Help With Ford Part Numbers vs Vendor Info

Sports fans, I need you to help me think through the issue of whether to stick with just providing Ford part numbers in the documentation or to also include vendor part numbers.

This morning Randy/rcarlisle said this that is so accurate:

Personally, I think the biggest issue is our trucks aren't old enough to have a wealth of restoration parts and too old to have all the replacement parts we could need.   So we're left scavenging for whatever we can find.   So far, I've used LMC, NPD, Dennis Carpenter, Summit Racing (weatherstripping best price - go figure).  Plus Amazon and ebay, the local parts stores when possible.  Some vehicles you can basically build a whole vehicle from a catalog.   Finding Bullnose parts can be tough.

So while we could stick to just listing Ford part numbers, that's not terribly helpful as in many cases those parts are no longer available.  In that case maybe we should include vendor part numbers?  However, therein lies a problem as the vendor part numbers aren't always correct, and they may change them on us so we could be giving bad advice.

As an example, and what brought this up, let's take body/cab bushings.  If you go to our page on Documentation/Suspension & Steering/Body Mounts and then go to the Cab Mounts tab you'll see that I used a snippet from the LMC catalog to show the mounts, hardware, etc.  However, that catalog is wrong.  (If you want to read up on that look at these search results which show three threads where the problem is explained.)

So I'm now faced with modifying that page.  In fact, I've even had a request from a non-member to change our documentation because LMC's part number is wrong.  So I'm thinking through the best approach here and am coming up with only these three:

Ford Only: Include only Ford part numbers, even though those items are getting fewer and fewer in number and soon will be no longer available.  But in this scenario I'd delete the snippet of the LMC catalog and have to figure out what to put in its place.

Both Ford & Some Aftermarket: This would be like I did on the cab bushings where I provide both the Ford #'s and some info from aftermarket, like LMC.  But then I have bad info when the vendor is wrong, and LMC's #'s are wrong and they haven't fixed it in years after having been told of the problem.  So I'd have to mark up their catalog to show the right part number.  Seems doable and more helpful than the Ford-Only approach.

Ford PN's with Aftermarket Cross Ref: This would be the ultimate.  A table with all the Ford numbers and along side them the known aftermarket numbers.  But that is a HUGE undertaking so I'd have to have several someone's step up to own that responsibility as it is NOT something I can undertake on my own.

So, am I missing any other scenarios?  What's the best approach for us?  Anyone want to step up and help with this?  Please?

Okay. I don't want to derail Randy's thread either.
I'm glad to subscribe here.

Over there I said:
"There's no way I'd ask anybody to cross reference a vendors catalog.
Especially someone who already puts in so much time making the data available in the first place.
If you want the part, figure it out yourself!"

Show some initiative, make some kind of effort....
Or go hire it done (for better or worse)

Just the ability to get a p/n is HUGE!.....Even though the dealer parts counter won't lift a finger to find it the majority of the time.
If you want to make an annotation (as of xx/yy/zz I was able to find it at Acme Inc) that's up to you.
Im not going there with a vendor part number.
The Motorcraft number available right in the column of the MPC is an exception.

People need to figure out how to plug a factory p/n into an auto parts store website and take note of the alternatives.
People then need to put their big boy pants on and then go look for those other numbers too.

Just this morning I dug a little deeper to find a "proper" OEM delay valve on eBay.
Not that the number I first gave the guy wouldn't have worked. (I know it does, because I used it two decades ago!)

I say what's behind door #1.
While you want the most comprehensive Bullnose resource on the web, there are already several lifetimes of information uncompiled for you to bite off as you choose.
Delete LMC and put nothing in it's place...
Anything else is unsubstantiated. Heck, even the factory is wrong in a few places.

Honestly, I was hoping Vic would have stepped up.
I can't accomplish much of anything on this phone.

For me personally I would go look for a part on my own before asking here.  If I was to ask here it is because I was having difficulty locating it.  Even then I would only expect a location of where I could find it and not a part number.  Then I can go to that location and search for the part myself.

What I see sometimes (mostly on other sites) is someone ask for where to find an item and then a bunch of members chime in with a bunch of locations not knowing if that location actually has the item.  That is not very helpful.

So for me, I prefer locations of where to find a specific part based on someone actually purchasing or seeing the part for sale at that location.

But this is what I'm saying, Carl.
If you ask where you can get X, I can poke around and find X.
Crossing an aftermarket number in the documentation is very different from that.
Static v/s dynamic.

For Gary or anyone else to annotate the factory parts list means that has to be kept current.
NOS stocks dry up. We're not likely to find a stash of Bullnose parts gathering dust in a warehouse.
Specialist suppliers go out of business when the vehicles haven't been around for 35 years.
Some numbers like LMC's cab mounts or Inline Tube's fuel lines are just wrong all together.

Ok guys, thanks for the input.  I'm hoping others will chime in as well, so will hold my comments for a bit.

I've been through this myself looking for something as simple as a 4x4 shifter boot, radiator overflow tank, weather stripping, etc. The stuff that the vendors provide can be found with a little bit of web surfing. What they don't provide needs to be sourced using Ford part numbers and nomenclature through ebay, Facebook Market Place, etc. Also, those vendor part numbers are ever changing and not the same between vendors. I've seen this sourcing parts for my Mustang over the years. Basically, you'll work yourself to death trying to keep up with it. So, quite frankly Gary, you are wasting a huge amount of your time in such an endeavor as discussed.

 Some of what I like to see is what is coming or recently reproduced. I also like to see what is the better product between items already produced. I can tell you not all the seals and weather stripping is equal.

I rarely look at Ford part numbers.   I rarely ask for a part here unless I can't find it elsewhere.  I'm a good googler in most cases.  And sometimes when I am posting a question, I end up finding it myself.  

Any kind of cross-reference doc is going to be huge and ever changing.  When vendors run out of a part and quit carrying it, the reference becomes obsolete on a part that is mostly obsolete already.  

I kinda have to agree with Jim - you gotta put in some effort yourself.  I look at several options for any one part and try to get the best part fo the money I can justify.  Not always the best Ford part or whatever.  

Jonathan's revival is interesting to me - he is going way farther than I ever would and he has more patience than I ever will.  I admire his revival.  His truck is same paint as mine was originally and very similarly optioned, except his is LWB and mine is SWB so it's interesting to see what parts he uses as opposed to what I have used and such.  We are constantly texting about what parts we can find and comparing.

We are all building the knowledge base as we go.  I have a spreadsheet on my truck and if someone asks, I can refer to that and give them an idea or link of where I bought what part.  Even if it isn't listed here, I have ideas...

With that said, could there be a sheet that is editable by members?  Maybe restrict it to folks with a certain number of posts that show they are a real member and not a troll?   Then as we buy parts, if we are so inclined, there could be a column for date, part #, short descr, price, link?  I don't pretend to know how to run a site like this and that is a suggestion that might be part of a better solution down the road somewhere.  Just one page of site devoted to part numbers would seem to be too immense to take on.  And that goes back to what Jim said and so many folks on forums say about finding it yourself.  Put some skin in the game of your truck.   If I see someone asking for a part that is easy to find, I am reluctant to help if I know it was easy to find.  

It's a great idea - now the folks that have more brain for such will have to figure out if it's even possible. Good luck y'all.

Gary Lewis wrote

Sports fans, I need you to help me think through the issue of whether to stick with just providing Ford part numbers in the documentation or to also include vendor part numbers.

This morning Randy/rcarlisle said this that is so accurate:

Personally, I think the biggest issue is our trucks aren't old enough to have a wealth of restoration parts and too old to have all the replacement parts we could need.   So we're left scavenging for whatever we can find.   So far, I've used LMC, NPD, Dennis Carpenter, Summit Racing (weatherstripping best price - go figure).  Plus Amazon and ebay, the local parts stores when possible.  Some vehicles you can basically build a whole vehicle from a catalog.   Finding Bullnose parts can be tough.

The age of the trucks is only one issue, and while Randy is correct, I think what complicates it even further is that there were a huge amount of changes during the relatively short Bullnose truck lifespan. That makes it difficult for the aftermarket companies to try and figure out what parts fit what trucks.

A 1981 Bullnose with a 5.8L engine is a completely different animal than a 1982 Bullnose with a 5.8L engine lol. I've watched some guys really suffer trying to order parts for the 351's. That and King pins to ball joints, 9" diff to 8.8, regular carb, feedback carb, EFI, plus a dozen other common items. There were three different 4spd/OD manual transmissions.

Anyway...my opinion is if you find a mistake in a vendors listing then sure correct or alter the site documentation, but I wouldn't do anything more than that. The whole reason for these forums in the first place is for people to share their knowledge and help others out.

Bullnoses are full of 70's era Ford part numbers, and now also 90's era Ford part numbers, so I wouldn't go through the trouble of trying to manage all of that. I'd handle on an individual basis and inquiries come up. That's just my 2 cents Gary.

Gary, and others, it is not just the Bullnose parts, anything pre 1998 is getting to be fun. My best friend (we've know each other nearly 50 years) has a 1995 F350 crew cab dual rear wheel truck with a first generation Powerstroke. He dumped a serpentine belt recently due to an idler disintegrating. It took him going to a dealer who sells on-line to even find one, no aftermarket match. He got the last one they had.

Part of this is the manufacturers wanting you to buy new trucks and part probably goes back as far as the "cash for clunkers". The eco types want us all driving EVs rather than internal combustion engine vehicles. As for aftermarket support, a lot of the reproduction stuff is made in China for cost reasons so instead of getting a nicely made, perfect fit part, you get something, that if you are lucky can be made to work.

Sources, Rock Auto is one that you have to be careful with as they do not have the updated parts from TSBs or recalls. Specific example, when I converted Darth to EFI and installed the E4OD, I ordered a new plug for the range sensor switch (works as a neutral safety and backup lights control and tells the computer which gear you have selected PRND21 as OD lockout is electronic. Ford updated the E4OD switch due to water incursion. If you order a complete switch, the new switch includes the pigtail kit to update to the 1994 up style. RA makes no mention of this nor due a number of other sources. I ended up with a pigtail for the early switch, which my transmission already had the newer switch, the plug was damaged which was the reason for the replacement. Gary's favorite, Amazon, can give you some strange results, like telling me the Kelsey-Hayes pigtail to connect the Genesis brake controller to my 2009 Flex with factory trailer tow package wouldn't fit. It was the exact PN K-H specified for my application, or ordering a replacement fuel pump for my turbo II engine, the one they sent did not remotely fit, it was loose in the noise isolater used in the pump hanger.

At least Ford is still the same company, try figuring out Chrysler stuff. I am trying to remember how many changes, it was Chrysler Corporation when my 1986 convertible was built, then came Chrysler LLC under Cerebus Capital, Daimler-Chrysler, Fiat Chrysler Automobiles (FCA) and now Stellantis. It means my LeBaron, is now related to Fiat, Peugeot, Renault, Maserati, Ferrari and a few others, not counting ancestors of the current ones, like Hudson, Nash, Rambler. The bad thing is the major decisions are coming from Europe.

Sometimes you just have to be a Bullnose nerd to know what to call it.
Without that, you are very hindered.
The whole spirit of this forum is positive and supportive.
I will gladly share what little I know.

Gary's documentation is OCR'd and searchable.
But if you plug in "cruise control" you're not going to get a speed control servo.

I made the suggestion to have a vendor review section.
Hoping that this would give people fair warning and allow happy customers to rave about exemplary service.

I also vote for Ford Only. While anything else would no doubt be useful to someone at some point, the maintenance is too much and I don't see when it would ever stop. Let google do what it does best

My personal opinion is to stay far, far away from trying to include any cross-references to any other site for any other reason, too much work to implement & maintain.

~~

Lots of good stuff came out here, for some reason I kinda want to explain this... the Taurus SHO has a bitty, little vacuum canister controller thinger, something with the 4-barrels... long obsolete by Ford, BUT the exact same part is available with an updated number belonging to a newer-gen application. I don't remember the specifics, but I guess the point is, get to know your shit and figure out what works and how.

ctubutis wrote

My personal opinion is to stay far, far away from trying to include any cross-references to any other site for any other reason, too much work to implement & maintain.

~~

Lots of good stuff came out here, for some reason I kinda want to explain this... the Taurus SHO has a bitty, little vacuum canister controller thinger, something with the 4-barrels... long obsolete by Ford, BUT the exact same part is available with an updated number belonging to a newer-gen application. I don't remember the specifics, but I guess the point is, get to know your shit and figure out what works and how.

Especially when you can use the OE part number on a few of the vendor sites that sell for our truck.  Dennis-Carpenter uses the OE part numbers as their part numbers.  NPD allows you to search OE number and get results on most things.  Jeffs Bronco Graveyard (or is that junkyard I can never remember) also brings up hits when I punch in OE part numbers in some instances.