Big Blue's Transformation

[Gary Lewis]

What am I missing that might be big gotchas?

Too much enjoyment driving it that you won't want to take it down again?

Perhaps! But it'll be fun either way.

[ArdWrknTrk]

Guys - As I'm sitting in Barnes & Noble thinking about things I've come to a conclusion I want to bounce off of you. And that conclusion is that I want to break Big Blue's Transformation into two phases:

• Phase 1: New carbureted 460, ZF5, D60 SAS, yada, yada, yada

• Phase 2: EFI for the engine, upgraded fuel system, etc

The reasoning for this is to get Big Blue back on the road and to enjoy him a bit before launching into the next phase, which will be over the next winter.

I think the downside is that there are a few things I'll do that will have to be undone, like installation of the seat and carpet - which may have to come out if I put the ECU under the seat. And the aux battery, which may have to be relocated when the EFI goes in due to all the things that will be lined up along the driver's fender. And, I'll have to buy a carb adapter for the EFI lower plenum. But, for the most part I don't think there will be all that much re-work.

What are your thoughts? What am I missing that might be big gotchas?

You know, before I had to give away the 450's excellent running engine (and Y-piped non-catalyst exhaust) I was sorely tempted to just throw a Price Motorsport adapter plate and my 750 Holley on it and drop it in 'Lil Red.

[1986F150Six]

What are your thoughts? What am I missing that might be big gotchas?

Two phases is a good idea! Babies crawl and then walk!

[Ford F834]

Guys - As I'm sitting in Barnes & Noble thinking about things I've come to a conclusion I want to bounce off of you. And that conclusion is that I want to break Big Blue's Transformation into two phases:

• Phase 1: New carbureted 460, ZF5, D60 SAS, yada, yada, yada

• Phase 2: EFI for the engine, upgraded fuel system, etc

The reasoning for this is to get Big Blue back on the road and to enjoy him a bit before launching into the next phase, which will be over the next winter.

I think the downside is that there are a few things I'll do that will have to be undone, like installation of the seat and carpet - which may have to come out if I put the ECU under the seat. And the aux battery, which may have to be relocated when the EFI goes in due to all the things that will be lined up along the driver's fender. And, I'll have to buy a carb adapter for the EFI lower plenum. But, for the most part I don't think there will be all that much re-work.

What are your thoughts? What am I missing that might be big gotchas?

+1 on the two phase approach. The little bit of back tracking you will have to do is not that bad, and worth it in my opinion. Not only will you be able to enjoy the truck this year during the nice weather, but it will give you the chance to test and work the bugs out of phase 1 before taking on phase 2. That is the problem with changing/rebuilding many things at once, you have test and fine tune several things at once. If it were me, I’d want the new engine and driveline swap stuff all tested, tried and true, before throwing the EFI electrical and fuel delivery aspect at it. Maybe it’s my loathing of multitasking, but that’s how I would want to approach it.

[Gary Lewis]

+1 on the two phase approach. The little bit of back tracking you will have to do is not that bad, and worth it in my opinion. Not only will you be able to enjoy the truck this year during the nice weather, but it will give you the chance to test and work the bugs out of phase 1 before taking on phase 2. That is the problem with changing/rebuilding many things at once, you have test and fine tune several things at once. If it were me, I’d want the new engine and driveline swap stuff all tested, tried and true, before throwing the EFI electrical and fuel delivery aspect at it. Maybe it’s my loathing of multitasking, but that’s how I would want to approach it.

Ok, that's a quorum, and all seem in favor. (Jim - I take your comments as in favor. Right?)

Next, I need to think through the carburetion. Brandon/Bruno2 has the 750 Eddy on the shelf in a zip lock bag and I can borrow it, or maybe even buy it back. But I think he bought it for future use, and next fall/winter might be future enough for him.

However, I have the 750 CFM Street Demon on the shelf. It was used to break in Dad's engine on Tim's dyno, and it worked well. In fact, Tim said there was only a very few HP diff between it and the 750 Holley they normally run on the dyno, and he liked the carb.

I could borrow the Eddy and create a baseline with it, knowing it worked well on the previous engine. And then go for the Street Demon and see what difference it makes.

Thoughts?

[grumpin]

Ok, that's a quorum, and all seem in favor. (Jim - I take your comments as in favor. Right?)

Next, I need to think through the carburetion. Brandon/Bruno2 has the 750 Eddy on the shelf in a zip lock bag and I can borrow it, or maybe even buy it back. But I think he bought it for future use, and next fall/winter might be future enough for him.

However, I have the 750 CFM Street Demon on the shelf. It was used to break in Dad's engine on Tim's dyno, and it worked well. In fact, Tim said there was only a very few HP diff between it and the 750 Holley they normally run on the dyno, and he liked the carb.

I could borrow the Eddy and create a baseline with it, knowing it worked well on the previous engine. And then go for the Street Demon and see what difference it makes.

Thoughts?

I’m in on two phases, great point about working out the bugs before phase 2.

The Holley. I’ve never had one before this truck, I really like them. If you remember I put a new classic Holley 600 CFM with the electric choke to replace my OEM Holley. Bumped the jets down two for the altitude here. Very easy to do.

[Gary Lewis]

I’m in on two phases, great point about working out the bugs before phase 2.

The Holley. I’ve never had one before this truck, I really like them. If you remember I put a new classic Holley 600 CFM with the electric choke to replace my OEM Holley. Bumped the jets down two for the altitude here. Very easy to do.

Thanks, Dane. But, of all the carbs in the world, a VV is at the bottom of my list and a Holley is the next notch up. The VV is at the bottom because the only thing I know about it is that they aren't "normal". Even back in their day they weren't understood.

As for the Holleys, anything that holds fuel in with gaskets or fabric doesn't seem like a good idea to me. I've had Holleys and while they do great for full-throttle acceleration they aren't the easiest to maintain. Mine have leaked at the gaskets and accelerator pump, and suffered blown power valves.

So things like the Q-Jet and carbs derived from Carters are my pick since they hold fuel in with metal. And Edelbrocks are basically Carters. But the Street Demon is a fairly new carb that follows in that vein. However, the one I have has a polymer bowl that is intended to keep the fuel cool. And that's derived from the Thermoquad.

[85lebaront2]

Thanks, Dane. But, of all the carbs in the world, a VV is at the bottom of my list and a Holley is the next notch up. The VV is at the bottom because the only thing I know about it is that they aren't "normal". Even back in their day they weren't understood.

As for the Holleys, anything that holds fuel in with gaskets or fabric doesn't seem like a good idea to me. I've had Holleys and while they do great for full-throttle acceleration they aren't the easiest to maintain. Mine have leaked at the gaskets and accelerator pump, and suffered blown power valves.

So things like the Q-Jet and carbs derived from Carters are my pick since they hold fuel in with metal. And Edelbrocks are basically Carters. But the Street Demon is a fairly new carb that follows in that vein. However, the one I have has a polymer bowl that is intended to keep the fuel cool. And that's derived from the Thermoquad.

Gary, the VV is sort of like English Carburettors, a constant depression design (not the condition of the poor bloke working on them). The idea being that the depression (vacuum) across the venturii and nozzle are the same no matter how much air is being pulled through. The non-feedback versions are actually pretty simple, and if you have a tool that can set them for the correct mixture running can deliver amazing fuel economy.

Try 25 mpg with a 312, BW T85 w/od and a 3.70 rear in a 1958 F100, still had plenty of power.

[Gary Lewis]

Gary, the VV is sort of like English Carburettors, a constant depression design (not the condition of the poor bloke working on them). The idea being that the depression (vacuum) across the venturii and nozzle are the same no matter how much air is being pulled through. The non-feedback versions are actually pretty simple, and if you have a tool that can set them for the correct mixture running can deliver amazing fuel economy.

Try 25 mpg with a 312, BW T85 w/od and a 3.70 rear in a 1958 F100, still had plenty of power.

Dane - I hope my response wasn't too derogatory on Holleys. A lot of people like them. But my experience hasn't been good.

Bill - I've never worked on a VV, in spite of owning one. However, I've worked on plenty of carbs with the same design, so I know the design is sound. And I assume it is just the unfamiliarity that turned others off.

Anyway, let me pose a question to y'all: Should I start Big Blue up for breaking in the cam on the Eddy that was on him, and then go to the Street Demon? Or just go for the Street Demon?

[ArdWrknTrk]

Dane - I hope my response wasn't too derogatory on Holleys. A lot of people like them. But my experience hasn't been good.

Bill - I've never worked on a VV, in spite of owning one. However, I've worked on plenty of carbs with the same design, so I know the design is sound. And I assume it is just the unfamiliarity that turned others off.

Anyway, let me pose a question to y'all: Should I start Big Blue up for breaking in the cam on the Eddy that was on him, and then go to the Street Demon? Or just go for the Street Demon?

Just go for the Street Demon