and far enough out of the way. I was close to giving up on checking the chain altogether. Last night I stumbled onto a video showing the same distributor process you described previously. For some reason, when I first read your description, it sounded much more difficult.

So, going the distributor and rotor route, I could not find any difference in movement. My spring loaded TDC tool arrived since I started all of this work and it made finding TDC a breeze. After getting there, I pulled the cap and found that I was on the exhaust stroke. I rotated the engine around to the compression stroke and followed the rotor the entire way around. I could not see any difference in the movement.

Once at the correct TDC, I slowly moved back and forth from there and the rotor moved immediately both directions. I honestly could not find any different in the movement. If there is any, it is very minimal, probably less than a degree.

Tomorrow, I plan to start cleaning up some of the exposed bits and then start putting everything else back on.

Oh, and the balancer markings. TDC is not at 0 on the balancer. No more -7 degrees like the old balancer. Also, I checked it again before removing the old balancer and we were still at -7 degrees.

That being the case then you don't need to replacing the timing chain.

But I'm not sure I understand where the point is vs TDC on the new balancer. I think you said it is -7 degrees on the old balancer, but I got lost with what you were saying about the new one.

[dirtymac]

That being the case then you don't need to replacing the timing chain.

But I'm not sure I understand where the point is vs TDC on the new balancer. I think you said it is -7 degrees on the old balancer, but I got lost with what you were saying about the new one.

Gary, It's been a long week!

At TDC, the old balancer was showing 7 degrees off from 0. So it had definitely slipped and wasn't just separating.

[ArdWrknTrk]

Today I spent a few hours trying to fix the idle issue which I suspected was partly timing related. The factory setting was 3° of timing. I bumped that up to 22°. I’m still not sure this was right but the roughness in the idle is now gone. I also managed to get the idle rpm down around 800 which is what the factory sticker listed. A lot of people, here and elsewhere, state that without the smog equipment the timing needs to be bumped. Many people also suggest increasing the timing until you start to hear engine pinging and then back off 2°. I never heard any pinging but after small increments, 22° worked well. My goal is a balance of fuel economy and power.......

The carburetor concerns me in general. This is the second rebuilt carb the previous owner put on it. The first one was done with a new main fuel tank and fuel pump. The previous owner replaced the fuel filter at the carb right before I got it. Within a couple of days I had to clear the bowl of Teflon tape bits.

I went back to the beginning and read what you have to say.

1st, I have to ask when setting the base timing do you have the distributor disconnected and the vacuum line plugged?

22° should have the starter struggling to turn the engine and kicking back when you release the key.

A DS-II ignition module should retard the ignition timing a few degrees while the starter is engaged, but not more than 4° or so. (I think Gary measured it in milliseconds with his O-scope)

Reconnect the vacuum line and I'd expect 22° to be a minimum for proper timing at idle.

But this still doesn't explain your suggestion that "The factory setting was 3° of timing"

It should say on.the emissions sticker to set the timing at 8° with the curb idle set to something like 650 in drive for automatics.

Also, never use Teflon tape on fuel fittings. The previous owner must not understand that fuel systems rely on flare fittings, which seal metal on metal.

The nut only applies pressure to hold the flare together.

If fuel has reached the threads the flared line and filter are not doing their primary job.

Given that you observe a bunch of excess silicone glopped around the timing case (cover plate, In a 335 series engine?) I'd expect the chain and sprockets were changed not too many miles ago.

There's nothing else in there, for it to have been removed.

When trying to determine if the harmonic damper's timing ring has slipped it shouldn't really matter whether you are on compression or exhaust.

The damper is keyed directly to the crank. The pistons go up and down with the crank as well.

It's only the cam that turns at 1/2 speed (because the cam gear has twice as many teeth as the crank gear)