reamer Posted August 3, 2019 Share Posted August 3, 2019 Well I'm 4 hours into it, Removed the Radiator, AC condenser, Manual fuel pump, PS pump/bracket, Alt/bracket.... Yep, 5 bolts snapped! Water pump off, looks like the original 34 year old pump. About a quarter inch thick pile of flakey corrosion behind it. It was a true fight to get it off, and Yes, Idiot me broke the ears off the aluminum Timing cover! I still have not got the cover off, still solidly on the block! (I guess all those corroded studs that used to have heads are holding it on. I'm tempted to smash off the cover with a chisel:nabble_smiley_angry: Wondering if I should re-use the harmonic Balancer? The new cast iron water pump, Why is the rear cover on it loosely? so I can RTV around the ports? Reamer Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ArdWrknTrk Posted August 4, 2019 Share Posted August 4, 2019 There should be a gasket for the block off plate in whatever kit you buy. I went with FelPro, and there was everything I needed, except for RTV. Busted bolts are a bitch. But, at least, now that you've broken your timing cover you have nothing stopping you from getting caveman on what's left of it. Do like I said and inject some muriatic acid in around the broken bolts (now studs?) and let it dissolve the corrosion. Then you can gingerly pop the timing case off and get to work on those bolts.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ArdWrknTrk Posted August 4, 2019 Share Posted August 4, 2019 Is your harmonic damper's rubber in good shape? Did you check for scoring of the spacer? Those are the only two things I would worry about. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reamer Posted August 4, 2019 Author Share Posted August 4, 2019 Is your harmonic damper's rubber in good shape? Did you check for scoring of the spacer? Those are the only two things I would worry about. Hi Jim I have not got to the balancer yet, If the rubber look good I plan on using it. How long did you let the acid sit on the corrosion before it lets the cover move? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ArdWrknTrk Posted August 4, 2019 Share Posted August 4, 2019 Hi Jim I have not got to the balancer yet, If the rubber look good I plan on using it. How long did you let the acid sit on the corrosion before it lets the cover move? I've used this method to get alternators off before. The condition is the same. Water gets in, bolt shank rusts, aluminum/magnesium is more active than iron/carbon, and the white scunge forms packing the entire cavity and locking to the bolt (or what's left of it) so you can't turn it, and you can't pull it off even if the head snaps. You need to 'reduce' these oxides to get enough play. Oxides are preferentially dissolved by the acid (before it starts working on solid metal) Basically, the water or coolant has made a battery. You've seen what happens when a battery leaks inside your favorite Maglite. Drilling's not going to work because you can't stay centered on what's left of the much harder bolt. It's just a matter of burn and flush out with water. Repeat until the cavity is free. This is why I use PST, and stainless bolts. It has always come apart easy for me, since I had to go through what you're dealing with when my plastic gear first went bad at around 75k. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve83 Posted August 4, 2019 Share Posted August 4, 2019 Removed the Radiator, AC condenser, Manual fuel pump, PS pump/bracket, Alt/bracket...I highly recommend pulling the engine - it's actually a LOT less work, and FAR less-frustrating. You can actually get to what you're working on, and (most-importantly) you can seal the oil pan. Browse this photo album: https://supermotors.net/getfile/1142293/thumbnail/20181014_151203.jpg Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ArdWrknTrk Posted August 5, 2019 Share Posted August 5, 2019 Removed the Radiator, AC condenser, Manual fuel pump, PS pump/bracket, Alt/bracket...I highly recommend pulling the engine - it's actually a LOT less work, and FAR less-frustrating. You can actually get to what you're working on, and (most-importantly) you can seal the oil pan. Browse this photo album: https://supermotors.net/getfile/1142293/thumbnail/20181014_151203.jpg I can't imagine R&R'ing my engine in 5 hours, and I'd have the added hassles of clutch, intake, exhaust, and r&ring the hood by myself. 5 hours is about what I'd have in it since everything came apart easily, and I don't have A.I.R. pumps. IF I hadn't stopped to prep, paint and take pictures.... and, if I didn't wait overnight for JB Weld to harden. I have a big 460 and can comfortably sit on the sway bar cross member and work on the front of the engine. The Windsors must be even shorter than this????..... I don't know how y'all work at stealerships, but yanking an engine to replace a timing chain seems a bit OTT. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve83 Posted August 6, 2019 Share Posted August 6, 2019 I can't imagine R&R'ing my engine in 5 hours, and I'd have the added hassles of clutch, intake, exhaust, and r&ring the hood by myself. 5 hours is about what I'd have in it since everything came apart easily, and I don't have A.I.R. pumps. IF I hadn't stopped to prep, paint and take pictures.... and, if I didn't wait overnight for JB Weld to harden. I have a big 460 and can comfortably sit on the sway bar cross member and work on the front of the engine. The Windsors must be even shorter than this????..... I don't know how y'all work at stealerships, but yanking an engine to replace a timing chain seems a bit OTT. As you can see, I didn't pull the hood. I pulled the WP instead, which is much easier, and necessary anyway. Pulling the engine isn't "for the timing chain" - it's for the oil pan. Yes, many timing covers get replaced without pulling the pan, but I don't do it (or recommend doing it) that way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reamer Posted August 6, 2019 Author Share Posted August 6, 2019 As you can see, I didn't pull the hood. I pulled the WP instead, which is much easier, and necessary anyway. Pulling the engine isn't "for the timing chain" - it's for the oil pan. Yes, many timing covers get replaced without pulling the pan, but I don't do it (or recommend doing it) that way. Well 7 hours in, Finally got the cover off:nabble_anim_jump: Found it jumped a tooth and has a full inch of deflection! It was the original timing cover and plastic gear set up. The aluminum wall (between Water pump and chain compartment) started the corrode through too. CompCam roller chain and gears coming soon! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ArdWrknTrk Posted August 6, 2019 Share Posted August 6, 2019 Well 7 hours in, Finally got the cover off:nabble_anim_jump: Found it jumped a tooth and has a full inch of deflection! It was the original timing cover and plastic gear set up. The aluminum wall (between Water pump and chain compartment) started the corrode through too. CompCam roller chain and gears coming soon! Three hours work to get that cover off? I've got to give you the persistence award this week! 💪 Edit: I definitely would have cleaned that engine before touching a wrench. Not only are you getting dirty, you're risking dropping some of that oily grit into your engine. Are you able to get the broken bolts out of the block? I'm glad 460's have a water pump backing plate! My new FRPP one seems to be stainless (at least it shows no corrosion) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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