ArdWrknTrk Posted September 18, 2019 Share Posted September 18, 2019 There are actually 3 versions of master. The middle fits the '92-96/7 firewall, but works with the '84-91 slaves: https://supermotors.net/getfile/992737/thumbnail/mastert.jpg Actually, there are four different masters if you include the bolt pattern change in 1988 when the 5spd came out. The masters are hydraulically the same between between 1983 and 1991, but the studs changed to the diagonal pattern in 1988. So technically version #1 is 1983-1987, and version #2 is 1988-1991. Side on they look exactly the same, but the mounting is different. I'm running a 1991 Mazda 5spd from a Light Duty F250, a hydraulic line ordered to fit the 1988-1991 Master cylinder, and then I used a 1983-1987 Master cylinder so that it fit the factory mounting holes in my cab. It all fits together perfectly. And that's why I said the downward master won't fit the front discharge firewall. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reamer Posted September 18, 2019 Author Share Posted September 18, 2019 There are actually 3 versions of master. The middle fits the '92-96/7 firewall, but works with the '84-91 slaves: https://supermotors.net/getfile/992737/thumbnail/mastert.jpg Actually, there are four different masters if you include the bolt pattern change in 1988 when the 5spd came out. The masters are hydraulically the same between between 1983 and 1991, but the studs changed to the diagonal pattern in 1988. So technically version #1 is 1983-1987, and version #2 is 1988-1991. Side on they look exactly the same, but the mounting is different. I'm running a 1991 Mazda 5spd from a Light Duty F250, a hydraulic line ordered to fit the 1988-1991 Master cylinder, and then I used a 1983-1987 Master cylinder so that it fit the factory mounting holes in my cab. It all fits together perfectly. Victory! I think Well, we got a working solution and for future reference, there are two slave-to-line couplers, they look very similar, but during the 1993 conversion, the connector changed too by a whopping 1/16". What I had was a NAPA NCF 72176 Master NAPA NOE 819 5931 Hyd Line NAPA NCF 73002B Slave This combination works fine. Changed the slave, they gave me a NCF 73003B.. This "93" and up Slave will not connect to the older 819 5931 line. I now have is NAPA NCF 72176 Master NAPA 815 3201 Hyd Line NAPA NCF 73003B Slave. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ArdWrknTrk Posted September 18, 2019 Share Posted September 18, 2019 Victory! I think Well, we got a working solution and for future reference, there are two slave-to-line couplers, they look very similar, but during the 1993 conversion, the connector changed too by a whopping 1/16". What I had was a NAPA NCF 72176 Master NAPA NOE 819 5931 Hyd Line NAPA NCF 73002B Slave This combination works fine. Changed the slave, they gave me a NCF 73003B.. This "93" and up Slave will not connect to the older 819 5931 line. I now have is NAPA NCF 72176 Master NAPA 815 3201 Hyd Line NAPA NCF 73003B Slave. So this line fits a front discharge master? Or you still have to heat and bend it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reamer Posted September 18, 2019 Author Share Posted September 18, 2019 So this line fits a front discharge master? Or you still have to heat and bend it? It fits the front discharge master, it as a metal 90 degree elbow, It does not fit "comfortably" and rubs the floor pan, but tie wraps keep it away, At least now it is "moveable" and as long as it does not leak, it will stay. I'm gonna experiment with my old line, Parts guy said the bends in the lines are created with boling water, but I don't buy it. Ill try the heat gun too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ArdWrknTrk Posted September 18, 2019 Share Posted September 18, 2019 It fits the front discharge master, it as a metal 90 degree elbow, It does not fit "comfortably" and rubs the floor pan, but tie wraps keep it away, At least now it is "moveable" and as long as it does not leak, it will stay. I'm gonna experiment with my old line, Parts guy said the bends in the lines are created with boling water, but I don't buy it. Ill try the heat gun too. I doubt boiling water would do it, but you might as well try. My slave and line get roasted by the drivers side down pipe. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reamer Posted September 18, 2019 Author Share Posted September 18, 2019 I doubt boiling water would do it, but you might as well try. My slave and line get roasted by the drivers side down pipe. Any reason cutch lines are not flexable like a garden hose? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ArdWrknTrk Posted September 18, 2019 Share Posted September 18, 2019 Any reason cutch lines are not flexable like a garden hose? Intense pressure? Could be a hydraulic line, but never like a garden hose. And then, there's the heat that would likely cook a rubber hydraulic hose. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve83 Posted September 19, 2019 Share Posted September 19, 2019 Any reason cutch lines are not flexable like a garden hose?Because that would make them too elastic - they'd expand & contract slightly as you press & release the pedal, reducing the slave's travel. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reamer Posted September 20, 2019 Author Share Posted September 20, 2019 Any reason cutch lines are not flexable like a garden hose?Because that would make them too elastic - they'd expand & contract slightly as you press & release the pedal, reducing the slave's travel. OK, So I have it all together, Got the T-case back today, got the shifters back and the carpet installed, All filled with ATF, Fire it up and it runs great! BUT …. Won't shift:nabble_smiley_angry:With engine off, not touching the clutch, I can shift into any gear. Engine on, clutch to the floor, can't get into any gear. Had my assistant push the clutch to the floor, the hydraulic slave moves in @ 5/8" … is this acceptable? or is there still air in the line? If I disconnect the line at the slave, it is solid as a rock, indicating no air in MC or line, I bled the Slave first by gravity feed and then the old fashioned way with assistant pushing clutch to the floor the opening the bleeder, then closing then having her release the pedal. No air is coming out, and we put a lot of fluid through the system, My question is with the slave movement of 5/8" is that enough or should it have to move more to disengage? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
85lebaront2 Posted September 20, 2019 Share Posted September 20, 2019 OK, So I have it all together, Got the T-case back today, got the shifters back and the carpet installed, All filled with ATF, Fire it up and it runs great! BUT …. Won't shift:nabble_smiley_angry:With engine off, not touching the clutch, I can shift into any gear. Engine on, clutch to the floor, can't get into any gear. Had my assistant push the clutch to the floor, the hydraulic slave moves in @ 5/8" … is this acceptable? or is there still air in the line? If I disconnect the line at the slave, it is solid as a rock, indicating no air in MC or line, I bled the Slave first by gravity feed and then the old fashioned way with assistant pushing clutch to the floor the opening the bleeder, then closing then having her release the pedal. No air is coming out, and we put a lot of fluid through the system, My question is with the slave movement of 5/8" is that enough or should it have to move more to disengage? Old Mercedes-Benz technician's trick, take the caliper closest to the clutch slave, find a piece of rubber vacuum line that fits snugly over the end of the bleeder screw and will reach to the clutch slave. Put it over the slave bleeder screw and the caliper bleeder screw. Loosen the slave bleeder about 1/2 - 3/4 turn. Have your helper depress the brake pedal, not super hard and open the caliper bleed screw till you here fluid flowing. When the pedal bottoms, close the bleeder and have her release the pedal, repeat a few times until the clutch MC reservoir is ready to overflow, that proves no air is left. Close the slave bleeder and try the clutch for feel. Mercedes-Benz clutch master cylinders sit on an angle and are impossible to bleed other than this or with a pressure bleeder from below. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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