Lighting Upgrades

[Gary Lewis]

Great thread Gary,

I need to buy new 7" round headlights for my '52 pickup so I'll give this a read. I simply want the best bang for the buck, so not necessarily the brightest lights, but the brightest for the least amount of money .

By the way, are daytime running lights a thing in the US yet, or no? I have imported a few trucks from the US and always had to add the little aftermarket DRL kits to make them compliant up here;).

Rusty - You are spot on - so far I've not found a real test done on the Holley's. All I've found are the "reviews" that gush over how bright they are with no real numbers to support their statements. However, that young lady did have numbers, although she didn't know how to use the app on the phone nor did she have a scientific test in any way.

Jim - Well, I guess that shouldn't have been a surprised. Another great American brand managed by a company only riding on the name, not the quality.

Cory - No, DRL's aren't required in the US. As for the lights, Daniel Stern says that the brightness of the light isn't the whole story. Where it is put and not put makes a big difference as you do not want to blind the oncoming driver.

Another thing Daniel said has really surprised me:

Keep in mind, there is nothing such as a "DOT approved" headlamp. The "DOT" marking on a headlamp does not mean it has been tested and approved by the DOT, it means the maker or importer, having done whatever dilligence they consider necessary, self-certifies that the headlamp meets all the legal requirements.

Another red flag to watch for is "SAE approved". There is nothing such as SAE approval; SAE is not a regulatory body. It is a private corporation in the business of devising and selling technical standards. These standards themselves carry no legal weight or force. US and Canadian regulations (which _do_ carry legal force) incorporate some provisions of some versions—sometimes very old versions—of some SAE standards, and that is the only path by which anything SAE does or says influences what is or isn't legal.

I did some research and he's spot on. The fact that the Holley's, for instance, have "DOT" on them doesn't mean anything. In fact, many of the bug-eyed ones that lots of "reviewers" say are junk have "DOT" on them.

So I'm still seriously considering the Koitos shells with Tungsram +120 bulbs for Big Blue.

[Rembrant]

All I've found are the "reviews" that gush over how bright they are with no real numbers to support their statements.

Isn't that the whole internet summed up in a single statement?

 

[Rusty_S85]

Rusty - You are spot on - so far I've not found a real test done on the Holley's. All I've found are the "reviews" that gush over how bright they are with no real numbers to support their statements. However, that young lady did have numbers, although she didn't know how to use the app on the phone nor did she have a scientific test in any way.

Jim - Well, I guess that shouldn't have been a surprised. Another great American brand managed by a company only riding on the name, not the quality.

Cory - No, DRL's aren't required in the US. As for the lights, Daniel Stern says that the brightness of the light isn't the whole story. Where it is put and not put makes a big difference as you do not want to blind the oncoming driver.

Another thing Daniel said has really surprised me:

Keep in mind, there is nothing such as a "DOT approved" headlamp. The "DOT" marking on a headlamp does not mean it has been tested and approved by the DOT, it means the maker or importer, having done whatever dilligence they consider necessary, self-certifies that the headlamp meets all the legal requirements.

Another red flag to watch for is "SAE approved". There is nothing such as SAE approval; SAE is not a regulatory body. It is a private corporation in the business of devising and selling technical standards. These standards themselves carry no legal weight or force. US and Canadian regulations (which _do_ carry legal force) incorporate some provisions of some versions—sometimes very old versions—of some SAE standards, and that is the only path by which anything SAE does or says influences what is or isn't legal.

I did some research and he's spot on. The fact that the Holley's, for instance, have "DOT" on them doesn't mean anything. In fact, many of the bug-eyed ones that lots of "reviewers" say are junk have "DOT" on them.

So I'm still seriously considering the Koitos shells with Tungsram +120 bulbs for Big Blue.

Correct, she also showed a before and after comparison of sealed beam bulbs vs the Holley LED bulbs showing the pattern and I do agree the low beam pattern looks great its low and very wide compared to the seal beam bulb. The area that is very questionable however is the high beam which is regulated to the upper left side of the beam pattern which would put the light directly at oncoming traffic down the road without providing any real illumination to the right side of the road down the street. She has done better than many reviewers do because they just show a quick nighttime drive video but nothing to make a fair comparison that actually shows the pattern. Sure, the bulb might be lighting up your area better but what is the pattern like on a flat surface that is what I want to know.

Same thing with the KC Day Lighters that are LED, they are super expensive like the Holley bulbs but yet I still to this day have yet to see a comparison pattern wise of KC`s 100w halogen bulb vs their new 2 chip LED reflector bulb. Just when you look at a photo of the bulbs on the 100w halogen bulb is solid white and very bright in the photo but when you look at the LED housing you don't have that same illumination you just see bright spots in the reflector which tells me it must not be throwing as much light down the road. That is what I am concerned about as the property I have that I am moving to once I get everything squared away it is lots of country roads that has no lights and while regular bulbs would be fine for that, my whole purpose of adding auxiliary lighting is to ensure I have lighting that shines along the tree line to stop any deer on the side of the road before they get onto the road in front of me. I don't believe any LED bulb currently offered will give me that kind of benefit and will be forced to stick with my two 100w driving lights for illuminating the road with the possibility of adding two 100w spotlights and two 100w flood lights for illuminating the tree lines down the road and close to me.

On the whole DOT thing it doesn't mean a whole lot, but it does have to have that stamp of approval on it to be street legal which is mind boggling. It's like the composite housings I have on my truck they are Hella`s and they are ECE compliant. If I ever got stopped and they inspected the housing the lack of a DOT approval stamp on it would get me in trouble but yet I see no regulatory process for what something has to be to be considered DOT approved. It's like those bug eye semi projector style LED bulb housings you mentioned they are DOT approved but yet they are complete trash and emit less light than an old incandescent sealed beam bulb does

[Gary Lewis]

Rusty - You are spot on - so far I've not found a real test done on the Holley's. All I've found are the "reviews" that gush over how bright they are with no real numbers to support their statements. However, that young lady did have numbers, although she didn't know how to use the app on the phone nor did she have a scientific test in any way.

Jim - Well, I guess that shouldn't have been a surprised. Another great American brand managed by a company only riding on the name, not the quality.

Cory - No, DRL's aren't required in the US. As for the lights, Daniel Stern says that the brightness of the light isn't the whole story. Where it is put and not put makes a big difference as you do not want to blind the oncoming driver.

Another thing Daniel said has really surprised me:

Keep in mind, there is nothing such as a "DOT approved" headlamp. The "DOT" marking on a headlamp does not mean it has been tested and approved by the DOT, it means the maker or importer, having done whatever dilligence they consider necessary, self-certifies that the headlamp meets all the legal requirements.

Another red flag to watch for is "SAE approved". There is nothing such as SAE approval; SAE is not a regulatory body. It is a private corporation in the business of devising and selling technical standards. These standards themselves carry no legal weight or force. US and Canadian regulations (which _do_ carry legal force) incorporate some provisions of some versions—sometimes very old versions—of some SAE standards, and that is the only path by which anything SAE does or says influences what is or isn't legal.

I did some research and he's spot on. The fact that the Holley's, for instance, have "DOT" on them doesn't mean anything. In fact, many of the bug-eyed ones that lots of "reviewers" say are junk have "DOT" on them.

So I'm still seriously considering the Koitos shells with Tungsram +120 bulbs for Big Blue.

Correct, she also showed a before and after comparison of sealed beam bulbs vs the Holley LED bulbs showing the pattern and I do agree the low beam pattern looks great its low and very wide compared to the seal beam bulb. The area that is very questionable however is the high beam which is regulated to the upper left side of the beam pattern which would put the light directly at oncoming traffic down the road without providing any real illumination to the right side of the road down the street. She has done better than many reviewers do because they just show a quick nighttime drive video but nothing to make a fair comparison that actually shows the pattern. Sure, the bulb might be lighting up your area better but what is the pattern like on a flat surface that is what I want to know.

Same thing with the KC Day Lighters that are LED, they are super expensive like the Holley bulbs but yet I still to this day have yet to see a comparison pattern wise of KC`s 100w halogen bulb vs their new 2 chip LED reflector bulb. Just when you look at a photo of the bulbs on the 100w halogen bulb is solid white and very bright in the photo but when you look at the LED housing you don't have that same illumination you just see bright spots in the reflector which tells me it must not be throwing as much light down the road. That is what I am concerned about as the property I have that I am moving to once I get everything squared away it is lots of country roads that has no lights and while regular bulbs would be fine for that, my whole purpose of adding auxiliary lighting is to ensure I have lighting that shines along the tree line to stop any deer on the side of the road before they get onto the road in front of me. I don't believe any LED bulb currently offered will give me that kind of benefit and will be forced to stick with my two 100w driving lights for illuminating the road with the possibility of adding two 100w spotlights and two 100w flood lights for illuminating the tree lines down the road and close to me.

On the whole DOT thing it doesn't mean a whole lot, but it does have to have that stamp of approval on it to be street legal which is mind boggling. It's like the composite housings I have on my truck they are Hella`s and they are ECE compliant. If I ever got stopped and they inspected the housing the lack of a DOT approval stamp on it would get me in trouble but yet I see no regulatory process for what something has to be to be considered DOT approved. It's like those bug eye semi projector style LED bulb housings you mentioned they are DOT approved but yet they are complete trash and emit less light than an old incandescent sealed beam bulb does

I'm posting this here as well as in Big Blue's Transformation thread.

I ordered Big Blue's Christmas present today: Koito headlight shells and Tungsram +120 headlight bulbs from Daniel Stern. No idea when they'll be here, but maybe I can get them installed just after Christmas.

I had planned to do a before/after set of pics and measurements using a lightmeter app - but I just watched a video that Diode Dynamics created and I'm not going to bother using a light meter as that's apparently NOT the way to measure headlights.

However I will do the pics, and I'll let the camera chose the shutter speed and f-stop in the before pics (high & low beam pics), and then use those settings for the after pics. That will let the viewer see any differences. But I'm relying on Daniel's evaluation that the Koito/+120's are the best way to go if you want a traditional look at the moment.

[fords4life]

I'm posting this here as well as in Big Blue's Transformation thread.

I ordered Big Blue's Christmas present today: Koito headlight shells and Tungsram +120 headlight bulbs from Daniel Stern. No idea when they'll be here, but maybe I can get them installed just after Christmas.

I had planned to do a before/after set of pics and measurements using a lightmeter app - but I just watched a video that Diode Dynamics created and I'm not going to bother using a light meter as that's apparently NOT the way to measure headlights.

However I will do the pics, and I'll let the camera chose the shutter speed and f-stop in the before pics (high & low beam pics), and then use those settings for the after pics. That will let the viewer see any differences. But I'm relying on Daniel's evaluation that the Koito/+120's are the best way to go if you want a traditional look at the moment.

Gary, any updates on the new headlights?

[Gary Lewis]

Gary, any updates on the new headlights?

I love them! I hadn’t really driven at night with them until a couple of weeks ago when we went to New Mexico. But I did then and they put out a LOT more light and it goes a LOT farther down the road on high.

I’m very pleased and highly recommend them.

[Machspeed]

Gary, any updates on the new headlights?

I looked into Gary's lights and I know they are probably tops, but they are $$$$! As such, I went with a set of HELLA's and I am very pleased with them. Probably a third of the cost and the lighting is awesome. Far, far better than the Sylvania Xtravision I was previously running. Just putting that out there as an alternative.

[fords4life]

Gary, any updates on the new headlights?

I looked into Gary's lights and I know they are probably tops, but they are $$$$! As such, I went with a set of HELLA's and I am very pleased with them. Probably a third of the cost and the lighting is awesome. Far, far better than the Sylvania Xtravision I was previously running. Just putting that out there as an alternative.

Appreciate the feedback. That has been my question in reading through all of the info. The Hella's are half the price of just the Kioto lenses and I've been wondering if the Kioto's are really that much better. I am going to do the headlight harness first and the lenses will probably come a little later, but I'm considering the Hella's. LMC has some halogen conversion lenses now too, but haven't been able to find any reviews yet.

[Machspeed]

Appreciate the feedback. That has been my question in reading through all of the info. The Hella's are half the price of just the Kioto lenses and I've been wondering if the Kioto's are really that much better. I am going to do the headlight harness first and the lenses will probably come a little later, but I'm considering the Hella's. LMC has some halogen conversion lenses now too, but haven't been able to find any reviews yet.

Yes, you'll want to do that harness conversion. I got my HELLA's off Amazon and they are favorably reviewed.

One thing I noted about the HELLA's is that when I was adjusting them, the regular lights and the brights didn't seem to line up the same. In other words, you dial in the lights then hit the brights and you can clearly see the pattern move up and off to the right slightly. At lease that is what mine did. Bugged the crap out of me at first but when I took it out for driving, was totally pleased. Gary actually knew about this issue, as he'd read about it somewhere.

[ArdWrknTrk]

Yes, you'll want to do that harness conversion. I got my HELLA's off Amazon and they are favorably reviewed.

One thing I noted about the HELLA's is that when I was adjusting them, the regular lights and the brights didn't seem to line up the same. In other words, you dial in the lights then hit the brights and you can clearly see the pattern move up and off to the right slightly. At lease that is what mine did. Bugged the crap out of me at first but when I took it out for driving, was totally pleased. Gary actually knew about this issue, as he'd read about it somewhere.

Daniel Stern lighting consultancy.

Mr* Stern offers a LOT of information on his site.