Big Blue's Transformation

[Gary Lewis]

I was right! I plugged the supply and return ports and put air back to it. After 20 minutes there were no leaks of gas, and a copious spray of soapy water got no bubbles at all - including on the filler hose.

So it is now going back together.

Got it all back together. But getting the skid plate on isn't fun. Anyway, it is on and tomorrow I'll work on the front wheel bearing.

[Gary Lewis]

Got it all back together. But getting the skid plate on isn't fun. Anyway, it is on and tomorrow I'll work on the front wheel bearing.

As said, I'm working on the RF wheel bearings and I'm confused. I've copied part of 2 pages, below, that have to do with adjusting the wheel bearings from the 1995 FSM and there appears to be a mistake in them.

There are two sets of instructions - one for automatic locking hubs, which is on the left although you can't see the header, and one for manual locking hubs on the right. Rock Auto shows that there is just one set of wheel bearings regardless of locking hub type. In fact, there is only one set of hubs. So I'd expect the adjustment portion for the wheel bearings to be the same.

But they aren't. You can see below that I've highlighted the auto hub instruction to tighten the retainer nut to 16 lb-in after backing it off 90 degrees, and that I've circled the manual instruction to just back it off 90 degrees. I think that is an error as I believe the manual hub bearings should also be torqued to 16 lb-in.

So I'm going to put the hub back together that way and check the end play against the specs. But I thought I'd see what y'all think. Is this an error or am I missing something?

[ArdWrknTrk]

As said, I'm working on the RF wheel bearings and I'm confused. I've copied part of 2 pages, below, that have to do with adjusting the wheel bearings from the 1995 FSM and there appears to be a mistake in them.

There are two sets of instructions - one for automatic locking hubs, which is on the left although you can't see the header, and one for manual locking hubs on the right. Rock Auto shows that there is just one set of wheel bearings regardless of locking hub type. In fact, there is only one set of hubs. So I'd expect the adjustment portion for the wheel bearings to be the same.

But they aren't. You can see below that I've highlighted the auto hub instruction to tighten the retainer nut to 16 lb-in after backing it off 90 degrees, and that I've circled the manual instruction to just back it off 90 degrees. I think that is an error as I believe the manual hub bearings should also be torqued to 16 lb-in.

So I'm going to put the hub back together that way and check the end play against the specs. But I thought I'd see what y'all think. Is this an error or am I missing something?

The FSM does seem to be missing the idea that wheel bearings need some kind of preload.

I've always flown by the seat of my pants and tightened the nut until there is no play but the wheel is free to spin.

(I wouldn't even know what 16 lbin feels like on a nut that big! )

[Gary Lewis]

The FSM does seem to be missing the idea that wheel bearings need some kind of preload.

I've always flown by the seat of my pants and tightened the nut until there is no play but the wheel is free to spin.

(I wouldn't even know what 16 lbin feels like on a nut that big! )

Thanks, Jim. It helps to have someone think through this with me.

And to your question about a race moving or some such, I think the issue is that I followed the FSM and just backed off the nut by 90 degrees. In fact, I'm quite sure that's the case since when I tried to torque that nut to 16 lb-in I discovered that my 1/4" drive Computorque torque wrench only goes down to 24. And since I didn't already know that I must not have torqued the nuts to 16 last time.

So I dug out my itty bitty beam style torque wrench that has increments of 5 lb-in and torqued it to ~16. But the lockwasher holes didn't line up with the pin, so I did what the FSM said and turned it a teeny bit more to line the pin up with next hole. And, oddly enough, that appears to be about 24 lb-in.

Then I pulled out the dial test indicator and checked end play. The increments on it are .0005" and I could just get the needle to wiggle, so I might have .0001". That fits in the .000 to .004" range in the specs, so I'm happy.

So then I tried testing the rotational torque, which is supposed to be less than 20 lb-in. And here's my setup. The hub rotates when I get to 5 lb-in, so I'm thinking that it means it takes 12.5/9.25 x 5 = 7 lb-in. Right? Did I do the physics/math right? (I have a very old degree in both, but...)

So tomorrow I'll pull the driver's side down and measure the end play there. If it is more than .004" I'll adjust it as well.

[grumpin]

Thanks, Jim. It helps to have someone think through this with me.

And to your question about a race moving or some such, I think the issue is that I followed the FSM and just backed off the nut by 90 degrees. In fact, I'm quite sure that's the case since when I tried to torque that nut to 16 lb-in I discovered that my 1/4" drive Computorque torque wrench only goes down to 24. And since I didn't already know that I must not have torqued the nuts to 16 last time.

So I dug out my itty bitty beam style torque wrench that has increments of 5 lb-in and torqued it to ~16. But the lockwasher holes didn't line up with the pin, so I did what the FSM said and turned it a teeny bit more to line the pin up with next hole. And, oddly enough, that appears to be about 24 lb-in.

Then I pulled out the dial test indicator and checked end play. The increments on it are .0005" and I could just get the needle to wiggle, so I might have .0001". That fits in the .000 to .004" range in the specs, so I'm happy.

So then I tried testing the rotational torque, which is supposed to be less than 20 lb-in. And here's my setup. The hub rotates when I get to 5 lb-in, so I'm thinking that it means it takes 12.5/9.25 x 5 = 7 lb-in. Right? Did I do the physics/math right? (I have a very old degree in both, but...)

So tomorrow I'll pull the driver's side down and measure the end play there. If it is more than .004" I'll adjust it as well.

I adjusted my Bronco per the FSM. Same instructions. And it was loose to me.

Went to how I’ve always done it, kinda like Jim was saying.

I go tight while spinning the wheel, back it off, then snug while spinning the wheel, then to the next castellation for the cotter pin or bolt.

[Gary Lewis]

I adjusted my Bronco per the FSM. Same instructions. And it was loose to me.Went to how I’ve always done it, kinda like Jim was saying.I go tight while spinning the wheel, back it off, then snug while spinning the wheel, then to the next castellation for the cotter pin or bolt.

Yep, what you guys are describing is how Dad taught me to do it. But when you have a factory shop manual...

 

Anyway, I got everything back together on the passenger's side and locked the hub in to ensure it worked and found the noise below. I think it sounds like a dry seal so I sprayed some lube on it and will see what happens tomorrow after it has had a chance to work its way in.

 

But if anyone has suggestions...

 

[Nothing Special]

Yep, what you guys are describing is how Dad taught me to do it. But when you have a factory shop manual...

 

Anyway, I got everything back together on the passenger's side and locked the hub in to ensure it worked and found the noise below. I think it sounds like a dry seal so I sprayed some lube on it and will see what happens tomorrow after it has had a chance to work its way in.

 

But if anyone has suggestions...

 

I don't know, I guess I'm the odd man out here, but I've always followed the manual and haven't had any trouble. After torquing it to whatever the spec is before backing it off, it hasn't seemed to be too loose when I did back it off.Not saying you shouldn't do it differently, but that has worked for me.

[Bruce moose4x4]

I don't know, I guess I'm the odd man out here, but I've always followed the manual and haven't had any trouble. After torquing it to whatever the spec is before backing it off, it hasn't seemed to be too loose when I did back it off.

Not saying you shouldn't do it differently, but that has worked for me.

Gary if this is the lock washer your talking about that you had to move the nut to 24 in lbs.

You can flip this washer over and it moves the hole for the pin exactly 1/2 distance. Once I found this out several years ago I hardly ever have to move the nut with the pin anymore after the final torque.

[Gary Lewis]

Gary if this is the lock washer your talking about that you had to move the nut to 24 in lbs.

You can flip this washer over and it moves the hole for the pin exactly 1/2 distance. Once I found this out several years ago I hardly ever have to move the nut with the pin anymore after the final torque.

Bruce - Thanks. That is the lock washer and I was aware that turning it over moves the holes, but at ~16 lb-in the pin was ALMOST in one hole on one side and way off on the other. The FSM says to go to the next hole if that happens. So I put the torque wrench back on and moved the nut as little as I could while watching the scale and it looked like it moved to just above 20 lb-in. Sure enough, the lock washer fit perfectly and the end play and rotational torque are within specs.

Bob - Dad always taught me to set the bearings by tightening down to where I could just rotate the hub, back off until things are free, tighten down finger tight for pre-load, and then put the cotter key in. That's essentially what the FSM says to do for the auto-locking hubs, but gives specs of 50 lb-ft to set the bearings, 90 degrees to back off to free up, and 16 lb-in for the pre-load. So it makes sense that you'd do the same for the manual-locking hubs. Right?

Wrong! I've done more looking at it today and I think I see what the difference is. In the illustration on the right for the manual-locking hubs you can see these parts: 11, the inner lock nut; 12 - the lock washer; and 13 - the outer lock nut. Now look at the auto-locking up setup. There's 20, the wheel retainer nut, and 10, the wheel retainer key.

So my new theory is that on the manual-locking hubs the torquing of the outer lock nut to 160 - 205 lb-ft pushes the inner lock nut in enough to provide the preload. But on the auto-locking hubs there's no inner lock nut, just the wheel retainer key, so you have to pre-load the wheel retainer nut by 16 lb-in. And going back to what Dad and I were working on, there was no outer lock nut on it either, just a cotter key to prevent the inner nut from moving.

Does that make sense?

I'm pretty sure the FSM is right because it says the same thing in three different places, so it can't be just a minor omission.

As for what that means for me, I think I'm happy with what I did, meaning preloading the inner lock nut instead of just backing off 90 degrees. And part of that is because I only got the inner lock nut to 160 lb-ft since I have to hold that huge socket's pins into the nut at the same time as torquing. And the rest of that is because I got the right end play and rotational torque readings. The end play was on the tight end of the scale but the rotational torque was well within the limits - assuming I measured that correctly. (No one corrected me, but...)

[Gary Lewis]

Bruce - Thanks. That is the lock washer and I was aware that turning it over moves the holes, but at ~16 lb-in the pin was ALMOST in one hole on one side and way off on the other. The FSM says to go to the next hole if that happens. So I put the torque wrench back on and moved the nut as little as I could while watching the scale and it looked like it moved to just above 20 lb-in. Sure enough, the lock washer fit perfectly and the end play and rotational torque are within specs.

Bob - Dad always taught me to set the bearings by tightening down to where I could just rotate the hub, back off until things are free, tighten down finger tight for pre-load, and then put the cotter key in. That's essentially what the FSM says to do for the auto-locking hubs, but gives specs of 50 lb-ft to set the bearings, 90 degrees to back off to free up, and 16 lb-in for the pre-load. So it makes sense that you'd do the same for the manual-locking hubs. Right?

Wrong! I've done more looking at it today and I think I see what the difference is. In the illustration on the right for the manual-locking hubs you can see these parts: 11, the inner lock nut; 12 - the lock washer; and 13 - the outer lock nut. Now look at the auto-locking up setup. There's 20, the wheel retainer nut, and 10, the wheel retainer key.

So my new theory is that on the manual-locking hubs the torquing of the outer lock nut to 160 - 205 lb-ft pushes the inner lock nut in enough to provide the preload. But on the auto-locking hubs there's no inner lock nut, just the wheel retainer key, so you have to pre-load the wheel retainer nut by 16 lb-in. And going back to what Dad and I were working on, there was no outer lock nut on it either, just a cotter key to prevent the inner nut from moving.

Does that make sense?

I'm pretty sure the FSM is right because it says the same thing in three different places, so it can't be just a minor omission.

As for what that means for me, I think I'm happy with what I did, meaning preloading the inner lock nut instead of just backing off 90 degrees. And part of that is because I only got the inner lock nut to 160 lb-ft since I have to hold that huge socket's pins into the nut at the same time as torquing. And the rest of that is because I got the right end play and rotational torque readings. The end play was on the tight end of the scale but the rotational torque was well within the limits - assuming I measured that correctly. (No one corrected me, but...)

Took the truck for a spin today in order to fill it up and to go to the store. That gave me a chance to observe the "chuckle" in the front end, and I think it is different. It now sounds like most of it is on the left front where before it was all over the front, so I think I next need to check the LF wheel bearings for looseness. And, I need to check out that squeal on the right front as it was still there before the trip.

But the fill up went perfectly. I put the nozzle in the slow notch at the same pump where I overfilled it last time, on the slow notch, and let it go. It took 19.136 gallons, and for 248.97 miles that gives 13.01 MPG! And there is no leak, in spite of it being FULL.

Last, I got to test the Cerakote on the steering wheel. It feels like a new wheel. The Cerakote is hard and there is NO stickiness. None.