grumpin Posted April 16, 2022 Share Posted April 16, 2022 Dane - Does it take an EVA to cycle the tanks? I think that's what you are implying. Stir the tanks maybe the proper term NASA used. No EVA! Just referring to Apollo 13’s mishap. Your engine bay reminds me of spacecraft back in the day. And I agree with Jim, looks good and a lot of work! Hadn’t thought of the weight, probably a wee bit heavier! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ArdWrknTrk Posted April 16, 2022 Share Posted April 16, 2022 Yep, and yep. And yep about the deal having "gone down". I'm sure that wasn't what you originally meant, but ask anyone that was at Sears, and things went D.O.W.N. Anyway, you are right that a lot can change 'twixt now and Octoberish, and I'm going to remain flexible. The trip may not happen, but it won't be Bret's fault. However, I'm going to do everything I can to be ready, inc getting Big Blue in shape. So, back to the testing. So far it is going well. Definitely post a video when you go to fire it up! As for Bret I hope by then he has things sorted and room to breathe, if not a better environment altogether. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gary Lewis Posted April 16, 2022 Author Share Posted April 16, 2022 Dane - Does it take an EVA to cycle the tanks? I think that's what you are implying. Stir the tanks maybe the proper term NASA used. No EVA! Just referring to Apollo 13’s mishap. Your engine bay reminds me of spacecraft back in the day. And I agree with Jim, looks good and a lot of work! Hadn’t thought of the weight, probably a wee bit heavier! Dane - I'm guessing the aluminum insulation is what makes you think "space craft"? Jim - I'll try to remember to do a video when it comes time to start it. (Notice I didn't say "try" to start it. ) Time for a midday report. Checked everything from the ECU's connector and it all works, save for the very last thing to test - BOO: Brake On/Off. Looking at the schematics I see that there is one circuit in the '85: Fuse > Stop Lamp Switch > Clutch Switch > Speed Control. But in the '96 there are two circuits: Fuse > Stop Lamp Switch > ECU (BOO) & Fuse > Clutch Switch > Speed Control. I'm afraid I somehow merged the two '96 circuits, so am now trying to get my head around what I've done. Also, I re-discovered a red wire under the dash that goes from the trailer brake controller to the brake switch. So obviously now is the time to add that one in. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gary Lewis Posted April 16, 2022 Author Share Posted April 16, 2022 Dane - I'm guessing the aluminum insulation is what makes you think "space craft"? Jim - I'll try to remember to do a video when it comes time to start it. (Notice I didn't say "try" to start it. ) Time for a midday report. Checked everything from the ECU's connector and it all works, save for the very last thing to test - BOO: Brake On/Off. Looking at the schematics I see that there is one circuit in the '85: Fuse > Stop Lamp Switch > Clutch Switch > Speed Control. But in the '96 there are two circuits: Fuse > Stop Lamp Switch > ECU (BOO) & Fuse > Clutch Switch > Speed Control. I'm afraid I somehow merged the two '96 circuits, so am now trying to get my head around what I've done. Also, I re-discovered a red wire under the dash that goes from the trailer brake controller to the brake switch. So obviously now is the time to add that one in. I think I've worked out what the issue is - I wired it the '85 way and not the '96 way. Bill - In your estimation is this going to be an issue? I can't imagine why the computer really needs to know when the brakes are applied on a manual tranny. But what will it do when the input is neither ground or 12v, which is what will happen when the clutch pedal is depressed? On the left is the '96 wiring with two different branches, one with the clutch switch to the speed control and one w/o the clutch switch to the ECU. On the right is mine with one circuit serving both speed control and ECU. I'd like to leave it that way just for simplicity as I'd need to get back into the harness to change that, but can if I should. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gary Lewis Posted April 16, 2022 Author Share Posted April 16, 2022 I think I've worked out what the issue is - I wired it the '85 way and not the '96 way. Bill - In your estimation is this going to be an issue? I can't imagine why the computer really needs to know when the brakes are applied on a manual tranny. But what will it do when the input is neither ground or 12v, which is what will happen when the clutch pedal is depressed? On the left is the '96 wiring with two different branches, one with the clutch switch to the speed control and one w/o the clutch switch to the ECU. On the right is mine with one circuit serving both speed control and ECU. I'd like to leave it that way just for simplicity as I'd need to get back into the harness to change that, but can if I should. And at the risk of making Bill, or anyone else for that matter, miss my question above re the clutch switch, I'll post a couple of pics with a bit more black to hide the shiny aluminium. I installed the intake hoses. Now it is ready for the next step, which is to set the timing, but that will have to wait for another day. First, here's the front view: And here's the side view: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
85lebaront2 Posted April 16, 2022 Share Posted April 16, 2022 I think I've worked out what the issue is - I wired it the '85 way and not the '96 way. Bill - In your estimation is this going to be an issue? I can't imagine why the computer really needs to know when the brakes are applied on a manual tranny. But what will it do when the input is neither ground or 12v, which is what will happen when the clutch pedal is depressed? On the left is the '96 wiring with two different branches, one with the clutch switch to the speed control and one w/o the clutch switch to the ECU. On the right is mine with one circuit serving both speed control and ECU. I'd like to leave it that way just for simplicity as I'd need to get back into the harness to change that, but can if I should. Go to your starting system diagram, it shows all 3 of the CPP switches in the assembly. There are definitely some questions in my mind as to what happens inside that switch. The cruise control is supposed to cancel upon seeing 12V on the brake light circuit, but it also needs to cancel if the clutch pedal is depressed, otherwise as the truck slowed it would attempt to compensate by opening the throttle so something has to apply 12V to circuit 306 when just the clutch pedal is depressed. I don't have a CPP switch to play with, or I would experiment with it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gary Lewis Posted April 16, 2022 Author Share Posted April 16, 2022 Go to your starting system diagram, it shows all 3 of the CPP switches in the assembly. There are definitely some questions in my mind as to what happens inside that switch. The cruise control is supposed to cancel upon seeing 12V on the brake light circuit, but it also needs to cancel if the clutch pedal is depressed, otherwise as the truck slowed it would attempt to compensate by opening the throttle so something has to apply 12V to circuit 306 when just the clutch pedal is depressed. I don't have a CPP switch to play with, or I would experiment with it. Oh my goodness! I'd not ever looked at that thing! Ok, it looks to me like the ECU pulls the starter relay in. It supplies power on the LB/Y wire from Pin 64 and that goes through the left switch in the CPP then down through A to the starter relay. But I'm not using that to pull in the starter as I'm still using the '85 starter wiring through the ignition switch and the clutch switch. I don't think the computer will know, so all should be good. But the speed control circuit is as I drew it above, with the brake on/off switch in series with the right switch of the CPP. And that's how I have it wired. So that's good. But I haven't figured out what the center switch of the CPP goes to. Circuit 33 nor W/PK are used to the ECU, and GY/Y is only used with the Canister Purge Solenoid, which says "Not Used". Guess I won't worry about it. But back to my question: Will the ECU care that its Turn/Stop/Hazard lamp input goes wonky when I push the clutch in and it sees neither ground through the bulbs or 12v via the brake switch? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
85lebaront2 Posted April 16, 2022 Share Posted April 16, 2022 Oh my goodness! I'd not ever looked at that thing! Ok, it looks to me like the ECU pulls the starter relay in. It supplies power on the LB/Y wire from Pin 64 and that goes through the left switch in the CPP then down through A to the starter relay. But I'm not using that to pull in the starter as I'm still using the '85 starter wiring through the ignition switch and the clutch switch. I don't think the computer will know, so all should be good. But the speed control circuit is as I drew it above, with the brake on/off switch in series with the right switch of the CPP. And that's how I have it wired. So that's good. But I haven't figured out what the center switch of the CPP goes to. Circuit 33 nor W/PK are used to the ECU, and GY/Y is only used with the Canister Purge Solenoid, which says "Not Used". Guess I won't worry about it. But back to my question: Will the ECU care that its Turn/Stop/Hazard lamp input goes wonky when I push the clutch in and it sees neither ground through the bulbs or 12v via the brake switch? ECU does not pull the starter relay in, circuit 32 is the starter relay feed from the ignition switch. It goes through either the CPP on a manual transmission or the neutral safety/manual lever position switch to ensure either the clutch is disengaged or the transmission is in N or P. Circuit 511 is brake lights (goes to 3rd brake light and turn signal switch), it goes to the ECU to tell it to unlock the Torque Converter Clutch. It goes through the clutch switch so the cruise control is cancelled when the brakes are applied. How it works when the clutch is pushed in is another story all together. 480/199 go through the CPP and 511 goes to the cruise control and with the clutch pedal pushed in so does 306. Like I said, I would like to have one to experiment with as far as timing of the contact pairs related to pedal travel. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gary Lewis Posted April 16, 2022 Author Share Posted April 16, 2022 ECU does not pull the starter relay in, circuit 32 is the starter relay feed from the ignition switch. It goes through either the CPP on a manual transmission or the neutral safety/manual lever position switch to ensure either the clutch is disengaged or the transmission is in N or P. Circuit 511 is brake lights (goes to 3rd brake light and turn signal switch), it goes to the ECU to tell it to unlock the Torque Converter Clutch. It goes through the clutch switch so the cruise control is cancelled when the brakes are applied. How it works when the clutch is pushed in is another story all together. 480/199 go through the CPP and 511 goes to the cruise control and with the clutch pedal pushed in so does 306. Like I said, I would like to have one to experiment with as far as timing of the contact pairs related to pedal travel. I'm going to have to study those schematics, but it sure looks to me like the ECU is all that connects to the high side of the starter relay. Going to watch a movie but will work on it later. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gary Lewis Posted April 17, 2022 Author Share Posted April 17, 2022 I'm going to have to study those schematics, but it sure looks to me like the ECU is all that connects to the high side of the starter relay. Going to watch a movie but will work on it later. Bill - The schematics below show what I think they are saying for a manual transmission. But I find that really strange since it says that for a manual transmission the ECU pulls the start relay in, and for an automatic the key does. What am I missing? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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