Merry Christmas! Documentation Is Ready

[85lebaront2]

Jim - Thanks for the response and apologies for my belated response.

However, you pointed out things I didn't know about the numbering system, which caused me to read more, which pointed out more things I didn't know as well as new things to read, which... And I've been chasing rabbits ever since.

Let me give an example. Keith/FORDification has an extensive part number tutorial on his website. And it is similar to the one found on the Classic Mustangs site. But both of those are quite lengthy and difficult to read, or at least are for me as I've had to re-read parts of them several times and still walk away saying "I've got it, I've got it, I ain't got it."

So what I'm thinking we need on this site is an easy to read overview that is specific to the Bullnose trucks, but with links to some of the other pages that give a much more in-depth explanation.

Thoughts? Please?

Gary, having dealt with numerous part numbering systems (Ford, GM, Chrysler, Mercedes-Benz, Jaguar, MG to name the bulk of them) I have found that Ford and Mercedes-Benz have the most logical ones to follow.

The center part of a Ford PN identifies the basic part, like 12B579 is on MAFs, 9424 is intake manifolds, 9510 is carburetors. Mercedes-Benz PNs are numeric in 3 groups of 3, 1 group of 2. In theirs the second set of 3 is the basic group, I believe 260 is transmissions. First group of 3 is the engine or chassis the part was first used on (like for years the 9" carrier to axle gasket had a B7A prefix) for example, an engine PN for the DOHC 2.8L would be 110 as it is an M110 engine. 116 was the 3.5L V8, 117 the 4.5L V8.

 

[Gary Lewis]

Gary, having dealt with numerous part numbering systems (Ford, GM, Chrysler, Mercedes-Benz, Jaguar, MG to name the bulk of them) I have found that Ford and Mercedes-Benz have the most logical ones to follow.

The center part of a Ford PN identifies the basic part, like 12B579 is on MAFs, 9424 is intake manifolds, 9510 is carburetors. Mercedes-Benz PNs are numeric in 3 groups of 3, 1 group of 2. In theirs the second set of 3 is the basic group, I believe 260 is transmissions. First group of 3 is the engine or chassis the part was first used on (like for years the 9" carrier to axle gasket had a B7A prefix) for example, an engine PN for the DOHC 2.8L would be 110 as it is an M110 engine. 116 was the 3.5L V8, 117 the 4.5L V8.

Jim - I take your point on the 4th digit of the prefix, however I'm not sure I understand what I'm seeing and reading.

First, as it turns out a "Z" means a Ford service part and a "Y" means a Lincoln service part - in the part number.

But there's quite a bit of confusion in my mind about the use of other letters in the part number. For the most part what I'm seeing in the MPC is that the part numbers stick with the Z or Y and it is the ID # that uses the other letters. BUT I AM VERY CONFUSED ABOUT THAT AND BEG FOR CLARIFICATION!

As for odd numbers being left and even numbers right, read on...

Bill - You may be right that the "Ford and Mercedes-Benz have the most logical" numbering systems. However, there are lots of variations that boggle my mind. For instance your statement that 9424 is an intake manifold. But then how can a 9425 also be an intake manifold and even replace a 9424? Then there's the "E0AZ 9424-E r/b E1SZ 9433-C".

 

[ArdWrknTrk]

Jim - I take your point on the 4th digit of the prefix, however I'm not sure I understand what I'm seeing and reading.

First, as it turns out a "Z" means a Ford service part and a "Y" means a Lincoln service part - in the part number.

But there's quite a bit of confusion in my mind about the use of other letters in the part number. For the most part what I'm seeing in the MPC is that the part numbers stick with the Z or Y and it is the ID # that uses the other letters. BUT I AM VERY CONFUSED ABOUT THAT AND BEG FOR CLARIFICATION!

As for odd numbers being left and even numbers right, read on...

Bill - You may be right that the "Ford and Mercedes-Benz have the most logical" numbering systems. However, there are lots of variations that boggle my mind. For instance your statement that 9424 is an intake manifold. But then how can a 9425 also be an intake manifold and even replace a 9424? Then there's the "E0AZ 9424-E r/b E1SZ 9433-C".

Yup. It's the part number you order but many of us find parts at swap meets, the pile in our neighbor's garage, online where someone only lists it by the ID# because they are looking at a part that's completely obsolete/the dealer doesn't have books or microfiche any more and has no motivation to help.

M, U and X in the line code are SVO parts, aka: homologation specials.

They don't always follow the rules.

Honestly, this wouldn't be the first time you've caught a typo in the parts book.

 

[Gary Lewis]

Yup. It's the part number you order but many of us find parts at swap meets, the pile in our neighbor's garage, online where someone only lists it by the ID# because they are looking at a part that's completely obsolete/the dealer doesn't have books or microfiche any more and has no motivation to help.

M, U and X in the line code are SVO parts, aka: homologation specials.

They don't always follow the rules.

Honestly, this wouldn't be the first time you've caught a typo in the parts book.

Ok guys, I've done a major revision of the page, so please take a look and let me know what you think.

[ArdWrknTrk]

Ok guys, I've done a major revision of the page, so please take a look and let me know what you think.

I think you've done a great job! :nabble_anim_claps:I

Clear and understandable while elaborating on those nuance's.

One additional thing. I didn't mention a concern about is that many of the illustrations are kinda generic.

As in wysiNwyg.

Bulletproof F250 was asking about his "D44HD (axle to) spindle bearing', and -of course- my pedantic self gave him the part numbers for spindle to hub bearings and seal....

But I pasted the diagram from the D44 documentation page asking to please clarify X base number for that bearing at that location.

The diagram doesn't show the other (left) upright and spindle.

But: A) he didn't seem to get that you needed to cross that base part# in the interchange for his specific truck to get a P/N.

B) that bearing is shown for the right side only, because that axle is unsupported in the pivoting beam (I didn't know the R/L even/odd trick at that time)

Anyway.. two thumbs up!

[Gary Lewis]

I think you've done a great job! :nabble_anim_claps:I

Clear and understandable while elaborating on those nuance's.

One additional thing. I didn't mention a concern about is that many of the illustrations are kinda generic.

As in wysiNwyg.

Bulletproof F250 was asking about his "D44HD (axle to) spindle bearing', and -of course- my pedantic self gave him the part numbers for spindle to hub bearings and seal....

But I pasted the diagram from the D44 documentation page asking to please clarify X base number for that bearing at that location.

The diagram doesn't show the other (left) upright and spindle.

But: A) he didn't seem to get that you needed to cross that base part# in the interchange for his specific truck to get a P/N.

B) that bearing is shown for the right side only, because that axle is unsupported in the pivoting beam (I didn't know the R/L even/odd trick at that time)

Anyway.. two thumbs up!

Thanks! I realized just now that I didn't put the links in so others can research it more, but then I put in most of the detail, so I need to think through that.

And yes, the illustrations are generic. At first blush you think you could build a truck from the illustrations, but then when you really start looking at things you find lots of gaps. However, they are so much better than nothing. But if we can find better I'll put them up as well.

As for not understanding the base vs full part number issue, that's true of way too many people. Which is a big reason I created that page. Now we has some place to send them to.

[ArdWrknTrk]

Thanks! I realized just now that I didn't put the links in so others can research it more, but then I put in most of the detail, so I need to think through that.

And yes, the illustrations are generic. At first blush you think you could build a truck from the illustrations, but then when you really start looking at things you find lots of gaps. However, they are so much better than nothing. But if we can find better I'll put them up as well.

As for not understanding the base vs full part number issue, that's true of way too many people. Which is a big reason I created that page. Now we has some place to send them to.

I'm not suggesting to find "better" exploded views.

Perhaps an annotation explaining to others that there may be differences from reality because they are generic.

I think Alex just didn't get that the drawing was generic and it didn't matter D44 or D44HD the base number is the same.

I only wanted to pinpoint the bearing he was asking about, and hoped he could grasp why it was listed as "right side only"

https://forum.garysgaragemahal.com/ball-joints-replacement-Dana-44-HD-PS-Axle-SHaft-tp140830p141147.html

 

[Gary Lewis]

I'm not suggesting to find "better" exploded views.Perhaps an annotation explaining to others that there may be differences from reality because they are generic.I think Alex just didn't get that the drawing was generic and it didn't matter D44 or D44HD the base number is the same.I only wanted to pinpoint the bearing he was asking about, and hoped he could grasp why it was listed as "right side only"https://forum.garysgaragemahal.com/ball-joints-replacement-Dana-44-HD-PS-Axle-SHaft-tp140830p141147.html

I added the MPC section on "connectors", meaning the metal pins or terminals, and "sleeves", meaning the plastic shell that holds the pins to the page at Documentation/Electrical/Connectors and then the tab called "Connectors & Sleeves (Connector Shells)". And here's the section so you don't have to go look:

 

[ArdWrknTrk]

I added the MPC section on "connectors", meaning the metal pins or terminals, and "sleeves", meaning the plastic shell that holds the pins to the page at Documentation/Electrical/Connectors and then the tab called "Connectors & Sleeves (Connector Shells)". And here's the section so you don't have to go look:

 

Too bad their listings don't include the appropriate Motorcraft pigtail, like a bunch of valves and switches/senders do.Should help Goose, and I'm thankful that you always go this extra mile for us, Gary.

[Gary Lewis]

Too bad their listings don't include the appropriate Motorcraft pigtail, like a bunch of valves and switches/senders do.

Should help Goose, and I'm thankful that you always go this extra mile for us, Gary.

Someone might be able to piece the pigtail info together with those part numbers via the ID #'s on the connectors and the cross reference. But it would be a real challenge.

Anyway, welcome.