Issues With Big Blue!?!?!

[Gary Lewis]

But, shouldn't I replace the ball joints, u-joints, and tie rod ends while it is out? We've just now topped $3K. Plus, does the Ox need professional installation?

Also, is there any significant advantage to doing the locker while the axle is out of the truck? Or might that be done later?

Yes, most of those parts will probably need replacement and it's better to replace them now than later.

Doing the locker with the axle out means that if you have to take it to a shop for professional installation, you're only taking an axle housing, and not an entire truck. Which would you rather do?

Ahhh! Here I was thinking the D60 is a pumpkin, but then I remember that the Ox comes with a new cover. So, it isn't a pumpkin. Good point.

[Nothing Special]

.... Then the question becomes what, if anything, to do about a locker. I've re-read what was said earlier in this thread about front lockers, and the only thing I'd want to do is a selectable unit, like the Ox. And that's another $1300 w/o shipping but including electric shift and an installation kit.

.... Plus, does the Ox need professional installation?

Does the OX need professional installation? For most people I'd answer this "If you need to ask, then you probably shouldn't do it yourself". But Gary, you aren't most people. You just need to ask. I get that!

But seriously, it's not a job for the faint-of-heart, or the impatient. I installed an OX in the front Dana 44 of my Bronco last year. Here's a link to my project thread on another forum (the OX install starts at post #96). As I understand the Dana 60 goes about the same as a 44, except that the parts are bigger and heavier.

"They say" you need a case spreader to pull the case open so the diff will drop in and out. If you have a diff spreader (and they can be made pretty easily if you're of a mind to) I'd certainly use it. But you can pry the diff out and tap it in with a mallet too. You need some slightly specialized tools (a magnetic base dial indicator and a torque wrench that reads in lb-in), as well as a way for the lb-in torque wrench to turn the pinion. And you need gear marking compound (I guess "Prussian Blue" used to be the go-to, but all I've ever seen in pictures is the yellow grease I used, which was hard to find). You need a way to press the bearings on (a hydraulic press makes it much easier). And while "they say" that set-up bearings make it possible to do without pulling and reinstalling bearings, I found that not to be true, so a bearing puller is probably needed.

Nothing about installing a diff is rocket science, but it is putzy work, trying to get the shims in the right places to get everything right. Check out my thread (linked above) to see what I went through. And I wasn't changing the gearing, so I just left the pinion gear where it was. If you are changing gears when you install the diff you'll need to get the pinion depth adjusted too. That will be more of the same as getting the carrier shims correct.

So should you do it yourself? Gary, for you I would NOT suggest that if the goal is to save money. Yes, doing it yourself will save money, but I think you are well enough off that you won't value the several hundred bucks enough to be worth the hassle. On the other hand, if you just want to do it because you like working on your truck, then go for it. I'm sure you are up to it, as long as you are committed to it.

.... Also, is there any significant advantage to doing the locker while the axle is out of the truck? Or might that be done later?

If you are doing it yourself, definitely do it out of the vehicle. It will be a lot easier to get in a comfortable position to work on it. If you are taking it in, as Shaun said, it's mostly a matter of whether you want to take the truck or just the axle to the shop. The cost likely won't be significantly different either way.

.... I really need to understand what I'm getting into before pulling the trigger, so would appreciate y'all thinking this through with me. And, as a reminder, I'm outfitting BB to be a competent overlander so I can take Janey wheeling in CO and then take my son on some more strenuous trips. But I don't think we'll ever take seriously challenging courses.

I'll take this question to mean "Should I install a front locker for my use?" I'd answer that yes, you should, but you don't really need to. I've done almost all of my fourwheeling with a rear automatic locker and an open front, and that works out pretty well (your rear TrueTrac won't be quite as effective, but will still do pretty well paired with an open front). But after putting the OX in the front of my Bronco I've learned first-hand how beneficial it really is. When you stick a front tire against a rock that will test your articulation (probably more of an issue with my Bronco that your F-250 if you can believe that), the front locker lets the tire just walk over rather than needing to get the right combination of line and momentum with the open diff (and with a TrueTracs a rear locker that difference would be a little more important).

You have a winch, which will almost always be a good tool to get you past a spot where you might need a front locker. With an open front you'll probably be able to go anywhere you want to / should go. But if you have the locker you won't need to "pull rope" as often and it'll be easier.

[ArdWrknTrk]

.... Then the question becomes what, if anything, to do about a locker. I've re-read what was said earlier in this thread about front lockers, and the only thing I'd want to do is a selectable unit, like the Ox. And that's another $1300 w/o shipping but including electric shift and an installation kit.

.... Plus, does the Ox need professional installation?

Does the OX need professional installation? For most people I'd answer this "If you need to ask, then you probably shouldn't do it yourself". But Gary, you aren't most people. You just need to ask. I get that!

But seriously, it's not a job for the faint-of-heart, or the impatient. I installed an OX in the front Dana 44 of my Bronco last year. Here's a link to my project thread on another forum (the OX install starts at post #96). As I understand the Dana 60 goes about the same as a 44, except that the parts are bigger and heavier.

"They say" you need a case spreader to pull the case open so the diff will drop in and out. If you have a diff spreader (and they can be made pretty easily if you're of a mind to) I'd certainly use it. But you can pry the diff out and tap it in with a mallet too. You need some slightly specialized tools (a magnetic base dial indicator and a torque wrench that reads in lb-in), as well as a way for the lb-in torque wrench to turn the pinion. And you need gear marking compound (I guess "Prussian Blue" used to be the go-to, but all I've ever seen in pictures is the yellow grease I used, which was hard to find). You need a way to press the bearings on (a hydraulic press makes it much easier). And while "they say" that set-up bearings make it possible to do without pulling and reinstalling bearings, I found that not to be true, so a bearing puller is probably needed.

Nothing about installing a diff is rocket science, but it is putzy work, trying to get the shims in the right places to get everything right. Check out my thread (linked above) to see what I went through. And I wasn't changing the gearing, so I just left the pinion gear where it was. If you are changing gears when you install the diff you'll need to get the pinion depth adjusted too. That will be more of the same as getting the carrier shims correct.

So should you do it yourself? Gary, for you I would NOT suggest that if the goal is to save money. Yes, doing it yourself will save money, but I think you are well enough off that you won't value the several hundred bucks enough to be worth the hassle. On the other hand, if you just want to do it because you like working on your truck, then go for it. I'm sure you are up to it, as long as you are committed to it.

.... Also, is there any significant advantage to doing the locker while the axle is out of the truck? Or might that be done later?

If you are doing it yourself, definitely do it out of the vehicle. It will be a lot easier to get in a comfortable position to work on it. If you are taking it in, as Shaun said, it's mostly a matter of whether you want to take the truck or just the axle to the shop. The cost likely won't be significantly different either way.

.... I really need to understand what I'm getting into before pulling the trigger, so would appreciate y'all thinking this through with me. And, as a reminder, I'm outfitting BB to be a competent overlander so I can take Janey wheeling in CO and then take my son on some more strenuous trips. But I don't think we'll ever take seriously challenging courses.

I'll take this question to mean "Should I install a front locker for my use?" I'd answer that yes, you should, but you don't really need to. I've done almost all of my fourwheeling with a rear automatic locker and an open front, and that works out pretty well (your rear TrueTrac won't be quite as effective, but will still do pretty well paired with an open front). But after putting the OX in the front of my Bronco I've learned first-hand how beneficial it really is. When you stick a front tire against a rock that will test your articulation (probably more of an issue with my Bronco that your F-250 if you can believe that), the front locker lets the tire just walk over rather than needing to get the right combination of line and momentum with the open diff (and with a TrueTracs a rear locker that difference would be a little more important).

You have a winch, which will almost always be a good tool to get you past a spot where you might need a front locker. With an open front you'll probably be able to go anywhere you want to / should go. But if you have the locker you won't need to "pull rope" as often and it'll be easier.

The 'yellow paste' is used by machinists and machine rebuilders to mark ways and surfaces for scraping.

Those iridecent looking planes create space for lubrication while keeping incredibly tight tolerances.

I've only used zinc oxide.

The white paste you used to see on the lifeguard's nose.

It works for me and is available everywhere for cheap.

[Gary Lewis]

.... Then the question becomes what, if anything, to do about a locker. I've re-read what was said earlier in this thread about front lockers, and the only thing I'd want to do is a selectable unit, like the Ox. And that's another $1300 w/o shipping but including electric shift and an installation kit.

.... Plus, does the Ox need professional installation?

Does the OX need professional installation? For most people I'd answer this "If you need to ask, then you probably shouldn't do it yourself". But Gary, you aren't most people. You just need to ask. I get that!

But seriously, it's not a job for the faint-of-heart, or the impatient. I installed an OX in the front Dana 44 of my Bronco last year. Here's a link to my project thread on another forum (the OX install starts at post #96). As I understand the Dana 60 goes about the same as a 44, except that the parts are bigger and heavier.

"They say" you need a case spreader to pull the case open so the diff will drop in and out. If you have a diff spreader (and they can be made pretty easily if you're of a mind to) I'd certainly use it. But you can pry the diff out and tap it in with a mallet too. You need some slightly specialized tools (a magnetic base dial indicator and a torque wrench that reads in lb-in), as well as a way for the lb-in torque wrench to turn the pinion. And you need gear marking compound (I guess "Prussian Blue" used to be the go-to, but all I've ever seen in pictures is the yellow grease I used, which was hard to find). You need a way to press the bearings on (a hydraulic press makes it much easier). And while "they say" that set-up bearings make it possible to do without pulling and reinstalling bearings, I found that not to be true, so a bearing puller is probably needed.

Nothing about installing a diff is rocket science, but it is putzy work, trying to get the shims in the right places to get everything right. Check out my thread (linked above) to see what I went through. And I wasn't changing the gearing, so I just left the pinion gear where it was. If you are changing gears when you install the diff you'll need to get the pinion depth adjusted too. That will be more of the same as getting the carrier shims correct.

So should you do it yourself? Gary, for you I would NOT suggest that if the goal is to save money. Yes, doing it yourself will save money, but I think you are well enough off that you won't value the several hundred bucks enough to be worth the hassle. On the other hand, if you just want to do it because you like working on your truck, then go for it. I'm sure you are up to it, as long as you are committed to it.

.... Also, is there any significant advantage to doing the locker while the axle is out of the truck? Or might that be done later?

If you are doing it yourself, definitely do it out of the vehicle. It will be a lot easier to get in a comfortable position to work on it. If you are taking it in, as Shaun said, it's mostly a matter of whether you want to take the truck or just the axle to the shop. The cost likely won't be significantly different either way.

.... I really need to understand what I'm getting into before pulling the trigger, so would appreciate y'all thinking this through with me. And, as a reminder, I'm outfitting BB to be a competent overlander so I can take Janey wheeling in CO and then take my son on some more strenuous trips. But I don't think we'll ever take seriously challenging courses.

I'll take this question to mean "Should I install a front locker for my use?" I'd answer that yes, you should, but you don't really need to. I've done almost all of my fourwheeling with a rear automatic locker and an open front, and that works out pretty well (your rear TrueTrac won't be quite as effective, but will still do pretty well paired with an open front). But after putting the OX in the front of my Bronco I've learned first-hand how beneficial it really is. When you stick a front tire against a rock that will test your articulation (probably more of an issue with my Bronco that your F-250 if you can believe that), the front locker lets the tire just walk over rather than needing to get the right combination of line and momentum with the open diff (and with a TrueTracs a rear locker that difference would be a little more important).

You have a winch, which will almost always be a good tool to get you past a spot where you might need a front locker. With an open front you'll probably be able to go anywhere you want to / should go. But if you have the locker you won't need to "pull rope" as often and it'll be easier.

Jim - I think I have a tube of the yellow stuff I bought decades ago when I was going to set up a diff on a VW kombi, which didn't happen.

Bob - I have all the tools but the case spreader, and even a 4-jaw chuck, which I have never used but know how to do from my class a few years ago. But, having read through your post on FTE, I agree that's something I'd rather not do as it is too time consuming.

So the game plan for tomorrow is to call the outfit in OKC and get pricing on all of the bits previously discussed, inc both the F350 and SD springs. And, call the local salvage back and see if they have the SD springs. Plus call the salvage that has the DRW axle and see which of their advert's is right - 3.54 or 4.10, although it is pretty sure to be 4.10.

Then, assuming the storms hold off, we are headed into Tulsa and I'm going to stop by 4WD Parts and talk with them to see what they carry, what their price would be to install, etc. (There may be less expensive places in town, but their prices on parts and labor should give me a good idea of what the prices will be.)

And all that info will let me put together the all-up cost and help me make a decision.

However, I'll ask again: Is it not possible to put a set of, say, SD springs on the TTB's I have and gain some decent articulation & ride but save $2k? It would seem that an RSK and the longer springs would not only put some distance between the spring and bump stop, but also let the tire move to the rear and be much more supple.

Or, said another way, is the D60/SD springs/Sky kit worth the $2k to get the ride, articulation, etc?

 

[85lebaront2]

.... Then the question becomes what, if anything, to do about a locker. I've re-read what was said earlier in this thread about front lockers, and the only thing I'd want to do is a selectable unit, like the Ox. And that's another $1300 w/o shipping but including electric shift and an installation kit.

.... Plus, does the Ox need professional installation?

Does the OX need professional installation? For most people I'd answer this "If you need to ask, then you probably shouldn't do it yourself". But Gary, you aren't most people. You just need to ask. I get that!

But seriously, it's not a job for the faint-of-heart, or the impatient. I installed an OX in the front Dana 44 of my Bronco last year. Here's a link to my project thread on another forum (the OX install starts at post #96). As I understand the Dana 60 goes about the same as a 44, except that the parts are bigger and heavier.

"They say" you need a case spreader to pull the case open so the diff will drop in and out. If you have a diff spreader (and they can be made pretty easily if you're of a mind to) I'd certainly use it. But you can pry the diff out and tap it in with a mallet too. You need some slightly specialized tools (a magnetic base dial indicator and a torque wrench that reads in lb-in), as well as a way for the lb-in torque wrench to turn the pinion. And you need gear marking compound (I guess "Prussian Blue" used to be the go-to, but all I've ever seen in pictures is the yellow grease I used, which was hard to find). You need a way to press the bearings on (a hydraulic press makes it much easier). And while "they say" that set-up bearings make it possible to do without pulling and reinstalling bearings, I found that not to be true, so a bearing puller is probably needed.

Nothing about installing a diff is rocket science, but it is putzy work, trying to get the shims in the right places to get everything right. Check out my thread (linked above) to see what I went through. And I wasn't changing the gearing, so I just left the pinion gear where it was. If you are changing gears when you install the diff you'll need to get the pinion depth adjusted too. That will be more of the same as getting the carrier shims correct.

So should you do it yourself? Gary, for you I would NOT suggest that if the goal is to save money. Yes, doing it yourself will save money, but I think you are well enough off that you won't value the several hundred bucks enough to be worth the hassle. On the other hand, if you just want to do it because you like working on your truck, then go for it. I'm sure you are up to it, as long as you are committed to it.

.... Also, is there any significant advantage to doing the locker while the axle is out of the truck? Or might that be done later?

If you are doing it yourself, definitely do it out of the vehicle. It will be a lot easier to get in a comfortable position to work on it. If you are taking it in, as Shaun said, it's mostly a matter of whether you want to take the truck or just the axle to the shop. The cost likely won't be significantly different either way.

.... I really need to understand what I'm getting into before pulling the trigger, so would appreciate y'all thinking this through with me. And, as a reminder, I'm outfitting BB to be a competent overlander so I can take Janey wheeling in CO and then take my son on some more strenuous trips. But I don't think we'll ever take seriously challenging courses.

I'll take this question to mean "Should I install a front locker for my use?" I'd answer that yes, you should, but you don't really need to. I've done almost all of my fourwheeling with a rear automatic locker and an open front, and that works out pretty well (your rear TrueTrac won't be quite as effective, but will still do pretty well paired with an open front). But after putting the OX in the front of my Bronco I've learned first-hand how beneficial it really is. When you stick a front tire against a rock that will test your articulation (probably more of an issue with my Bronco that your F-250 if you can believe that), the front locker lets the tire just walk over rather than needing to get the right combination of line and momentum with the open diff (and with a TrueTracs a rear locker that difference would be a little more important).

You have a winch, which will almost always be a good tool to get you past a spot where you might need a front locker. With an open front you'll probably be able to go anywhere you want to / should go. But if you have the locker you won't need to "pull rope" as often and it'll be easier.

Gary, when I was redoing Darth, one of the problems was a spun inner rear wheel bearing on the left side. I had hand filed the tube and fitted a new bearing, but I knew it wasn't right (generally had to put a seal in and wash the brake shoes yearly for inspection). I bought a used dually rear that had a 4.10 gear in it, but I had a Traction Loc 3.55 from and F250 (parts truck). I used the 3.55 Traction Loc gears in the housing that had the 4.10 set (small loss, they had water damage from sitting).

I bought an install kit for the Sterling 10.25" and with help from an attractive 14 year old assistant ("granddaughter") I transferred the innards. I used a friend's press to change the pinion bearings since I didn't want to mix and match them and salvaging the cups would be risky. If I remember the pinion shims are between the pinion and inner bearing cone. I used the same thickness shim and new bearings.

On the side bearings, since they appeared virtually undamaged, I reused them, keeping the sets together. The shim kit had multiple thickness shims for the preload, I did a setup for preload with no pinion so I could keep the combined thickness at the needed thickness for the preload.

I assembled the pinion and crush sleeve to the proper preload with no seal. I then put the differential in with the previously determined shim packs. I used Prussian Blue (high spot) and rolled a pattern, I must have been living right as the drive side was centered on both the pinion and ring gears, coast was a little low, but in tolerance according to the patterns in the manual.

Once I had that, I removed the yoke and installed the seal, my turning torque was right where it should be with reused side bearings.

Since the old rear was still under the frame, I used the rear of the frame as a workstand., put it at just the right height and wasn't going to be damaged by the weight (I used my cherry picker to lift it up there).

[Nothing Special]

.... However, I'll ask again: Is it not possible to put a set of, say, SD springs on the TTB's I have and gain some decent articulation & ride but save $2k? It would seem that an RSK and the longer springs would not only put some distance between the spring and bump stop, but also let the tire move to the rear and be much more supple.

Or, said another way, is the D60/SD springs/Sky kit worth the $2k to get the ride, articulation, etc?

I've only ever heard one person say that the F-250s TTB can be made into a good riding suspension. I don't say that to discourage you, but if you want good info on how to make Big Blue ride well, that one person might be the one to talk to. (For what it's worth, as I've said here before, I really don't think my '97 F-250 rides that bad. But I wouldn't be one to argue that it has a particularly good ride.)

Anyway, I think the guy I'm thinking of goes by the screen name '89F2urd on FTE. I'f I'm remembering the correct person, he's argued several times that a lifted F-250, still on leaf springs, can have a good ride if done well. You might want to see if you can find out what he has to say about it.

edit to add: I did a quick search on FTE for posts with TTB in them by '89F2urd. That's definitely the guy I was thinking of. All I found in my quick scan was that he does not recommend a shackle reversal with TTB, and that he recommends about a 2" - 3" lift. That certainly isn't enough info to answer your questions, but it's a start.

 

[Gary Lewis]

.... However, I'll ask again: Is it not possible to put a set of, say, SD springs on the TTB's I have and gain some decent articulation & ride but save $2k? It would seem that an RSK and the longer springs would not only put some distance between the spring and bump stop, but also let the tire move to the rear and be much more supple.

Or, said another way, is the D60/SD springs/Sky kit worth the $2k to get the ride, articulation, etc?

I've only ever heard one person say that the F-250s TTB can be made into a good riding suspension. I don't say that to discourage you, but if you want good info on how to make Big Blue ride well, that one person might be the one to talk to. (For what it's worth, as I've said here before, I really don't think my '97 F-250 rides that bad. But I wouldn't be one to argue that it has a particularly good ride.)

Anyway, I think the guy I'm thinking of goes by the screen name '89F2urd on FTE. I'f I'm remembering the correct person, he's argued several times that a lifted F-250, still on leaf springs, can have a good ride if done well. You might want to see if you can find out what he has to say about it.

edit to add: I did a quick search on FTE for posts with TTB in them by '89F2urd. That's definitely the guy I was thinking of. All I found in my quick scan was that he does not recommend a shackle reversal with TTB, and that he recommends about a 2" - 3" lift. That certainly isn't enough info to answer your questions, but it's a start.

Bill - That's the sort of thing I do not want to get into. With the EFI and everything else I have planned, I don't want to take the time to work on a differential myself. Saying it another way, I can hire that done, but I probably can't hire the EFI system done.

Bob - I've PM'd the guy on FTE, and will do some searching for all he's posted re TTB's. Thanks.

Also, you went with an air-powered Ox. Did they not have the electric shift available then? If so, why not use it?

As said, I hope to use an F600's radio bezel with room for several switches and readouts above them, so it seems reasonable to go with an electric one.

[ArdWrknTrk]

.... However, I'll ask again: Is it not possible to put a set of, say, SD springs on the TTB's I have and gain some decent articulation & ride but save $2k? It would seem that an RSK and the longer springs would not only put some distance between the spring and bump stop, but also let the tire move to the rear and be much more supple.

Or, said another way, is the D60/SD springs/Sky kit worth the $2k to get the ride, articulation, etc?

I've only ever heard one person say that the F-250s TTB can be made into a good riding suspension. I don't say that to discourage you, but if you want good info on how to make Big Blue ride well, that one person might be the one to talk to. (For what it's worth, as I've said here before, I really don't think my '97 F-250 rides that bad. But I wouldn't be one to argue that it has a particularly good ride.)

Anyway, I think the guy I'm thinking of goes by the screen name '89F2urd on FTE. I'f I'm remembering the correct person, he's argued several times that a lifted F-250, still on leaf springs, can have a good ride if done well. You might want to see if you can find out what he has to say about it.

edit to add: I did a quick search on FTE for posts with TTB in them by '89F2urd. That's definitely the guy I was thinking of. All I found in my quick scan was that he does not recommend a shackle reversal with TTB, and that he recommends about a 2" - 3" lift. That certainly isn't enough info to answer your questions, but it's a start.

In looking at the Tuff Country drop pivots needed for a 250 RSK I noticed that the 1997 250's are unique enough that they have their own part number.

Maybe that explains some of the better ride you have?

Gary,

Again I'm going to say that while a 250 RSK might get the axle off the bump stops and put the spring motion in the right direction you're still not eliminating the pivot bushing degradation, troublesome need to pull the front end apart to install different caster/camber bushings, and you still are going to need a drop pitman arm in addition to those TC drop pivots which are around $160.

Yes, scope creep has exponentially increased the cost.

My initial suggestion was to buy a wrecked F-350 4x4 for $5-600 and have ALL the parts for Big Blue except the RSK itself.

Then scrap the 350 hulk and the 250 front end for $350 or whatever the going rate.

I have time but no $ and realize that your dynamic is quite different.

I also realize that maybe you've had enough of dad's truck for now and want to shift gears and work on Big Blue.

You could still buy the $50 cross member and set about wiring up the 460 while looking for a dead 350.

You could still get the SD springs and weld in the RSK and do the LoPro mounts.

In the end you could still use the TTB if you don't find a 3.54 D60 and front driveshaft.

But that's up to you

 

[ArdWrknTrk]

Jim - I think I have a tube of the yellow stuff I bought decades ago when I was going to set up a diff on a VW kombi, which didn't happen.

Bob - I have all the tools but the case spreader, and even a 4-jaw chuck, which I have never used but know how to do from my class a few years ago. But, having read through your post on FTE, I agree that's something I'd rather not do as it is too time consuming.

So the game plan for tomorrow is to call the outfit in OKC and get pricing on all of the bits previously discussed, inc both the F350 and SD springs. And, call the local salvage back and see if they have the SD springs. Plus call the salvage that has the DRW axle and see which of their advert's is right - 3.54 or 4.10, although it is pretty sure to be 4.10.

Then, assuming the storms hold off, we are headed into Tulsa and I'm going to stop by 4WD Parts and talk with them to see what they carry, what their price would be to install, etc. (There may be less expensive places in town, but their prices on parts and labor should give me a good idea of what the prices will be.)

And all that info will let me put together the all-up cost and help me make a decision.

However, I'll ask again: Is it not possible to put a set of, say, SD springs on the TTB's I have and gain some decent articulation & ride but save $2k? It would seem that an RSK and the longer springs would not only put some distance between the spring and bump stop, but also let the tire move to the rear and be much more supple.

Or, said another way, is the D60/SD springs/Sky kit worth the $2k to get the ride, articulation, etc?

And this is what happens when I get distracted while in a reply window.

I still don't see $2k in a D60 and double cardan shaft if you intend to do everything else.

Jim - I think I have a tube of the yellow stuff I bought decades ago when I was going to set up a diff on a VW kombi, which didn't happen.

Just a suggestion to look to Travers Tool or Enco if you needed the marking paste, and an alternative.

[Gary Lewis]

And this is what happens when I get distracted while in a reply window.

I still don't see $2k in a D60 and double cardan shaft if you intend to do everything else.

Jim - I think I have a tube of the yellow stuff I bought decades ago when I was going to set up a diff on a VW kombi, which didn't happen.

Just a suggestion to look to Travers Tool or Enco if you needed the marking paste, and an alternative.

Jim - The $2k that would be saved by using SuperDuty springs on my TTB's includes $800 for the D60 and $1200 for the Ox locker.

Gary,

Again I'm going to say that while a 250 RSK might get the axle off the bump stops and put the spring motion in the right direction you're still not eliminating the pivot bushing degradation, troublesome need to pull the front end apart to install different caster/camber bushings, and you still are going to need a drop pitman arm in addition to those TC drop pivots which are around $160.

Yes, scope creep has exponentially increased the cost.

My initial suggestion was to buy a wrecked F-350 4x4 for $5-600 and have ALL the parts for Big Blue except the RSK itself.

Then scrap the 350 hulk and the 250 front end for $350 or whatever the going rate.

I have time but no $ and realize that your dynamic is quite different.

I also realize that maybe you've had enough of dad's truck for now and want to shift gears and work on Big Blue.

You could still buy the $50 cross member and set about wiring up the 460 while looking for a dead 350.

You could still get the SD springs and weld in the RSK and do the LoPro mounts.

In the end you could still use the TTB if you don't find a 3.54 D60 and front driveshaft.

But that's up to you

You make a good point. I could replace the cross member, rebuild the engine, and even install it and wire it up if that won't cause problems with installing a different front axle. Meanwhile looking for an F350 for the axle, suspension, and for that matter t-case. (I think I have the right front driveshaft from the F350 that the ZF5 came from.)

I've not made any decisions about the front axle, and really don't need to make any for quite some time as there's plenty of work to be done. But I'm just trying to work through the options and the costs thereof.

So, perhaps waiting to see what comes from the searches I've kicked off would be the best approach. Perhaps they'll turn up the F350 and I'll have everything needed. However, even then I'll need to decide on the RSK, which is $450, and the locker, which is $1200.

Again, thanks for the help thinking through this.