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Nutsert Or Rivnut Installation

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Gary Lewis

Nutsert Or Rivnut Installation

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I'm going to be using using rivnuts to hold the bottom of my behind-the-seat storage unit to the cab, as discussed here. But I don't have any rivnuts so I ordered this assortment.

Then I got to thinking about how to install them and discovered this discussion of what they are and how to install them w/o the special tool at Spyder Industries. I watched the video and was sold. But, I can't figure out how to embed it here, so I did some more surfing and found this video that I can embed. The guy is quite wordy, but he eventually shows how to do it, albeit different than the way Spyder Industries recommends.

Do any of you have other recommendations?

Gary, AKA "Gary fellow": Profile

Dad's: '81 F150 Ranger XLT 4x4: Down for restomod: Full-roller "stroked 351M" w/Trick Flow heads & intake, EEC-V SEFI/E4OD/3.50 gears w/Kevlar clutches
Blue: 2015 F150 Platinum 4x4 SuperCrew wearing Blue Jeans & sporting a 3.5L EB & Max Tow
Big Blue: 1985 F250HD 4x4: 460/ZF5/3.55's, D60 w/Ox locker & 10.25 Sterling/Trutrac, Blue Top & Borgeson, & EEC-V MAF/SEFI

grumpin

Re: Nutsert Or Rivnut Installation

I’m not a rivnut fan, they’re handy for sure.

Cessna used them on some aircraft and the old 340’s had them on the wing root. They would work loose eventually and if you were lucky you could get some dikes under the screw and put on enough pressure to get the screw out.

We would replace them and do it again the next year or when we had to pull them.

Not trying to discourage you, just a heads up and they may work better in metal, I’ve not used them that I can remember in metal.

Dane
1986 F250HD SC XLT Lariat 4x4 460 C6-Sold
1992 Bronco XLT 4x4 351W E4OD
1998 GMC Sierra SLE K1500 350 4L60E
Arizona

Gary Lewis

Re: Nutsert Or Rivnut Installation

Administrator

Dane - Thanks. When they spin I'm sure it is a serious problem.

But by "in metal" do you mean "in steel"? Aren't the Cessna's aluminum? Perhaps that was a galvanic problem with a carbon bolt and the aluminum?

As for "in steel", don't our trucks have them in the doors for the mirrors? I tend to remember a problem with one of them, but it was badly corroded and the bolt was seized in the rivnut. As I remember, someone had replaced the stainless factory bolt with a plain steel one. But other than that I've not seen problems. Have you?

For the most part the rivnuts I've been around have worked well. Sure hope these do.

Gary, AKA "Gary fellow": Profile

85lebaront2

Re: Nutsert Or Rivnut Installation

Administrator

Gary, I have a similar (maybe the same) assortment in metric sizes (FWIW, the mirrors on Darth are attached with M6 X 1.0 screws). I have used mostly the M6 X 1.0 size as it is the closest to the sheet metal screws Chrysler loved on the K-cars. Only issue I found is the bigger the Nutsert, the more power it takes to completely seat it.

One place they will definitely be used is on the doors for the pull straps. Other then grabbing the outside of the door with the window down, it is the only place to pull the doors shut. Originally held by sheet metal screws on the ends, they will come loose and destroy the plastic end trim that covers the screw area.

Bill AKA "LOBO" Profile

"Getting old is inevitable, growing up is optional" Darth Vader 1986 F350 460 converted to MAF/SEFI, E4OD 12X3 1/2 rear brakes, traction loc 3:55 gear, 160 amp 3G alternator Wife's 2011 Flex Limited Daily Driver 2009 Flex Limited with factory tow package Project car 1986 Chrysler LeBaron convertible 2.2L Turbo II, modified A413

Gary Lewis

Re: Nutsert Or Rivnut Installation

Administrator

Bill - Pull straps/handles is one reason I got an assortment as I hope to put handles on the A-pillar and will want to bury nutserts there.

I thought about going metric, but most of my "stock" of fasteners is SAE so went that way. I think I have some flanged button-head 1/4-20 screws that are long enough to do this job, and I know I have 1/4" fender washers to put under them. So that's the plan, Stan.

How do you "set" your nutserts?

Gary, AKA "Gary fellow": Profile

kramttocs

Re: Nutsert Or Rivnut Installation

Administrator

This post was updated on .

In reply to this post by Gary Lewis

Yes - the door mirror mounts use them. The nos mirrors I bought came with a nut and bolt to set them. I haven't watched the video above yet to see how they do it.
HF sells a rivet gun looking tool to set them. Wasn't HF but this is the method I've used.

Like Dane, I've had mixed results with them spinning. Great when they don't but extremely frustrating when they do.

Update: I was thinking about it and on the handful that spun on me, I recall seeing what looked like loctite which almost guarantees spinning so can't blame the nutsert for that.

Scott
'Camano' 1986 F250 Supercab XLT Lariat 460/C6
'Chanute' 1980 F350 C&C 400/NP 435 - Gin Pole

But there ain't nothin' wrong with the radio

grumpin

Re: Nutsert Or Rivnut Installation

Yes I meant in steel. Aluminum in the aircraft and as you made me think (ouch), the rivnuts were aluminum also.

Dane
1986 F250HD SC XLT Lariat 4x4 460 C6-Sold
1992 Bronco XLT 4x4 351W E4OD
1998 GMC Sierra SLE K1500 350 4L60E
Arizona

old55pete

Re: Nutsert Or Rivnut Installation

In reply to this post by Gary Lewis

I use them all of the time on over the road trucks. In a lot of cases the cabs are built with them where they are not huck rivited. In some cases the hood latches are held in place with them. Mostly dash boards, floor boards, and intiror panels and the work fine. As has already been stated, they are a pain in the butt when they vibrate loose but they can be dealt with.

I have two sets of them, one set has metal inserts for use in metal and has an air powered tool that looks like a huck rivet gun. The other set is aluminum and can be used in steel or aluminum. Up to 3/8 can be done by hand with what looks like a pop riveter, over that the air gun is needed.

I have never seen them put in with a nut and bolt before, But I could see where it would work in a tight space or in a pinch.

Steve
86 Bronco, XLT, 5.0 EFI, EEC IV, AOD, IFS, limited slip front and rear, 3.08 gears, Tilt steering, factory AC

ArdWrknTrk

Re: Nutsert Or Rivnut Installation

Administrator

In reply to this post by Gary Lewis

All of my mirror mounts were stripped.
A couple have well nuts and five have nuts welded in flush with the door skin.

I have the big bolt cutter looking 1/4" blind rivet gun.
I bought some nut setter mandrels for that, but dont/wont use them on my truck.
Too many problems when they spin out.

Jim,
Lil'Red is a '87 F250 HD, 4.10's, 1356 4x4, Zf-5, 3G, PMGR, Saginaw PS, desmogged with a Holley 80508 and Performer intake.
Too much other stuff to mention.

kramttocs

Re: Nutsert Or Rivnut Installation

Administrator

What about applying a bit of panel adhesive around the flange before inserting it?

Scott
'Camano' 1986 F250 Supercab XLT Lariat 460/C6
'Chanute' 1980 F350 C&C 400/NP 435 - Gin Pole

But there ain't nothin' wrong with the radio

ArdWrknTrk

Re: Nutsert Or Rivnut Installation

Administrator

I'm just going to avoid using them.
When the metal is torn all around, a tee-nut welded in upside down makes a solid connection.

If the screw is seized into a riv-nut it is just as likely to tear out as spin.
I've got VERY little patience for playing around with that sort of thing.

Just like when I told Gary I would simply Velcro that tray to the back of the cab.
If I want bracket making and workarounds ill go rewatch Project Binky on YouTube.

Jim,
Lil'Red is a '87 F250 HD, 4.10's, 1356 4x4, Zf-5, 3G, PMGR, Saginaw PS, desmogged with a Holley 80508 and Performer intake.
Too much other stuff to mention.

Gary Lewis

Re: Nutsert Or Rivnut Installation

Administrator

Gary has a layer of sound deadening and foam across the back wall, so Velcro isn't going to work. And I don't want to pull the foam. So I'm looking at alternatives.

Gary, AKA "Gary fellow": Profile

ArdWrknTrk

Re: Nutsert Or Rivnut Installation

Administrator

I know you do.
And I know you are....

I'm sure you'll come up with a good solution. 😉

Jim,
Lil'Red is a '87 F250 HD, 4.10's, 1356 4x4, Zf-5, 3G, PMGR, Saginaw PS, desmogged with a Holley 80508 and Performer intake.
Too much other stuff to mention.

85lebaront2

Re: Nutsert Or Rivnut Installation

Administrator

In reply to this post by Gary Lewis

There is a tool that looks like a pop rivet tool, only bigger that has mandrels for the nutserts. The mendrels are threaded 14-20LH on the tool end and whatever thread you are using on the insert end. There is a travel stop (adjustable) to get the exact compression without stripping or under crimping.

I went with the metric as most of the body pieces on the konvertible are metric. Had a nice surprise the other day, was looking at the door strikers and trying to figure a way to repair them like you can do on a Ford. Found they are still available new, they were updated in 1998 for the minivans. If I could reach the inner ends, the updated ones had a 5/16 - or 8mm hex so they can be mostly tightened with the door shut.

Bill AKA "LOBO" Profile

Gary Lewis

Re: Nutsert Or Rivnut Installation

Administrator

The proper way to install a rivnut:

Of course, this is after you spend an hour cutting the head off the bolt with a Dremel, one little bit at a time 'cause the thing that's being held in is plastic. And, because you can't get on it from above, only the side.

Anyone want a 140-3=137 piece nutsert set?

I WAS WRONG! Y'ALL WERE RIGHT.

Gary, AKA "Gary fellow": Profile

JimsRebel

Re: Nutsert Or Rivnut Installation

I am not sure if you can get to the back side, but here is another option.
https://www.clickbond.com/
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xl_zYF7l-1g
https://www.aircraftspruce.com/catalog/hapages/clickbondstuds.php

Just another old aircraft mechanic that really hates rivnuts.

Jim

1986 F150 XLT Lariat 4x4 300 C6, 9 inch 3:50, 235-15 tires, sway bars and skid plates, DS2 dist with GM 4 pin IGN module and no computer. still using the feedback carb; 3G ALT swap, PMGR starter; 150,000 miles, 2nd owner

Gary Lewis

Re: Nutsert Or Rivnut Installation

Administrator

Jim - I wish I could get to the back, but I can't easily. However, thinking about it, I could have reached in where the grommets are and reached in there to some extent. But I doubt I would have been able to reach the one I put in the center.

Anyway, thanks for the suggestion.

Gary, AKA "Gary fellow": Profile

FuzzFace2

Re: Nutsert Or Rivnut Installation

The mirrors I got from LMC used the bolt & nut to set them in the doors.
I was able to use them on the lower bracket mounting bolts but not at the top.
The tops had a backer plate that was tapped for the bolts but the PO's striped them out.
I was able to get longer bolts with the right head and after starting the bolts was able to get lock nuts on them.
That was a show with the glass installed and getting tools on the nuts

Dave ----

Dave G.
81 F100 flare side 300 six / AA OD / NP435 / 2.75 gear
http://cars.grantskingdom1.com/index.php/1980-Ford-F100?page=1
81 F100 style side 300 six/SROD parts truck -RIP
http://cars.grantskingdom1.com/index.php/1981-Ford-F100

ArdWrknTrk

Re: Nutsert Or Rivnut Installation

Administrator

Sometimes you just have to get creative with a torch and grinder to get the wrench to fit.

I know I have a bunch of misshapen lumps in my 'special tools' drawer.
(One good thing about Craftsman selling open stock at Lowe's)

Jim,
Lil'Red is a '87 F250 HD, 4.10's, 1356 4x4, Zf-5, 3G, PMGR, Saginaw PS, desmogged with a Holley 80508 and Performer intake.
Too much other stuff to mention.

FuzzFace2

Re: Nutsert Or Rivnut Installation

ArdWrknTrk wrote

Sometimes you just have to get creative with a torch and grinder to get the wrench to fit.

Not after you just got through painting the truck after 4 years of rebuilding.
Or was that on the wrench

Dave ----