Big Blue's Transformation

[ArdWrknTrk]

I second that he needs to ditch the aluminum, that's way too much flex.

Too much flex, and TOO much fatigue cracking.

Gary, if you have room you could just weld the angles up inverted.

As long as the 'leg' hits both holes in the cable bracket it doesn't have to be square.

But I'm here playing armchair quarterback, and don't have it in front of me.

[Gary Lewis]

Too much flex, and TOO much fatigue cracking.

Gary, if you have room you could just weld the angles up inverted.

As long as the 'leg' hits both holes in the cable bracket it doesn't have to be square.

But I'm here playing armchair quarterback, and don't have it in front of me.

We may be on the same page, Jim. I've been staring at my TurboCAD screen trying to figure out how to show this in 3D, but let me describe what I think I've come to.

In this pic I'd trim the throttle bracket as show with the red lines and drill holes where shown. The a piece of angle would run across the back of the carb with the side flange pointing down, behind the carb. And another piece of angle would come straight back, but it would have its side flange going up on the far left, and its bottom flange would go under the side flange of the angle on the carb.

Assuming 1 1/2" angle, that would put the mounting flange for the bracket 1 1/2" below where it is in the previous pics, and solve to "too high" problem.

And the side flange on the front/rear piece of angle would box the other angle. Plus, I could extend that other angle to the passenger's side slightly and box it. So there wouldn't be any flex.

Does any of that make sense? Do I need to draw it?

[ArdWrknTrk]

We may be on the same page, Jim. I've been staring at my TurboCAD screen trying to figure out how to show this in 3D, but let me describe what I think I've come to.

In this pic I'd trim the throttle bracket as show with the red lines and drill holes where shown. The a piece of angle would run across the back of the carb with the side flange pointing down, behind the carb. And another piece of angle would come straight back, but it would have its side flange going up on the far left, and its bottom flange would go under the side flange of the angle on the carb.

Assuming 1 1/2" angle, that would put the mounting flange for the bracket 1 1/2" below where it is in the previous pics, and solve to "too high" problem.

And the side flange on the front/rear piece of angle would box the other angle. Plus, I could extend that other angle to the passenger's side slightly and box it. So there wouldn't be any flex.

Does any of that make sense? Do I need to draw it?

I understand.

But I'm "not right" when I visualize things.

Last week when working on the docks the boat owner asked if I could make a console for his boat with cup holders, a phone pocket with USB to charge his phone, and room for a single DIN Bluetooth radio.

Also some hardwood coaming for the gunwales where you step aboard on either side.

I told him I'd have to mock it up in CAD.

The next day I showed up with a bunch of boxes and my hot glue gun!

Cardboard aided design is a specialty!

He seemed shocked....

 

[Gary Lewis]

I understand.

But I'm "not right" when I visualize things.

Last week when working on the docks the boat owner asked if I could make a console for his boat with cup holders, a phone pocket with USB to charge his phone, and room for a single DIN Bluetooth radio.

Also some hardwood coaming for the gunwales where you step aboard on either side.

I told him I'd have to mock it up in CAD.

The next day I showed up with a bunch of boxes and my hot glue gun!

Cardboard aided design is a specialty!

He seemed shocked....

I'm horrible when I try to visualize things, so that type of CAD would be a good idea for me.

Let's try this. The red angle is the one going across the back of the carb. The black angle is the one going back from the red one, and you can see that it boxes the end of the red angle in. And the green is a piece welded to the red angle to box the other end in, so there's no flex.

Is that halfway between cardboard and computer aided design?

[ArdWrknTrk]

I'm horrible when I try to visualize things, so that type of CAD would be a good idea for me.

Let's try this. The red angle is the one going across the back of the carb. The black angle is the one going back from the red one, and you can see that it boxes the end of the red angle in. And the green is a piece welded to the red angle to box the other end in, so there's no flex.

Is that halfway between cardboard and computer aided design?

I got it the first time.

I think it might need iteration, but seems better than hacking the bottom off the cable mount.

[Gary Lewis]

I got it the first time.

I think it might need iteration, but seems better than hacking the bottom off the cable mount.

Well, phooey!

If you look at this pic I've pointed to a standoff that holds the injector brackets. It is just under the aluminum plate, and while I don't know how far, I fear it is a lot less than the flange height of the angle I was planning to use. In other words, I don't think I can drop it down 1 1/2".

So I'll need to determine how much room I have and either use a piece of angle with a shorter flange or not put the fore/aft angle fully below the other one, but butt it into it part way down.

Its a shame that the standoff ends other than horizontally or I might could use it to stabilize the end of the angle.

 

[ArdWrknTrk]

Well, phooey!

If you look at this pic I've pointed to a standoff that holds the injector brackets. It is just under the aluminum plate, and while I don't know how far, I fear it is a lot less than the flange height of the angle I was planning to use. In other words, I don't think I can drop it down 1 1/2".

So I'll need to determine how much room I have and either use a piece of angle with a shorter flange or not put the fore/aft angle fully below the other one, but butt it into it part way down.

Its a shame that the standoff ends other than horizontally or I might could use it to stabilize the end of the angle.

Where does the bracket end if you get that aluminum plate out of the way and have the throttle cable straight?

I'm thinking you can turn the outer (fore & aft) piece, so its leg is facing out and go right around that boss.

Or, heat and bend to where the lower part of the 'L' fits nice to the top of the boss while the portion for the cable bracket remains horizontal.

For that matter nothing says the bracket needs to be horizontal.

The cable itself is a point in two dimensions and a ray -or line- in space.

[ArdWrknTrk]

I'm horrible when I try to visualize things, so that type of CAD would be a good idea for me.

Let's try this. The red angle is the one going across the back of the carb. The black angle is the one going back from the red one, and you can see that it boxes the end of the red angle in. And the green is a piece welded to the red angle to box the other end in, so there's no flex.

Is that halfway between cardboard and computer aided design?

Your drawing looks like it places the cable bracket directly behind the carb stud....

Turn the black angle around and weld it to the back of the red angle.

Chop the 'foot' back at a 45, or whatever it takes to clear the boss.

Weld that piece back on the other side of vertical to make a gusset.

Don't worry so much about boxing everything in.

Nothing in this universe is truly rigid.

And anything more than a triangle across the legs of the angle is superfluous.

[Gary Lewis]

Your drawing looks like it places the cable bracket directly behind the carb stud....

Turn the black angle around and weld it to the back of the red angle.

Chop the 'foot' back at a 45, or whatever it takes to clear the boss.

Weld that piece back on the other side of vertical to make a gusset.

Don't worry so much about boxing everything in.

Nothing in this universe is truly rigid.

And anything more than a triangle across the legs of the angle is superfluous.

Jim - I'll confess I didn't follow all of that. But I appreciate the suggestions. So let me ask some questions and make comments to try to understand:

• Turning the fore/aft piece so the horizonal part faces out would work, and I like that. And hopefully I could cut a divot in it to miss the boss.

• I'll have to check the height of the top of the boss to see if I can use it in some way and still get the bracket down where I want it.

• Agreed that the throttle cable won't care if it is rotated, but there's also the speed control cable which parallels the throttle cable. And while it uses a chain so can probably be rotated some, it would be best to keep it horizontal to the throttle cable.

As for placement of the bracket, perhaps this pic will help. The carb bolt spacing is 5.16", so I'd guess that the throttle cable is roughly 3 1/2" outboard of the left carb bolt.

I'll have to do a lot more playing with things to figure out where it can all go. But that probably won't happen until Friday as the kids have come back as of last night for a few days before leaving for Charleston.

I wish this was a candidate for CAD, but I fear cardboard is too flimsy. But perhaps I can c-clamp a couple of pieces of angle together with the bracket bolted to one of them and get a better handle on where that boss is and how to get around it. Or at worst case tack weld them together.

[85lebaront2]

Jim - I'll confess I didn't follow all of that. But I appreciate the suggestions. So let me ask some questions and make comments to try to understand:

• Turning the fore/aft piece so the horizonal part faces out would work, and I like that. And hopefully I could cut a divot in it to miss the boss.

• I'll have to check the height of the top of the boss to see if I can use it in some way and still get the bracket down where I want it.

• Agreed that the throttle cable won't care if it is rotated, but there's also the speed control cable which parallels the throttle cable. And while it uses a chain so can probably be rotated some, it would be best to keep it horizontal to the throttle cable.

As for placement of the bracket, perhaps this pic will help. The carb bolt spacing is 5.16", so I'd guess that the throttle cable is roughly 3 1/2" outboard of the left carb bolt.

I'll have to do a lot more playing with things to figure out where it can all go. But that probably won't happen until Friday as the kids have come back as of last night for a few days before leaving for Charleston.

I wish this was a candidate for CAD, but I fear cardboard is too flimsy. But perhaps I can c-clamp a couple of pieces of angle together with the bracket bolted to one of them and get a better handle on where that boss is and how to get around it. Or at worst case tack weld them together.

Gary, will the cable casing allow the bracket to be turned 90°? If so do that and bolt it on the plate sideways, other possibility is use the cruise control cable bracket. Neither of those (cables included) will be of use to you once the plenum and throttle body are mounted.