1985 F350 Transmission Options

[FuzzFace2]

I dont think a T19 / T18 / NP435 are bad transmissions for a cruiser.

It's not like you are going to be speed shifting any top loader (ZF or M5OD) transmission.

BTW I run a NP435 in my 4x2 81 F100 Flare Side cruiser and like it.

Besides with the granny first it goes nice cruising the parking lots LOL

Dave ----

[BabeTheBlueOx]

I’m going to play devil’s advocate perhaps?

I could be mistaken, but I do not believe that the NP205 ever came in a bullnose era truck. If your transfer case is a swap, do you know for sure that the transmission is a T19 from 1985?

Shoot.

Thank you for playing devil's advocate. It's a T-18, non-synchro'd, LOW 1st gear. And I knew that. I'm not sure at what point I started thinking it was a T-19. I'm 100% sure it's an NP205, I pulled it out and rebuilt it according to a great

because it was leaking transmission fluid though the in/output shaft seals like a hose.

OD is a nice-to-have, a "usable" 1st gear is a nice-to-have, and a syncro'd 1st gear would be nice-to-have.

It's really the ease of shifting that's the big dea. Your description of a T-19 is the polar opposite of what this T-18 is like. I've been driving manuals my whole life, and sometimes it takes me so long to get it into 3rd or 4th that I have to abandon the effort and speed up again in a lower gear.

It sounds like you're thinking that the transmission might be old, tired, and/or broken?

Right, the NP205 never came in a Bullnose. And you are right, Jonathan, that combo is going to be expensive.

Avoiding expensive is a "must have".

A quick google search says that T-19's can have a 4.02 1st gear ratio, which would be less severe than the 6.32 ratio on the T-18. And there seems to be a lot of them out there for a reasonable price.

 

[Gary Lewis]

I’m going to play devil’s advocate perhaps?

I could be mistaken, but I do not believe that the NP205 ever came in a bullnose era truck. If your transfer case is a swap, do you know for sure that the transmission is a T19 from 1985?

Shoot.

Thank you for playing devil's advocate. It's a T-18, non-synchro'd, LOW 1st gear. And I knew that. I'm not sure at what point I started thinking it was a T-19. I'm 100% sure it's an NP205, I pulled it out and rebuilt it according to a great

because it was leaking transmission fluid though the in/output shaft seals like a hose.

OD is a nice-to-have, a "usable" 1st gear is a nice-to-have, and a syncro'd 1st gear would be nice-to-have.

It's really the ease of shifting that's the big dea. Your description of a T-19 is the polar opposite of what this T-18 is like. I've been driving manuals my whole life, and sometimes it takes me so long to get it into 3rd or 4th that I have to abandon the effort and speed up again in a lower gear.

It sounds like you're thinking that the transmission might be old, tired, and/or broken?

Right, the NP205 never came in a Bullnose. And you are right, Jonathan, that combo is going to be expensive.

Avoiding expensive is a "must have".

A quick google search says that T-19's can have a 4.02 1st gear ratio, which would be less severe than the 6.32 ratio on the T-18. And there seems to be a lot of them out there for a reasonable price.

Our calculator (Documentation/Driveline/Calculators) has the ratios built in for all of the transmissions these trucks came with as well as several more. And Ford T19's did come with a 4.02 first gear - in the diesel. But behind a 460 they came with a 5.11 first gear. The diesel tranny is the "close-ratio" one and has completely different ratios than the wide-ratio for the 460's. You might ask Jonathan what he thinks about using the close-ratio T19 behind a gasser.

As for the NP205, I'm not doubting you have one. I'm just saying the truck didn't come with it - at least Ford's documentation says it didn't. You can see the Master Parts Catalog's information of transfer case applications at Documentation/Driveline/Transfer Cases.

And, by the way, the calculator has the t-case gear ratios in it as well.

[BabeTheBlueOx]

Our calculator (Documentation/Driveline/Calculators) has the ratios built in for all of the transmissions these trucks came with as well as several more. And Ford T19's did come with a 4.02 first gear - in the diesel. But behind a 460 they came with a 5.11 first gear. The diesel tranny is the "close-ratio" one and has completely different ratios than the wide-ratio for the 460's. You might ask Jonathan what he thinks about using the close-ratio T19 behind a gasser.

As for the NP205, I'm not doubting you have one. I'm just saying the truck didn't come with it - at least Ford's documentation says it didn't. You can see the Master Parts Catalog's information of transfer case applications at Documentation/Driveline/Transfer Cases.

And, by the way, the calculator has the t-case gear ratios in it as well.

The calculator is great - thanks for pointing it out.

I appreciate the NP205 information, it's invaluable to know what's original and what's not before I start trying to fix things and order parts. I've gotten burned a few times already with that scenario already.

[Ford F834]

I’m going to play devil’s advocate perhaps?

I could be mistaken, but I do not believe that the NP205 ever came in a bullnose era truck. If your transfer case is a swap, do you know for sure that the transmission is a T19 from 1985?

Shoot.

Thank you for playing devil's advocate. It's a T-18, non-synchro'd, LOW 1st gear. And I knew that. I'm not sure at what point I started thinking it was a T-19. I'm 100% sure it's an NP205, I pulled it out and rebuilt it according to a great

because it was leaking transmission fluid though the in/output shaft seals like a hose.

OD is a nice-to-have, a "usable" 1st gear is a nice-to-have, and a syncro'd 1st gear would be nice-to-have.

It's really the ease of shifting that's the big dea. Your description of a T-19 is the polar opposite of what this T-18 is like. I've been driving manuals my whole life, and sometimes it takes me so long to get it into 3rd or 4th that I have to abandon the effort and speed up again in a lower gear.

It sounds like you're thinking that the transmission might be old, tired, and/or broken?

Right, the NP205 never came in a Bullnose. And you are right, Jonathan, that combo is going to be expensive.

Avoiding expensive is a "must have".

A quick google search says that T-19's can have a 4.02 1st gear ratio, which would be less severe than the 6.32 ratio on the T-18. And there seems to be a lot of them out there for a reasonable price.

Your shifting experience is due to wear and damage. Most likely shifting forks and synchronizers. The shifter cane is hardened steel, but even minor burrs or wear can drastically affect how it shifts. I tried to switch shifter canes on my T19 for a taller type with a threaded knob. The tip on the donor cane looked visually perfect, but the truck wouldn’t shift into 3rd at all. Upon closer inspection I found some extremely small defects and filed them with a sharpening stone. It would then shift into all gears but not as smoothly as the original shift cane so I put it back. There is also a hardened locator pin in the shift tower that prevents the cane from rotating. If this pin is worn or loose it can make shifting nearly impossible. Since the shifter is often removed when servicing the clutch or other maintenance, this pin has a tendency to be misplaced and replaced with something else that is softer or the wrong size. A sawed off drill bit shank is a common substitute. If you have a Borg Warner, check this pin and it’s hole in the shift tower casting. Wear or play will make it shift like crap even if the shift forks and synchro’s are still in good shape.

The T19 that I like so much came out of my 86 F350 diesel. It has the 4.02 first gear, and I drive it like a true 4 speed, not a 3 speed plus a crawl gear. For my F150 with 3.00 axle gears it is perfect. 1st is just right to start out in with 235/85 R16 tires and the close ratios are just right for the low revving straight six. Dropping from 4th to 3rd on a grade is right where you need it, not an engine screaming defeat that slows you down even more. When it was in the diesel F350 it was paired with 4.10 gears. When loaded heavy they were just right. When driving empty it was a tad annoying. It wasn’t geared low enough for me to skip 1st, and I was already reaching for 3rd by the time I got through an intersection in city traffic, and it desperately needed overdrive. Your axle gears and tire size will have a lot to do with which T19 suits your needs. That and the power band of your engine. My experience has been with a 6.9 diesel and 300 straight six, both with very low rpm torque peaks.

[Gary Lewis]

Your shifting experience is due to wear and damage. Most likely shifting forks and synchronizers. The shifter cane is hardened steel, but even minor burrs or wear can drastically affect how it shifts. I tried to switch shifter canes on my T19 for a taller type with a threaded knob. The tip on the donor cane looked visually perfect, but the truck wouldn’t shift into 3rd at all. Upon closer inspection I found some extremely small defects and filed them with a sharpening stone. It would then shift into all gears but not as smoothly as the original shift cane so I put it back. There is also a hardened locator pin in the shift tower that prevents the cane from rotating. If this pin is worn or loose it can make shifting nearly impossible. Since the shifter is often removed when servicing the clutch or other maintenance, this pin has a tendency to be misplaced and replaced with something else that is softer or the wrong size. A sawed off drill bit shank is a common substitute. If you have a Borg Warner, check this pin and it’s hole in the shift tower casting. Wear or play will make it shift like crap even if the shift forks and synchro’s are still in good shape.

The T19 that I like so much came out of my 86 F350 diesel. It has the 4.02 first gear, and I drive it like a true 4 speed, not a 3 speed plus a crawl gear. For my F150 with 3.00 axle gears it is perfect. 1st is just right to start out in with 235/85 R16 tires and the close ratios are just right for the low revving straight six. Dropping from 4th to 3rd on a grade is right where you need it, not an engine screaming defeat that slows you down even more. When it was in the diesel F350 it was paired with 4.10 gears. When loaded heavy they were just right. When driving empty it was a tad annoying. It wasn’t geared low enough for me to skip 1st, and I was already reaching for 3rd by the time I got through an intersection in city traffic, and it desperately needed overdrive. Your axle gears and tire size will have a lot to do with which T19 suits your needs. That and the power band of your engine. My experience has been with a 6.9 diesel and 300 straight six, both with very low rpm torque peaks.

Thanks, Jonathan. I knew you’d know.

[BabeTheBlueOx]

Your shifting experience is due to wear and damage. Most likely shifting forks and synchronizers. The shifter cane is hardened steel, but even minor burrs or wear can drastically affect how it shifts. I tried to switch shifter canes on my T19 for a taller type with a threaded knob. The tip on the donor cane looked visually perfect, but the truck wouldn’t shift into 3rd at all. Upon closer inspection I found some extremely small defects and filed them with a sharpening stone. It would then shift into all gears but not as smoothly as the original shift cane so I put it back. There is also a hardened locator pin in the shift tower that prevents the cane from rotating. If this pin is worn or loose it can make shifting nearly impossible. Since the shifter is often removed when servicing the clutch or other maintenance, this pin has a tendency to be misplaced and replaced with something else that is softer or the wrong size. A sawed off drill bit shank is a common substitute. If you have a Borg Warner, check this pin and it’s hole in the shift tower casting. Wear or play will make it shift like crap even if the shift forks and synchro’s are still in good shape.

The T19 that I like so much came out of my 86 F350 diesel. It has the 4.02 first gear, and I drive it like a true 4 speed, not a 3 speed plus a crawl gear. For my F150 with 3.00 axle gears it is perfect. 1st is just right to start out in with 235/85 R16 tires and the close ratios are just right for the low revving straight six. Dropping from 4th to 3rd on a grade is right where you need it, not an engine screaming defeat that slows you down even more. When it was in the diesel F350 it was paired with 4.10 gears. When loaded heavy they were just right. When driving empty it was a tad annoying. It wasn’t geared low enough for me to skip 1st, and I was already reaching for 3rd by the time I got through an intersection in city traffic, and it desperately needed overdrive. Your axle gears and tire size will have a lot to do with which T19 suits your needs. That and the power band of your engine. My experience has been with a 6.9 diesel and 300 straight six, both with very low rpm torque peaks.

Thank you all, this is extremely helpful!

I'm going to keep my eyes open for a 4.02 T19. They're not as readily available as I first thought, but I'm sure one will come up eventually.

The engine going in will be built for low-end torque, so that might just be the ticket.

[Gary Lewis]

Thank you all, this is extremely helpful!

I'm going to keep my eyes open for a 4.02 T19. They're not as readily available as I first thought, but I'm sure one will come up eventually.

The engine going in will be built for low-end torque, so that might just be the ticket.

Good luck with the hunt. Something will surely turn up.

[JimJam300]

Thank you all, this is extremely helpful!

I'm going to keep my eyes open for a 4.02 T19. They're not as readily available as I first thought, but I'm sure one will come up eventually.

The engine going in will be built for low-end torque, so that might just be the ticket.

I am building a 6 cyl truck for a similar purpose and I went with a T19 as well, except I bought the 5.11 version. A quick and easy way to identify a T19 when it's on a truck is toploading, cast iron top and bottom, and dual PTO covers. If I remember correctly you can't identify the version with casting numbers but you can find them with the application chart. According to Novak's webpage on the T19, you are looking for a T19A.

When I bought mine I went through car-part.com and had junkyards send me pictures of the casting numbers until I got a bite. That way you can also find one with the big block bellhousing "for free" and sell it on ebay for big bucks. All the parts I needed for the rebuild were available but definitely not easy to find.

[Ford F834]

Thank you all, this is extremely helpful!

I'm going to keep my eyes open for a 4.02 T19. They're not as readily available as I first thought, but I'm sure one will come up eventually.

The engine going in will be built for low-end torque, so that might just be the ticket.

Not all diesels came with the 4.02 version. If that’s the one you really want, be sure to put it in gear and count rotations before buying.

Note that the NP205 only has a low range ratio of 1.96:1, which is rather mild as transfer cases go. Paired with a 4.02 version T19 your first gear is 7.88:1. This is still more stout than a 2wd with a “granny” 4 speed, but might not be low enough for some 4x4 uses, especially if you have tall-ish axle gearing and big tires. Just something to be aware of since your 4 low range isn’t as low as the chain driven transfer cases.