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Hello All - 1986 F150, 2wd, base trim, 300 engine, 4 speed

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shosh86

Re: Hello All - 1986 F150, 2wd, base trim, 300 engine, 4 speed

What's the reason you don't use HEIs on restorations?

1986 F150, 300 engine, 4 speed, 2WD, base trim

mat in tn

Re: Hello All - 1986 F150, 2wd, base trim, 300 engine, 4 speed

ford did not offer them

ArdWrknTrk

Re: Hello All - 1986 F150, 2wd, base trim, 300 engine, 4 speed

Administrator

In reply to this post by shosh86

I think the biggest reason is that if it fails you have to order a new one from Timbuktu.
Where as most local auto parts have a DS-iI module or distributor (or can get one that day)
I've got nothing against an HEI as an 'all-in-one' solution for converting or eliminating EEC-III/IV as long as you understand that it won't run right on the stock coil power and you must wire it up with a relay + minimum 12Ga fused power in start and run.

Jim,
Lil'Red is a '87 F250 HD, 4.10's, 1356 4x4, Zf-5, 3G, PMGR, Saginaw PS, desmogged with a Holley 80508 and Performer intake.
Too much other stuff to mention.

Gary Lewis

Re: Hello All - 1986 F150, 2wd, base trim, 300 engine, 4 speed

Administrator

Right, and right.

High Energy Ignition, HEI, was designed by GM and used on their vehicles from '75 until computers took over that task. And even then there were HEI systems that had computer connections.

And right that they are power hungry and require at least a 12 gauge wire from the battery to the ignition. But you can't find that much power controlled by the ignition switch under the hood of a Ford vehicle so you have to install a relay.

It isn't so much the wattage that is used in the ignition as it is the massive inrush current that is used to charge the coil. So while overall it would look like smaller wire would be fine, you need the larger wire to handle the short burst of high current as the ignition is preparing to fire the next plug.

Gary, AKA "Gary fellow": Profile

Dad's: '81 F150 Ranger XLT 4x4: Down for restomod: Full-roller "stroked 351M" w/Trick Flow heads & intake, EEC-V SEFI/E4OD/3.50 gears w/Kevlar clutches
Blue: 2015 F150 Platinum 4x4 SuperCrew wearing Blue Jeans & sporting a 3.5L EB & Max Tow
Big Blue: 1985 F250HD 4x4: 460/ZF5/3.55's, D60 w/Ox locker & 10.25 Sterling/Trutrac, Blue Top & Borgeson, & EEC-V MAF/SEFI

Gary Lewis

Re: Hello All - 1986 F150, 2wd, base trim, 300 engine, 4 speed

Administrator

I remembered that there is a writeup regarding this on the page at Documentation/Electrical/Ignition and then the Ignition Simplification and the One-Wire tabs. In part it says:

The power to a one-wire needs to be substantial since they require a lot of current, and should be at least a #12 wire. You can get that power from Circuit 37, which is a large yellow wire that is usually dead-ended below the brake master cylinder. If you have a factory auxiliary battery you'll have a relay on the firewall to the right of the master cylinder, and Circuit 37 will be connected to it, as shown below. Or, if you have the trailering option or a DRW truck you may have a power stud on the firewall with Circuit #37 connected to it. In any case you can connect to that circuit to get battery power for the ignition. However, you should put a fuse, probably a 20a one, in the circuit as that wire uses a fusible link that is capable of far more current than you need for the one-wire distributor.

So if you have that circuit, and you should, then you can connect to it for your HEI. But as that wire is hot at all times you still need the relay. And I'd still fuse it.

You can see a suggested wiring diagram for the relay on that page.

Gary, AKA "Gary fellow": Profile

ArdWrknTrk

Re: Hello All - 1986 F150, 2wd, base trim, 300 engine, 4 speed

Administrator

That's a good little write up Gary. 👍

Thanks for the illustration and spelling out where it can be found on the site.

Jim,
Lil'Red is a '87 F250 HD, 4.10's, 1356 4x4, Zf-5, 3G, PMGR, Saginaw PS, desmogged with a Holley 80508 and Performer intake.
Too much other stuff to mention.

Gary Lewis

Re: Hello All - 1986 F150, 2wd, base trim, 300 engine, 4 speed

Administrator

Welcome, Jim. As the curator of the site I usually know where things are ... buried.

Gary, AKA "Gary fellow": Profile

grumpin

Re: Hello All - 1986 F150, 2wd, base trim, 300 engine, 4 speed

In reply to this post by shosh86

Welcome!

Dane
1986 F250HD SC XLT Lariat 4x4 460 C6-Sold
1992 Bronco XLT 4x4 351W E4OD
1998 GMC Sierra SLE K1500 350 4L60E
Arizona

shosh86

Re: Hello All - 1986 F150, 2wd, base trim, 300 engine, 4 speed

Dane, thanks very much.

Y’all know anything about CRT Performance’s distributors? They make an HEI one for the Ford 300. Similar price to the A-Team distributor.

https://crtperformance.com/shop/ols/products/ford-i6-144-170-200-250

1986 F150, 300 engine, 4 speed, 2WD, base trim

Gary Lewis

Re: Hello All - 1986 F150, 2wd, base trim, 300 engine, 4 speed

Administrator

When I encounter things that appear to be the same it suggests to me that they are. I believe that the Chinese buy an original, reverse engineer it, and then hand out the plans to a manufacturer who makes them and then markets them under several different brands. In other words, since many of the spec's are the same I'd bet they are the same.

I ran into this several years ago with a lathe/mill/drill I wanted to buy. Harbor Freight made one that was fairly well liked so I bought it. But one specialty tee-nut was bad on the one I got so I pulled out the drawings to find the part number. Lo and behold the drawings were wrong. It was a completely different part and the way that nut was drawn was wonky. Like the drawing we did in drafting where it was impossible to make.

So I called HF customer support and got no where. The young lady I drew had never seen one of those machines much less used one, and couldn't read a CAD drawing. So I did some research and learned that several others sold essentially the same machine, including Busy Bee and Grizzly. I downloaded the Busy Bee manual and it had the exact same error. I downloaded the Grizzly manual and it had the exact same error.

Given that I called Grizzly and when I told the gentleman that answered what part was bad he said "Let me pull the drawings and find the part number." I waited and then I heard "You can't even make that part!" And I laughed. So he said "I'm going to go take one of those apart and find out what the part number is and I'll call you back." In 30 minutes he did and said "They are $2, how many do you want? And, we are changing the drawings."

Now I'm a Grizzly customer.

Gary, AKA "Gary fellow": Profile

ArdWrknTrk

Re: Hello All - 1986 F150, 2wd, base trim, 300 engine, 4 speed

Administrator

Grizzly has great parts support and badge engineering means that I've bought parts from them for a couple of my Jet machines and a ShopFox as well.

Lots of tools today come from the same castings with different tolerances, colours, controls and some with different features depending on the price point.
It is no surprise that a better knob, switch or motor can transform a tool from almost passable to a pleasure to use.

Gary, I have to say my experience with getting parts from Harbor Freight was quite different than yours.
Obviously their QC was lacking if their Smithy clone's T-nut didn't function.
I guess Grizzly got ahold of good parts even if the drawings are wrong?

Jim,
Lil'Red is a '87 F250 HD, 4.10's, 1356 4x4, Zf-5, 3G, PMGR, Saginaw PS, desmogged with a Holley 80508 and Performer intake.
Too much other stuff to mention.

Gary Lewis

Re: Hello All - 1986 F150, 2wd, base trim, 300 engine, 4 speed

Administrator

I think my problem was the luck of the draw, and it was compounded by the drawing being wrong. I think HF would have had the part if we’d been able to find the part number. But their support people knew nothing of the machine while Grizzly’s did.

I still buy HF stuff, but were I to buy a lathe or mill I’d look at Grizzly as they provided excellent support.

Gary, AKA "Gary fellow": Profile

shosh86

Re: Hello All - 1986 F150, 2wd, base trim, 300 engine, 4 speed

In reply to this post by Gary Lewis

For the HEI install, any advice on how to connect a 12 gauge wire to that enormous yellow wire under the brake booster?

Does anyone sell the male connector that mates with the female connector on the end of the yellow wire? If not, and I have to clip the connector off (hate to do that), how would y’all deal with the large change in wire gauge (huge yellow wire to 12 AWG).

1986 F150, 300 engine, 4 speed, 2WD, base trim

ArdWrknTrk

Re: Hello All - 1986 F150, 2wd, base trim, 300 engine, 4 speed

Administrator

I'd suggest a yellow (10-12Ga) marine butt splice to pin 30 of your relay socket.

Don't forget where Gary suggests adding a fuse in line.
While others might have differing opinions, I would probably use a fuse holder that takes the same ATC style fuses as the truck's main panel.
At least that's what I've done with auxiliary circuits like my fog lamps in an effort to KIS.

Jim,
Lil'Red is a '87 F250 HD, 4.10's, 1356 4x4, Zf-5, 3G, PMGR, Saginaw PS, desmogged with a Holley 80508 and Performer intake.
Too much other stuff to mention.

shosh86

Re: Hello All - 1986 F150, 2wd, base trim, 300 engine, 4 speed

Ah yes, I’m going to fuse it 20A. I got a nice waterproof ATC fuse holder with 12 gauge wires.

So the yellow wire is 10 or 12 gauge?

1986 F150, 300 engine, 4 speed, 2WD, base trim

ArdWrknTrk

Re: Hello All - 1986 F150, 2wd, base trim, 300 engine, 4 speed

Administrator

The EVTM shows fuselinks H & M as being 14ga and Ford's convention is to size the link two smaller than the wire it is protecting. This would suggest to me that the yellow always hot cab feed is a 10 Ga wire.

I don't have a harness to look at right now but I would say it is a safe bet.

Jim,
Lil'Red is a '87 F250 HD, 4.10's, 1356 4x4, Zf-5, 3G, PMGR, Saginaw PS, desmogged with a Holley 80508 and Performer intake.
Too much other stuff to mention.

shosh86

Re: Hello All - 1986 F150, 2wd, base trim, 300 engine, 4 speed

Thanks Jim. I got the HEI in and everything went pretty smooth but in the end I could not get the truck to start.

I got the engine to top dead center on compression stroke. I believe I found the correct line on the harmonic balancer. It’s faint but definitely an engraved line.

Put HEI in, seated all the way. Rotor pointing to where old rotor was pointing at TDC. Rotated distributor housing so 1st plug terminal is in line with rotor. Snugged it up. Wired plugs 1-5-3-6-2-4 clockwise.

Ran a 12 gauge wire from distributor directly to battery, just for now to test.

But it just wouldn’t turn over. I put a timing light on the first plug wire and it is getting spark. Didn’t have time to check the other wires. But any ideas at this point?

1986 F150, 300 engine, 4 speed, 2WD, base trim

ArdWrknTrk

Re: Hello All - 1986 F150, 2wd, base trim, 300 engine, 4 speed

Administrator

I think clockwise is correct on the 300 engine.
If you have spark and compression the only thing that could be missing is fuel...

Is the float bowl full?
Have you tried I splash of gas or shot of ether down the carb throat?

Jim,
Lil'Red is a '87 F250 HD, 4.10's, 1356 4x4, Zf-5, 3G, PMGR, Saginaw PS, desmogged with a Holley 80508 and Performer intake.
Too much other stuff to mention.

shosh86

Re: Hello All - 1986 F150, 2wd, base trim, 300 engine, 4 speed

I haven’t tried that but it was running just before I replaced the distributor.

I think I’ll find TDC on compression stroke again and reseat all the plug wires.

1986 F150, 300 engine, 4 speed, 2WD, base trim

shosh86

Re: Hello All - 1986 F150, 2wd, base trim, 300 engine, 4 speed

This post was updated on .

Ok no luck on the foregoing. I can get it to run very poorly and very fast if I hold my foot on the gas while starting. But then it immediately dies if I let foot off or starter off. Also, pretty strong smell of gas under the hood.

1986 F150, 300 engine, 4 speed, 2WD, base trim

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