Gary Lewis Posted July 20, 2022 Author Share Posted July 20, 2022 Glad to hear your new tires are a tremendous improvement Gary! I think that your GVWR is limited in part by your brakes and driveline. Other factors such as front and rear sway bars will also effect the trucks ability to remain in control at the limit. Jim - The front brakes are from the '95 F350 that the D60 came from. So I'd bet that the front axle's GAWR is close to 4800. Would be nice to find someone that has a 95 F350 4x4 and get the GAWR off that. Toward that end I found an interesting conversation on another forum. Guy started a thread called '92 - '97 F-350: What GVWR(s) did they have? And a couple of guys we know batted it back and forth. I don't think they ever stated what the GAWR's are, although I might have missed it. But Diesel Brad said: It is TRUELY sad that a F250 is rated for 500lbs less than a F350 and the ONLY different is the 2" block on a F250/while the F350 is 4" block and the badge on the fender. Oh, yeah and the $1500 extra price tag on the F350. Boy, was he right! Big Blue is every bit of an F350 w/o the name plate. And the other guy, who shall remain nameless, said something that sounds familiar: So why does the GVWR not equal the sum of the GAWRs? I can't say for sure, but what it means is that I don't have to be incredibly careful about weight distribution when I'm loading the truck to the max. Bob - Yes, you are right - both times. I'll have to be incredibly careful about weight distribution or I'll be over the front GAWR shown on the certification label. But with the 95 front axle and SD springs I'm sure my actual front GAWR is about 1000 lbs higher than shown. Dane - Yes, things add up, and in a hurry. Which is why I'm really very pleasantly surprised that the weight isn't higher. But my Hilift is strapped to the top of the spare tire and takes up a lot of room. Just saw this and now I'm wondering if I could do something like that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ArdWrknTrk Posted July 20, 2022 Share Posted July 20, 2022 Jim - The front brakes are from the '95 F350 that the D60 came from. So I'd bet that the front axle's GAWR is close to 4800. Would be nice to find someone that has a 95 F350 4x4 and get the GAWR off that. Toward that end I found an interesting conversation on another forum. Guy started a thread called '92 - '97 F-350: What GVWR(s) did they have? And a couple of guys we know batted it back and forth. I don't think they ever stated what the GAWR's are, although I might have missed it. But Diesel Brad said: It is TRUELY sad that a F250 is rated for 500lbs less than a F350 and the ONLY different is the 2" block on a F250/while the F350 is 4" block and the badge on the fender. Oh, yeah and the $1500 extra price tag on the F350. Boy, was he right! Big Blue is every bit of an F350 w/o the name plate. And the other guy, who shall remain nameless, said something that sounds familiar: So why does the GVWR not equal the sum of the GAWRs? I can't say for sure, but what it means is that I don't have to be incredibly careful about weight distribution when I'm loading the truck to the max. Bob - Yes, you are right - both times. I'll have to be incredibly careful about weight distribution or I'll be over the front GAWR shown on the certification label. But with the 95 front axle and SD springs I'm sure my actual front GAWR is about 1000 lbs higher than shown. Dane - Yes, things add up, and in a hurry. Which is why I'm really very pleasantly surprised that the weight isn't higher. But my Hilift is strapped to the top of the spare tire and takes up a lot of room. Just saw this and now I'm wondering if I could do something like that. I don't mean to suggest that the brakes on the '95 axle aren't better than the dual piston brakes on an '85. But you will find 2 1/2, 3 & 3 1/2" drums on the back of these things. The D44hd (and D50 found on supercabs) definitely isn't as strong as your SAS, but again you don't run sway bars. As I mentioned before, the GVWR's are engineered to meet regulations. 8,600# put my truck out of reach of certain emissions regulations but if it was ONE POUND heavier it would have to be registered as a commercial vehicle. The same with the F-350. None of them are 11,000# or over. (because.....reasons. ) It makes sense to me that Ford would have different models to fit different tiers of Federal and State motor vehicle laws and regulations. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grumpin Posted July 20, 2022 Share Posted July 20, 2022 Jim - The front brakes are from the '95 F350 that the D60 came from. So I'd bet that the front axle's GAWR is close to 4800. Would be nice to find someone that has a 95 F350 4x4 and get the GAWR off that. Toward that end I found an interesting conversation on another forum. Guy started a thread called '92 - '97 F-350: What GVWR(s) did they have? And a couple of guys we know batted it back and forth. I don't think they ever stated what the GAWR's are, although I might have missed it. But Diesel Brad said: It is TRUELY sad that a F250 is rated for 500lbs less than a F350 and the ONLY different is the 2" block on a F250/while the F350 is 4" block and the badge on the fender. Oh, yeah and the $1500 extra price tag on the F350. Boy, was he right! Big Blue is every bit of an F350 w/o the name plate. And the other guy, who shall remain nameless, said something that sounds familiar: So why does the GVWR not equal the sum of the GAWRs? I can't say for sure, but what it means is that I don't have to be incredibly careful about weight distribution when I'm loading the truck to the max. Bob - Yes, you are right - both times. I'll have to be incredibly careful about weight distribution or I'll be over the front GAWR shown on the certification label. But with the 95 front axle and SD springs I'm sure my actual front GAWR is about 1000 lbs higher than shown. Dane - Yes, things add up, and in a hurry. Which is why I'm really very pleasantly surprised that the weight isn't higher. But my Hilift is strapped to the top of the spare tire and takes up a lot of room. Just saw this and now I'm wondering if I could do something like that. That Hi Jack mount is cool! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gary Lewis Posted July 20, 2022 Author Share Posted July 20, 2022 That Hi Jack mount is cool! Dane - Yes, it is! Jim - Yes, the F350 that the D60 came from may have had bigger rear brakes than those on Big Blue, but I'm just thinking of the front GAWR. I've been poking around and I've found a bunch of certification labels for '95 F350's with various front GAWR's. And those which are 4wd appear to have either 4400 or 4600 # ratings. But those with 4400 have load range D tires, and those with 4600 have load range E tires. The one below is from the truck on the right, and it has E tires. So I think it is safe to say that my front GAWR is probably 4600. Given that it looks like I have about 880 lbs left, and to do that means I need about 50 psi in the tires - minimum. I think today I'll see if I can figure out how much of the tire is touching at 60 psi. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nothing Special Posted July 20, 2022 Share Posted July 20, 2022 .... And the other guy, who shall remain nameless, said something that sounds familiar: So why does the GVWR not equal the sum of the GAWRs? I can't say for sure, but what it means is that I don't have to be incredibly careful about weight distribution when I'm loading the truck to the max..... Interesting that my wording was so much the same 6 years apart. I guess I'm consistent if not creative! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gary Lewis Posted July 20, 2022 Author Share Posted July 20, 2022 .... And the other guy, who shall remain nameless, said something that sounds familiar: So why does the GVWR not equal the sum of the GAWRs? I can't say for sure, but what it means is that I don't have to be incredibly careful about weight distribution when I'm loading the truck to the max..... Interesting that my wording was so much the same 6 years apart. I guess I'm consistent if not creative! I thought it was interesting that you'd had the same conversation back then. So you've been over this ground before. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
85lebaront2 Posted July 20, 2022 Share Posted July 20, 2022 I don't mean to suggest that the brakes on the '95 axle aren't better than the dual piston brakes on an '85. But you will find 2 1/2, 3 & 3 1/2" drums on the back of these things. The D44hd (and D50 found on supercabs) definitely isn't as strong as your SAS, but again you don't run sway bars. As I mentioned before, the GVWR's are engineered to meet regulations. 8,600# put my truck out of reach of certain emissions regulations but if it was ONE POUND heavier it would have to be registered as a commercial vehicle. The same with the F-350. None of them are 11,000# or over. (because.....reasons. ) It makes sense to me that Ford would have different models to fit different tiers of Federal and State motor vehicle laws and regulations. Jim, you are exactly right. Darth came with 2 1/2" wide rear brakes, the 1993 rear axle I put in him to replace the one the inner bearing had spun on has 3 1/2" wide brakes. I have the later master cylinder and booster from the 1990 F250 (which had 3" rear brakes). I do still have the load compensating valve in the rear so haven't had issues with locking the rears under hard braking. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gary Lewis Posted July 20, 2022 Author Share Posted July 20, 2022 Jim, you are exactly right. Darth came with 2 1/2" wide rear brakes, the 1993 rear axle I put in him to replace the one the inner bearing had spun on has 3 1/2" wide brakes. I have the later master cylinder and booster from the 1990 F250 (which had 3" rear brakes). I do still have the load compensating valve in the rear so haven't had issues with locking the rears under hard braking. Got the truck ready for our jaunt tomorrow, and now need to set up the Garmin for it. But while I was getting things ready I did some thinking about mounting the Hi-lift jack. First, I tried it in the space under the cannister for the bed cover and it is a nice fit. But I don't quite know how to secure it there and I sure don't want it bouncing around. Maybe if I mounted it to a couple of pieces of wood and put another piece of wood on top I could get it to just the right height to slip under the cannister tightly? Anyone have a good idea? Also, note the weights on that spare tire! That's pretty much what all of the Coopers looked like. And then I tried it on the bedside. This is a much handier location, but that jack is heavy and it needs support. The mount for the Jeep Gladiator uses the mounting track that Jeep put at the top of the bedside and hangs the jack from that. I could put nutserts in the rib you see on the side of the bed to hold studs that would go through the holes in the jack, but those wouldn't come close to holding the jack up. So I'd have to find a way to support it from below, maybe off the tire bump in the bed. Ideas? Here's how I'm carrying it now, and it is surely going to be in the way when we want to load up. So I would like to find a better way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grumpin Posted July 20, 2022 Share Posted July 20, 2022 Got the truck ready for our jaunt tomorrow, and now need to set up the Garmin for it. But while I was getting things ready I did some thinking about mounting the Hi-lift jack. First, I tried it in the space under the cannister for the bed cover and it is a nice fit. But I don't quite know how to secure it there and I sure don't want it bouncing around. Maybe if I mounted it to a couple of pieces of wood and put another piece of wood on top I could get it to just the right height to slip under the cannister tightly? Anyone have a good idea? Also, note the weights on that spare tire! That's pretty much what all of the Coopers looked like. And then I tried it on the bedside. This is a much handier location, but that jack is heavy and it needs support. The mount for the Jeep Gladiator uses the mounting track that Jeep put at the top of the bedside and hangs the jack from that. I could put nutserts in the rib you see on the side of the bed to hold studs that would go through the holes in the jack, but those wouldn't come close to holding the jack up. So I'd have to find a way to support it from below, maybe off the tire bump in the bed. Ideas? Here's how I'm carrying it now, and it is surely going to be in the way when we want to load up. So I would like to find a better way. Found this. https://www.amazon.com/Hi-Lift-LR-200-Loc-Rac-Mounting-System/dp/B00042K74I ETA: On Hi Lifts website, https://hi-lift.com/product/hi-lift-loc-rac-mounting-system/ ETAA: I forgot you have a tonneau cover. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gary Lewis Posted July 20, 2022 Author Share Posted July 20, 2022 Found this. https://www.amazon.com/Hi-Lift-LR-200-Loc-Rac-Mounting-System/dp/B00042K74I ETA: On Hi Lifts website, https://hi-lift.com/product/hi-lift-loc-rac-mounting-system/ ETAA: I forgot you have a tonneau cover. Yes, with the cover that mounting approach won't work. But thanks! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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