ClayJ Posted May 3, 2020 Author Share Posted May 3, 2020 Doing some reading and came across this article http://www.agcoauto.com/content/news/p2_articleid/220 Has anyone had this happen? Ive never had that issue because most of my vehicles have been chevys!!! Ok ok, sorry. Bad joke. Joking aside. I guess the first thing to check is that the spacer plate is there. Then, if it is, maybe the spacer could be the wrong one? Is that even possible? Are there different thicknesses for those plates. You know, ive never understood why ford puts those spacers in there. I mean, whats the point? Why not have the block or bellhousing a little thicker? I know GM doesnt use them. Ray, I've primarily been a Chevy guy as well so I don't have any experience with these spacers. The plate that Gary shared a picture of is completely different than what these mechanics are talking about. They told me they used part of the old flexplate to fabricate a spacer since they couldn't find one. I was suspicious until the mechanic who's an old timer told me he's done this repair countless times and he did correctly identify the ticking as a broken flexplate. He's also a former Ford master technician, not to say he can't make mistakes. I'm very curious to see what it looks like when they take it apart. Unfortunately I'm 3 hours away. Gary, do you recall dowell pins being installed the last time you worked on Rusty and his C6? I would think with the plate installed and the dowell pins aligned the only issue causing the crack would be incorrect runout on the crank or incorrect/ loose hdwr on the flexplate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gary Lewis Posted May 3, 2020 Share Posted May 3, 2020 Ray, I've primarily been a Chevy guy as well so I don't have any experience with these spacers. The plate that Gary shared a picture of is completely different than what these mechanics are talking about. They told me they used part of the old flexplate to fabricate a spacer since they couldn't find one. I was suspicious until the mechanic who's an old timer told me he's done this repair countless times and he did correctly identify the ticking as a broken flexplate. He's also a former Ford master technician, not to say he can't make mistakes. I'm very curious to see what it looks like when they take it apart. Unfortunately I'm 3 hours away. Gary, do you recall dowell pins being installed the last time you worked on Rusty and his C6? I would think with the plate installed and the dowell pins aligned the only issue causing the crack would be incorrect runout on the crank or incorrect/ loose hdwr on the flexplate. I don't remember installing the transmission, so I can't truly answer the question. I didn't rebuild the engine, although I did install two different transmissions behind it - a ZF5 and the C6 that's behind it now. The ZF5 was used probably 5K miles, but of course that used a solid flywheel. As for the C6, I'm going to guess that I put a couple of thousand miles on it. I know I pulled the ZF and had it rebuilt long before I sold Rusty, so it had the C6 for a while. But again, I don't know that the dowel pins are there. I just don't remember. Sorry. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ClayJ Posted May 3, 2020 Author Share Posted May 3, 2020 I don't remember installing the transmission, so I can't truly answer the question. I didn't rebuild the engine, although I did install two different transmissions behind it - a ZF5 and the C6 that's behind it now. The ZF5 was used probably 5K miles, but of course that used a solid flywheel. As for the C6, I'm going to guess that I put a couple of thousand miles on it. I know I pulled the ZF and had it rebuilt long before I sold Rusty, so it had the C6 for a while. But again, I don't know that the dowel pins are there. I just don't remember. Sorry. No worries Gary. Just kind of thinking out loud. I'll keep this page updated with what we find out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ArdWrknTrk Posted May 3, 2020 Share Posted May 3, 2020 Doing some reading and came across this article http://www.agcoauto.com/content/news/p2_articleid/220 Has anyone had this happen? Ive never had that issue because most of my vehicles have been chevys!!! Ok ok, sorry. Bad joke. Joking aside. I guess the first thing to check is that the spacer plate is there. Then, if it is, maybe the spacer could be the wrong one? Is that even possible? Are there different thicknesses for those plates. You know, ive never understood why ford puts those spacers in there. I mean, whats the point? Why not have the block or bellhousing a little thicker? I know GM doesnt use them. Ford used the steel plate to positively locate the starter motor. GM starters bolt on sideways and can be shimmed out. I've never had a problem with the plate but I know a few who have had to pull the flexplate or flywheel because they forgot. Sorry for your troubles Clay. We're all rooting for Rusty! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ClayJ Posted May 4, 2020 Author Share Posted May 4, 2020 Ford used the steel plate to positively locate the starter motor. GM starters bolt on sideways and can be shimmed out. I've never had a problem with the plate but I know a few who have had to pull the flexplate or flywheel because they forgot. Sorry for your troubles Clay. We're all rooting for Rusty! Thanks Jim, We'll get this figured out and get Rusty home, just a matter of time. I looked through both the engine and transmission parts diagrams and did not see this mystical spacer. Keep in mind I'm not talking about the engine plate at this time. Â Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ArdWrknTrk Posted May 4, 2020 Share Posted May 4, 2020 Thanks Jim, We'll get this figured out and get Rusty home, just a matter of time. I looked through both the engine and transmission parts diagrams and did not see this mystical spacer. Keep in mind I'm not talking about the engine plate at this time. I've never encountered a spacer (or shim) on the crank. But I haven't been that deep into many 335 series automatics either. Maybe it was used because the starter wasn't disengaging? Maybe pump engagement was marginal? I suppose you'll have to ask the mechanic who decided to put it in there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
85lebaront2 Posted May 4, 2020 Share Posted May 4, 2020 I've never encountered a spacer (or shim) on the crank. But I haven't been that deep into many 335 series automatics either. Maybe it was used because the starter wasn't disengaging? Maybe pump engagement was marginal? I suppose you'll have to ask the mechanic who decided to put it in there. I have seen a reinforcement used on a flex plate before, and broken the center out of a few GM 5.7L Diesel flex plates (and one crank). Item of interest, friend of ours (mine and Matt's) had an Explorer that kept breaking the aftermarket flex plates till the "mechanic" working on it refused to touch it again. I bought a new one from Ford along with the reinforcement plate. Got my friend in a transmission shop to order the aftermarket one. The reinforcement was spot welded to the plate creating hard spots which then cracked. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gary Lewis Posted May 4, 2020 Share Posted May 4, 2020 I have seen a reinforcement used on a flex plate before, and broken the center out of a few GM 5.7L Diesel flex plates (and one crank). Item of interest, friend of ours (mine and Matt's) had an Explorer that kept breaking the aftermarket flex plates till the "mechanic" working on it refused to touch it again. I bought a new one from Ford along with the reinforcement plate. Got my friend in a transmission shop to order the aftermarket one. The reinforcement was spot welded to the plate creating hard spots which then cracked. Other than the engine plate there is no spacer for the flex plate on an M-block: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
myrl883 Posted May 4, 2020 Share Posted May 4, 2020 Other than the engine plate there is no spacer for the flex plate on an M-block: I'm going to have to follow this one. I've seen reinforcement plates used on very few Ford engines, and the ones that I have seen aren't USA sourced, or really Ford engines. I've only seen them used on Cologne engines, 7.3 diesels, and possibly early Vulcan engines. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ClayJ Posted May 5, 2020 Author Share Posted May 5, 2020 If it is a lack of an engine plate, the piece that goes between the engine & the block, then I have an extra you can have. But I'm doubting that I didn't put one in there. Just spoke to the mechanic who is looking at Rusty back in Longview. He confirms that the engine plate and dowel pins are installed. Unfortunately he won't be able to get Rusty on the lift until tomorrow morning, however he will send me pics whenever the tear down begins. Yet another reason to save up for a shop in the backyard here at the new house in Glen Rose. Of course I've been obsessed with trying to figure out what could have happened from afar and came across a Ford document on how to troubleshoot a broken flexplate and thought I would share. Flexplate_troubleshooting.pdf Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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