Fuel Injection upgrade

[Gary Lewis]

Hedman finally emailed me today during lunch. The reply I got was asking me what heads do I have then with a statement that the Hedman headers are set up for stock heads and wont clear aftermarket heads. I replied to the email to state that I have AFR Renegade 165cc street heads which are a stock patterned aftermarket head that accepts all factory components outside of emissions on my specific model. I even checked Hedmans website and it states on my headers that the headers fit Stock Profile Heads which is what mine is.

I havent gotten a reply back probably tomorrow but I did email AFR asking them if stock manifolds/headers will fit as I am being told the Hedman street headers only fit stock heads. Something else I need to look into is the ledge at the bottom of the heads below each exhaust port. The headers I have is fitting snug against these ledges and it seems many people in the early 2000s had that issue with other brand of headers and the quick and dirty fix is to cut off the bottom of the flange for clearance. Im tempted to try this as I dont have the gaskets installed but many state with gaskets the flange will fit properly.

IIRC, the issue is the header hitting the engine? I wonder if the heads AFR heads aren't quite as wide?

I hope you get this sorted easily. But my experience of being the guy in the middle isn't good. Good luck!

[Rusty_S85]

IIRC, the issue is the header hitting the engine? I wonder if the heads AFR heads aren't quite as wide?

I hope you get this sorted easily. But my experience of being the guy in the middle isn't good. Good luck!

The header is hitting the cylinder head, Cylinder #5 tube is smashed up against the bottom edge of the head where the head meets the block. Its tilting the flange at the head resulting in the bottom of the flange not even touching the surface of the head.

Another issue I have is I need to shave some off the bottom of the header flange as the ledge on the AFR heads is not allowing the header to fit, I think 1/16" to a 1/4" shaved off the bottom of both flanges should give me the clearance I need to easily sit flush without binding on the ledge. The driver side how ever will still have the same problem with the tube being smashed against the cylinder head.

The circle shows where the tube is smashed against the cylinder head.

I know the headers should work they are 1 1/2" primary tubes and lots of people online are running 1 1/2" primary tube hedman headers on these Renegade 165 heads. Some claimed the ports are D shaped on the heads and thus dont seal in the corners but AFR`s paperwork makes no mention of port shape just that its in the stock location. Summit lists the port shape as being square and the hedman headers I have are listed as having square ports as well.

[Gary Lewis]

IIRC, the issue is the header hitting the engine? I wonder if the heads AFR heads aren't quite as wide?

I hope you get this sorted easily. But my experience of being the guy in the middle isn't good. Good luck!

The header is hitting the cylinder head, Cylinder #5 tube is smashed up against the bottom edge of the head where the head meets the block. Its tilting the flange at the head resulting in the bottom of the flange not even touching the surface of the head.

Another issue I have is I need to shave some off the bottom of the header flange as the ledge on the AFR heads is not allowing the header to fit, I think 1/16" to a 1/4" shaved off the bottom of both flanges should give me the clearance I need to easily sit flush without binding on the ledge. The driver side how ever will still have the same problem with the tube being smashed against the cylinder head.

The circle shows where the tube is smashed against the cylinder head.

I know the headers should work they are 1 1/2" primary tubes and lots of people online are running 1 1/2" primary tube hedman headers on these Renegade 165 heads. Some claimed the ports are D shaped on the heads and thus dont seal in the corners but AFR`s paperwork makes no mention of port shape just that its in the stock location. Summit lists the port shape as being square and the hedman headers I have are listed as having square ports as well.

That really is TIGHT! How thick are the gaskets?

And I see the interference at the bottom of the flange. The gasket will help some there as well, so maybe it won't take much trimming? I hope not.

[Rusty_S85]

That really is TIGHT! How thick are the gaskets?

And I see the interference at the bottom of the flange. The gasket will help some there as well, so maybe it won't take much trimming? I hope not.

The gaskets I have are the Felpro 1415 header gaskets in "small race port" style that is 1.480" H x 1.250" W that Speedway states is 0.07" thick which I dont think is thick enough to take up the gap and get the tube off the head.

With the location I seriously feel that the headers are not made right, I sent a installation question to Summit who I bought the headers from to see if I can get a answer in a more timely manner as I emailed Hedman back not even half an hour after they emailed me and no reply. Hopefully Summit can get back with me about these headers if they are defect or not cause they do have a lifetime warranty on them for defects and I would swap them out and then if the flange hits the ledge still I will just take a sanding disc to the bottom side of the flange and just clearance it to fit properly before I send it out for ceramic coating.

This is a cropped image before paint that shows the head where it meets the block.

Then here is a E7TE OE cylinder head

and a factory cast iron GT40 cylinder head

As you can see my cylinder head isnt sloped but even with the slope of the OE castings I do not believe the header will clear it as I need a good bit of clearance to get the flange to sit flat and the gasket would move it out some but only 0.07".

Like wise why would you make a header that would only fit OE cylinder heads and not aftermarket stock patterned heads such as the AFR`s I have. That is a serious over sight on hedmans part if that is true.

Worse case I may just end up having to run OE exhaust manifolds if I cant get this all straightened out cause I dont mind dinging the header to reshape it for clearance as well as grinding on the bottom of the flanges to clearance the ledge. But I have to make fully sure that there wont be any exhaust leaks cause all of this work and having an exhaust leak is not something I want.

[Gary Lewis]

That really is TIGHT! How thick are the gaskets?

And I see the interference at the bottom of the flange. The gasket will help some there as well, so maybe it won't take much trimming? I hope not.

The gaskets I have are the Felpro 1415 header gaskets in "small race port" style that is 1.480" H x 1.250" W that Speedway states is 0.07" thick which I dont think is thick enough to take up the gap and get the tube off the head.

With the location I seriously feel that the headers are not made right, I sent a installation question to Summit who I bought the headers from to see if I can get a answer in a more timely manner as I emailed Hedman back not even half an hour after they emailed me and no reply. Hopefully Summit can get back with me about these headers if they are defect or not cause they do have a lifetime warranty on them for defects and I would swap them out and then if the flange hits the ledge still I will just take a sanding disc to the bottom side of the flange and just clearance it to fit properly before I send it out for ceramic coating.

This is a cropped image before paint that shows the head where it meets the block.

Then here is a E7TE OE cylinder head

and a factory cast iron GT40 cylinder head

As you can see my cylinder head isnt sloped but even with the slope of the OE castings I do not believe the header will clear it as I need a good bit of clearance to get the flange to sit flat and the gasket would move it out some but only 0.07".

Like wise why would you make a header that would only fit OE cylinder heads and not aftermarket stock patterned heads such as the AFR`s I have. That is a serious over sight on hedmans part if that is true.

Worse case I may just end up having to run OE exhaust manifolds if I cant get this all straightened out cause I dont mind dinging the header to reshape it for clearance as well as grinding on the bottom of the flanges to clearance the ledge. But I have to make fully sure that there wont be any exhaust leaks cause all of this work and having an exhaust leak is not something I want.

I agree that the thickness of the gasket probably isn't enough to make the header clear. Perhaps Summit will get you an answer.

[Rusty_S85]

I agree that the thickness of the gasket probably isn't enough to make the header clear. Perhaps Summit will get you an answer.

Hope so too, only other option is to take the headers to work and heat tube 5 up with the torch and ding it in some and then grind the bottom flange down to clear the ledge. Thankfully I have it mounted on the heads all I would have to do is just mark how much to grind down on the flanges and mark where the tube needs to be shifted. At least doing it now would mean that when I have the headers ceramic coated everything will be coated.

[Rusty_S85]

I agree that the thickness of the gasket probably isn't enough to make the header clear. Perhaps Summit will get you an answer.

Hope so too, only other option is to take the headers to work and heat tube 5 up with the torch and ding it in some and then grind the bottom flange down to clear the ledge. Thankfully I have it mounted on the heads all I would have to do is just mark how much to grind down on the flanges and mark where the tube needs to be shifted. At least doing it now would mean that when I have the headers ceramic coated everything will be coated.

Did a little work over the weekend while I am awaiting the shipment of my pushrods which should be tomorrow unless they delay it yet again.

I started off with mocking up the 3/8" hardline by using some scrap hardline from work that is a coated copper line (can see the copper on the inside). Figured it would be more cost effective to use some scrap than to use my actual stainless steel hardline.

My plan was to have the -6 tee mounted with the center leg pointing up and bringing the forward line down into the top of it. After mocking it up I found out that wouldnt be viable where you could read the fuel pressure gauge screwed in. I decided what I will do is place the tee inline where front and rear lines meet to opposite ends of the tee with the center leg pointing down which would be the feed line. It will move the fuel pressure gauge up where you can easily read it even though it will be covered by the OE air cleaner which will require its removal to check fuel pressure.

I also mounted temporarily the alternator bracket which is coated in eastwoods zinc phosphate, the flash makes the coating look lighter than it really is. The coating is a dark charcoal gray color which I am on the fence, part of me likes the look but the other part of me feels I should coat it in eastwoods cast gray for the natural fresh cast iron look which would be considerably lighter. I also need to still decide what hose clamps I want to use for the bypass hose, I dont mind using traditional worm gear hose clamps but Id like to source a hose clamp that is built more like the old clamps were that didnt strip out easily.

I also marked the driver side header and removed both headers and boxed them up to take them to work this week and modify them to fit cause I havent heard back from hedman since last week and summit has yet to reply to my inquiry about the fitment as well. So I will be shifting the header to clear the head and will be using a sanding disc on one of my air grinders to lightly shave some material off the bottom of the flange to try and get a better fit on the heads.

I also removed the brackets for the power steering pump and the dealer installed AC compressor which I found out two things. First thing I found out was that the OE intake has a raised square pad with a large 5/8" bolt I believe it is that the support brace for the compressor mounts to. My Performer intake doesnt have this point but it does have the mount just behind it like my OE intake which I may be able to use that mount if it clears my aftermarket valve covers. If not I may have to modify the brace or build my own to take this into account. All this brace is for is to stiffen up the compressor mount.

The second thing I found out is that the frame work of my hood is rotting out for some reason but yet the outside of the hood is just fine. I stripped the hood years ago and repainted it and now I was able to push my finger through one spot of the frame work that 2 years ago was not rotten but is now. So now I have to decide what I want to do about a hood. Do I stick with this hood and just let a body shop use body filler which I hate the thought of, do I source a reproduction hood and hope it fits like the original hood and is of quality, do I get the steel cowl hood which I am not too sure about, or do I skip all of that and go with the GT500 mustang inspired fiberglass hood. These brackets will be stripped at work using my wire brush wheel on one of my air angle grinders after I let the parts washer wash away all the grease and grime from the brackets. I will be painting the steel brackets low gloss (10% - 20% gloss) under hood black, the pulleys will be underhood black as well. The powersteering pump bracket which I havent removed I will clean up and paint along with the aluminum flex fan spacer in eastwoods cast aluminum color. I am leaning more towards repainting the alternator mount the cast gray for a lighter natural cast iron look.

After looking at the following I think I will probably just spend the money and get a stock steel hood from Dennis Carpenter as it is the cheapest and I just dont know how a truck would look with these two optional hoods with KO2 tires with a grill guard and possibly a roll bar. I think they would look better on a lowered truck with wheels more like what you would find on a car.

Made in the USA Steel hood from Dennis Carpenter $495.95

Goodmark 2" steel cowl hood $731.79

Composite-Tech Fiberglass GT500 series Hood $689.00

I do really like the GT500 scoop look of the fiberglass hood but I just cant find enough photos of the hood from all angles installed on an 80-86 truck to make a good decision on if I will get it or not but I still have time to think on this, I will just knock the rust out as best as I can shoot some paint on it to slow it down and come to a final decision on the hood when I take the truck for paint and body work.

[Gary Lewis]

Did a little work over the weekend while I am awaiting the shipment of my pushrods which should be tomorrow unless they delay it yet again.

I started off with mocking up the 3/8" hardline by using some scrap hardline from work that is a coated copper line (can see the copper on the inside). Figured it would be more cost effective to use some scrap than to use my actual stainless steel hardline.

My plan was to have the -6 tee mounted with the center leg pointing up and bringing the forward line down into the top of it. After mocking it up I found out that wouldnt be viable where you could read the fuel pressure gauge screwed in. I decided what I will do is place the tee inline where front and rear lines meet to opposite ends of the tee with the center leg pointing down which would be the feed line. It will move the fuel pressure gauge up where you can easily read it even though it will be covered by the OE air cleaner which will require its removal to check fuel pressure.

I also mounted temporarily the alternator bracket which is coated in eastwoods zinc phosphate, the flash makes the coating look lighter than it really is. The coating is a dark charcoal gray color which I am on the fence, part of me likes the look but the other part of me feels I should coat it in eastwoods cast gray for the natural fresh cast iron look which would be considerably lighter. I also need to still decide what hose clamps I want to use for the bypass hose, I dont mind using traditional worm gear hose clamps but Id like to source a hose clamp that is built more like the old clamps were that didnt strip out easily.

I also marked the driver side header and removed both headers and boxed them up to take them to work this week and modify them to fit cause I havent heard back from hedman since last week and summit has yet to reply to my inquiry about the fitment as well. So I will be shifting the header to clear the head and will be using a sanding disc on one of my air grinders to lightly shave some material off the bottom of the flange to try and get a better fit on the heads.

I also removed the brackets for the power steering pump and the dealer installed AC compressor which I found out two things. First thing I found out was that the OE intake has a raised square pad with a large 5/8" bolt I believe it is that the support brace for the compressor mounts to. My Performer intake doesnt have this point but it does have the mount just behind it like my OE intake which I may be able to use that mount if it clears my aftermarket valve covers. If not I may have to modify the brace or build my own to take this into account. All this brace is for is to stiffen up the compressor mount.

The second thing I found out is that the frame work of my hood is rotting out for some reason but yet the outside of the hood is just fine. I stripped the hood years ago and repainted it and now I was able to push my finger through one spot of the frame work that 2 years ago was not rotten but is now. So now I have to decide what I want to do about a hood. Do I stick with this hood and just let a body shop use body filler which I hate the thought of, do I source a reproduction hood and hope it fits like the original hood and is of quality, do I get the steel cowl hood which I am not too sure about, or do I skip all of that and go with the GT500 mustang inspired fiberglass hood. These brackets will be stripped at work using my wire brush wheel on one of my air angle grinders after I let the parts washer wash away all the grease and grime from the brackets. I will be painting the steel brackets low gloss (10% - 20% gloss) under hood black, the pulleys will be underhood black as well. The powersteering pump bracket which I havent removed I will clean up and paint along with the aluminum flex fan spacer in eastwoods cast aluminum color. I am leaning more towards repainting the alternator mount the cast gray for a lighter natural cast iron look.

After looking at the following I think I will probably just spend the money and get a stock steel hood from Dennis Carpenter as it is the cheapest and I just dont know how a truck would look with these two optional hoods with KO2 tires with a grill guard and possibly a roll bar. I think they would look better on a lowered truck with wheels more like what you would find on a car.

Made in the USA Steel hood from Dennis Carpenter $495.95

Goodmark 2" steel cowl hood $731.79

Composite-Tech Fiberglass GT500 series Hood $689.00

I do really like the GT500 scoop look of the fiberglass hood but I just cant find enough photos of the hood from all angles installed on an 80-86 truck to make a good decision on if I will get it or not but I still have time to think on this, I will just knock the rust out as best as I can shoot some paint on it to slow it down and come to a final decision on the hood when I take the truck for paint and body work.

I think the stock hood is the way to go. I don't think a scoop or scoops would look right on a serious truck. As you said, maybe on a lowered truck with street tires, but not your truck. Just my opinion.

Good luck on the header. Apparently no one wants to fess up that it is their fault.

As for the pressure gauge, might you be able to get it where you can read it with a mirror? Or by getting down close to the fender? The one on Big Blue requires you to be in just the right spot, but it sure is nice to be able to tell w/o pulling the air cleaner.

Anyway, it is looking good!

[Rusty_S85]

I think the stock hood is the way to go. I don't think a scoop or scoops would look right on a serious truck. As you said, maybe on a lowered truck with street tires, but not your truck. Just my opinion.

Good luck on the header. Apparently no one wants to fess up that it is their fault.

As for the pressure gauge, might you be able to get it where you can read it with a mirror? Or by getting down close to the fender? The one on Big Blue requires you to be in just the right spot, but it sure is nice to be able to tell w/o pulling the air cleaner.

Anyway, it is looking good!

That is what keeping me from saying "yes I want x hood" but more so just going back with the same style hood thats on the truck now.

It is sad cause the headers have a life time warranty on them as per hedmans website. I asked on fb on a small block ford group Im on and many are saying that they have no header fitment issues with the AFR 165 Renegade heads given they arent using the same specific header but they are using shorties for their application which makes me think its a screw up on their part. But its no big deal I can use my sanding disc and clean the headers up some smooth it out some from the shoddy welding I found in a few spots such as some welding splatter on the header gasket surface and one on the OE ball collector. I took a orange paint pen I use at work for marking my fabrications and I marked where the header is touching at and where it is closer than I would like so I have a wider area to shift.

On the pressure gauge I am not too concerned with the location cause if there is a problem with the engine not running I would be pulling the air cleaner off anyways to check the injectors are spraying. Like wise if Dakota Digital ever offers a RTX Retro cluster for our trucks I will be buying it and installing in the gauges place a pressure module and a 0 to 100 psi pressure sensor. That way I can read the pressure on the dash and set up a warning to flash on the dash when the fuel pressure moves outside of the 55 - 65 psi pressure range. Same with the fuel gauge I can set it up to warn me with Low Fuel warning in the message center when I get down to 10% or 15%. I thought about locating the pressure gauge where you could see it but it would require a break in the hardline and I am trying to limit the number of connections where possible.

Thats what I have to decide is how I want to route the feed line on the engine cause the OE line comes forward between the ignition coil and the distributor then it makes a gentle curve around the distributor cap then it angles down towards the timing cover to clear the power steering pump bracket and the dealer AC bracket. I dont know if I want to route the hardline like that cause it may have been fine with 5/16" hardline but now going with 3/8" hardline I am a bit concerned with the appearance it will have. I thought about bringing it over the intake manifold runner for cylinder one and coming around the back side of the distributor then down the front of the block like OE. It will hide the line a bit more, give it more of a natural route than curving back and forth unnecessarily.

But I have to say I do like the cheaper Inline Tube`s 37* flare turret and die set for use with my Eastwood vice mount flare tool. I just have to watch some videos and verify cause for the 37* flare it has a op 0 to set the die and the tube in position then you have a op 1 to start the first stage of a double flare and then op 2 to complete the double flare. I believe AN flares are only single not double flare so I just did op 0 and op 2 for a single flare on the hardline I made. First flare I made I screwed up cause I was tempted to do like I do with my standard flare set and bottom the tool lightly. Doing this with the AN turret and die actually split the tubing as it made the flare too large. I found out there is a sweet spot when you are doing the flare the tube will flare easily then youll hit a detent part where the tube has flared properly and requires a little more force to keep the flare tool moving.

[Rusty_S85]

I think the stock hood is the way to go. I don't think a scoop or scoops would look right on a serious truck. As you said, maybe on a lowered truck with street tires, but not your truck. Just my opinion.

Good luck on the header. Apparently no one wants to fess up that it is their fault.

As for the pressure gauge, might you be able to get it where you can read it with a mirror? Or by getting down close to the fender? The one on Big Blue requires you to be in just the right spot, but it sure is nice to be able to tell w/o pulling the air cleaner.

Anyway, it is looking good!

That is what keeping me from saying "yes I want x hood" but more so just going back with the same style hood thats on the truck now.

It is sad cause the headers have a life time warranty on them as per hedmans website. I asked on fb on a small block ford group Im on and many are saying that they have no header fitment issues with the AFR 165 Renegade heads given they arent using the same specific header but they are using shorties for their application which makes me think its a screw up on their part. But its no big deal I can use my sanding disc and clean the headers up some smooth it out some from the shoddy welding I found in a few spots such as some welding splatter on the header gasket surface and one on the OE ball collector. I took a orange paint pen I use at work for marking my fabrications and I marked where the header is touching at and where it is closer than I would like so I have a wider area to shift.

On the pressure gauge I am not too concerned with the location cause if there is a problem with the engine not running I would be pulling the air cleaner off anyways to check the injectors are spraying. Like wise if Dakota Digital ever offers a RTX Retro cluster for our trucks I will be buying it and installing in the gauges place a pressure module and a 0 to 100 psi pressure sensor. That way I can read the pressure on the dash and set up a warning to flash on the dash when the fuel pressure moves outside of the 55 - 65 psi pressure range. Same with the fuel gauge I can set it up to warn me with Low Fuel warning in the message center when I get down to 10% or 15%. I thought about locating the pressure gauge where you could see it but it would require a break in the hardline and I am trying to limit the number of connections where possible.

Thats what I have to decide is how I want to route the feed line on the engine cause the OE line comes forward between the ignition coil and the distributor then it makes a gentle curve around the distributor cap then it angles down towards the timing cover to clear the power steering pump bracket and the dealer AC bracket. I dont know if I want to route the hardline like that cause it may have been fine with 5/16" hardline but now going with 3/8" hardline I am a bit concerned with the appearance it will have. I thought about bringing it over the intake manifold runner for cylinder one and coming around the back side of the distributor then down the front of the block like OE. It will hide the line a bit more, give it more of a natural route than curving back and forth unnecessarily.

But I have to say I do like the cheaper Inline Tube`s 37* flare turret and die set for use with my Eastwood vice mount flare tool. I just have to watch some videos and verify cause for the 37* flare it has a op 0 to set the die and the tube in position then you have a op 1 to start the first stage of a double flare and then op 2 to complete the double flare. I believe AN flares are only single not double flare so I just did op 0 and op 2 for a single flare on the hardline I made. First flare I made I screwed up cause I was tempted to do like I do with my standard flare set and bottom the tool lightly. Doing this with the AN turret and die actually split the tubing as it made the flare too large. I found out there is a sweet spot when you are doing the flare the tube will flare easily then youll hit a detent part where the tube has flared properly and requires a little more force to keep the flare tool moving.

Will have to upload photo tomorrow on my lunch break but I tossed my Dealer AC bracket in the parts washer at work turned the heat on for 4 hours and set the wash cycle to 2 hours. When I pulled the part out all the grease and grime was gone as well as all the paint. Only thing that was left was spots of rust that was under the paint that my wirebrush wheel on my air grinder quickly wiped away. Since I still have a lot more to clean and strip before I can paint I hosed the bracket down with some zep penetrating oil hopefully it will keep the rust at bay till I can finish cleaning everything up for painting this weekend.

I also am hopeful to take the headers to work this friday if I can get everything else cleaned up before then after hours so I can get them clearanced and test fitted this weekend before I contact the ceramic coater that I will be using cause Jet Hot coating told me they wont fix the pipes for shifting them and they dont do welding. That is a no go for me cause even though the guy I will be using doesnt offer a life time warranty on his coatings he does how ever blasts the parts clean and checks the welds and do repairs that are needed. Which I do want I want him to go over both headers and make sure there is no exhaust leak points in them before ceramic coating I dont want no leaks or noise.

This weekend I will also be bringing my powersteering pump pulley remover tool from work to pull the powersteering pump pulley and also unbolting the aluminum powersteering pump bracket to clean both up and paint as well. Looking at my setup it looks like my powersteering pump pivot bolt screws into the larger 7/16" thermactor plug which means it will all bolt up on my AFR Renegade heads and the best part, once all this bracketry is installed youll never see the AFR Renegade logo on the front of the heads. Only thing people could possibly see to know they are AFR aftermarket heads and not OE castings is the AFR cast into the forward and rear mating surface of the heads which for the most part should be hidden by the header tubes unless you start jockying around to view around them.