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1985 F350 460 vs 1989 E350 460 engine

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Gary Lewis

Re: 1985 F350 460 vs 1989 E350 460 engine

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Prashant made it here today, and plans to be in Atlanta in the morning for a meeting. So, apparently he's driving most of the night. Anyway, here are a few pics to prove he was here.

Gary, AKA "Gary fellow": Profile

Dad's: '81 F150 Ranger XLT 4x4: Down for restomod: Full-roller "stroked 351M" w/Trick Flow heads & intake, EEC-V SEFI/E4OD/3.50 gears w/Kevlar clutches
Blue: 2015 F150 Platinum 4x4 SuperCrew wearing Blue Jeans & sporting a 3.5L EB & Max Tow
Big Blue: 1985 F250HD 4x4: 460/ZF5/3.55's, D60 w/Ox locker & 10.25 Sterling/Trutrac, Blue Top & Borgeson, & EEC-V MAF/SEFI

85lebaront2

Re: 1985 F350 460 vs 1989 E350 460 engine

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If he's lucky that dog won't drop it's transmission before he gets there.

Bill AKA "LOBO" Profile

"Getting old is inevitable, growing up is optional" Darth Vader 1986 F350 460 converted to MAF/SEFI, E4OD 12X3 1/2 rear brakes, traction loc 3:55 gear, 160 amp 3G alternator Wife's 2011 Flex Limited Daily Driver 2009 Flex Limited with factory tow package Project car 1986 Chrysler LeBaron convertible 2.2L Turbo II, modified A413

Gary Lewis

Re: 1985 F350 460 vs 1989 E350 460 engine

Administrator

For a number of reasons he is taking it easy, driving about 60 MPH. That should help the tranny. But, it is obvious that truck doesn't have a tow package on it.

Also, he's getting 9 MPG at 60 MPH with that Hemi. We got the same pulling Big Blue and LOTS of parts at 75 MPG w/my Ecoboost.

Gary, AKA "Gary fellow": Profile

85lebaront2

Re: 1985 F350 460 vs 1989 E350 460 engine

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Damn, I used to get that towing with Darth at 65-70 mph.

Bill AKA "LOBO" Profile

Gary Lewis

Re: 1985 F350 460 vs 1989 E350 460 engine

Administrator

I'll put my 3.5L EB up against a Hemi in a Ram pickup any day and under any condition. Acceleration, towing, or MPG. In fact, the only place the Hemi wins is in sound - the little EB just doesn't sound cool.

Darth might be a similar story, although I suspect Darth would get better MPG than the Hemi under loaded conditions. But think about how much more solid Darth would be as a tow vehicle than the Ram. The Ram is a light 1/2 ton with coil springs in the rear, no trailer brake controller, probably no serious tranny cooler, and a high axle ratio.

Gary, AKA "Gary fellow": Profile

PetesPonies

Re: 1985 F350 460 vs 1989 E350 460 engine

He has no brake controller towing that heavy trailer that far???????????????? He will need brakes as soon as he "makes" it home, wow. I've towed a small auto trailer with no brakes . . for a couple hours. I can't imagine going that far, with no brakes on a trailer that heavy.

Pete's Ponies
Mustang RUSToration & Performance

1982 F100 Flareside
1983 Bronco

Gary Lewis

Re: 1985 F350 460 vs 1989 E350 460 engine

Administrator

Yup. Just looked at the Ram chart. Assuming that truck has 3.21 gears, which are the standard gears, it is rated to tow 6,870 lbs. My 2015 F150 is rated to tow about 5000 lbs more than that. But even if it had the tow package and 3.92 gears it would still be 1000 lbs less than mine.

Gary, AKA "Gary fellow": Profile

khaitan

Re: 1985 F350 460 vs 1989 E350 460 engine

In reply to this post by PetesPonies

Ha ha yes Pete. I was nervous but made it with no problem. It was rental truck so didn't care. I just had to pump the brake Patel few times to make a hard stop. 😊

Cheers,
Prashant
"Ford trucks are nuts, so am I"

1986 F150 single cab with 460 and ZF-5s47
1985 F350 dual cab with 460 and T-19

PetesPonies

Re: 1985 F350 460 vs 1989 E350 460 engine

Some states it is illegal . .possibly some you passed through :) Good thing there were no problems.

Pete's Ponies
Mustang RUSToration & Performance

1982 F100 Flareside
1983 Bronco

Nothing Special

Re: 1985 F350 460 vs 1989 E350 460 engine

PetesPonies wrote

Some states it is illegal . .possibly some you passed through :) Good thing there were no problems.

In Minnesota you need trailer brakes for trailers over 3000 lbs (or any trailer that outweighs the towing vehicle, even if it's under 3000 lbs). I doubt that about 8000 lbs is legal without trailer brakes in many states at all.

Bob
Sorry, no '80 - '86 Ford trucks
"Oswald": 1997 F-250HD crew cab short box, 460, E4OD, 4.10 gears
"Pluto": 1971 Bronco, 302, NV3550 5 speed, Atlas 4.3:1 transfer case, 33" tires
"the motorhome": 2015 E-450-based 28' class C motorhome, 6.8L V-10
"the Dodge": 2007 Dodge 2500, 6.7L Cummins

85lebaront2

Re: 1985 F350 460 vs 1989 E350 460 engine

Administrator

This post was updated on .

In reply to this post by 85lebaront2

Ok, for the edification of all, here are some pictures, I used my new engine on the stand, but also have some pictures of the EFI accessories and brackets on the carbureted engine.<

Lower front of engine

Front, no brackets

Front with brackets

EFI AC bracket on carbureted head

Bill AKA "LOBO" Profile

ArdWrknTrk

Re: 1985 F350 460 vs 1989 E350 460 engine

Administrator

Good photos Bill

The serpentine accessory brackets on the efi engine are very different from the carbureted V-belt ones.
One hole in the front of each head is tapped larger to accommodate.

Thermactor plumbing is far different and there is a Cat on '88& up trucks.

Because of the different valve geometry piston cutouts are different for efi engines.

Efi engines have a 'straight up' double roller timing chain from the factory.

The heads use center bolt cast valve covers and the manifold flanges (both I&e) are different.

Early efi engines have big chambers and smaller piston dish than later F3TE castings.
A popular swap is late heads on an early short block for a little more compression.

if you want a carb on an efi engine with a manual gearbox the simple solution is Price Motorsport's CA 460-efi.
This fits a square bore onto the efi lower manifold and comes with brass plugs for the injector bosses.

Jim,
Lil'Red is a '87 F250 HD, 4.10's, 1356 4x4, Zf-5, 3G, PMGR, Saginaw PS, desmogged with a Holley 80508 and Performer intake.
Too much other stuff to mention.

Gary Lewis

Re: 1985 F350 460 vs 1989 E350 460 engine

Administrator

This post was updated on .

Bill - Thanks for making the pics bigger. 👍

Jim - That helps my learning on 460’s. Thanks. Now I understand that the valve covers in a pic that Brandon sent from a salvage in CA were probably EFI ones. Right?

Gary, AKA "Gary fellow": Profile

85lebaront2

Re: 1985 F350 460 vs 1989 E350 460 engine

Administrator

This post was updated on .

In reply to this post by ArdWrknTrk

Jim, the hole I highlighted, is not tapped larger on EFI heads, but is on carbureted heads. I highlighted that for reference as to which one was different. When I first installed the EFI mounting brackets I had to enlarge the hole in the A/C and PS side so I could use a 1/2-13 bolt there.

The brackets in the picture are an extra set I purchased off a blown up 460 so I could have them cleaned, clear coated and pre-mounted to the new engine.

Bill AKA "LOBO" Profile

ArdWrknTrk

Re: 1985 F350 460 vs 1989 E350 460 engine

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In reply to this post by Gary Lewis

Yes Gary, those are efi valve covers.
If you want a pair I will strip them off my future short block.

Jim,
Lil'Red is a '87 F250 HD, 4.10's, 1356 4x4, Zf-5, 3G, PMGR, Saginaw PS, desmogged with a Holley 80508 and Performer intake.
Too much other stuff to mention.

Gary Lewis

Re: 1985 F350 460 vs 1989 E350 460 engine

Administrator

Thanks, but my heads aren’t EFI so I’ll get along with the OMC ones better. 😉

Gary, AKA "Gary fellow": Profile

ArdWrknTrk

Re: 1985 F350 460 vs 1989 E350 460 engine

Administrator

Gary, how far SE of you is Hulbert, OK?

Maybe I should follow through on the whole OMC 460 thing?

Jim,
Lil'Red is a '87 F250 HD, 4.10's, 1356 4x4, Zf-5, 3G, PMGR, Saginaw PS, desmogged with a Holley 80508 and Performer intake.
Too much other stuff to mention.

Gary Lewis

Re: 1985 F350 460 vs 1989 E350 460 engine

Administrator

You found a complete OMC 460?

Gary, AKA "Gary fellow": Profile

85lebaront2

Re: 1985 F350 460 vs 1989 E350 460 engine

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The gentleman who built my engine told me the real reason the 460s weren't popular in stern drives was the torque, they could blow the upper gear box right off the drive, they had to put gear boxes for deisels on them, one for a 454 would explode with a 460.

Bill AKA "LOBO" Profile

ArdWrknTrk

Re: 1985 F350 460 vs 1989 E350 460 engine

Administrator

In reply to this post by Gary Lewis

No, just heads.

My quest continues....

I've never heard that gearboxes or outdrives can't handle the torque.
Just that things go sideways very quickly when massive power tears the engines loose from their bunks.
If they get loose *even a little* the misalignment will cause a lot of damage.

On another note everyone at the boatyard says you can never trust the French big block.
460's rule for longevity and the Olds 455 if you must have GM.

Jim,
Lil'Red is a '87 F250 HD, 4.10's, 1356 4x4, Zf-5, 3G, PMGR, Saginaw PS, desmogged with a Holley 80508 and Performer intake.
Too much other stuff to mention.

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