It is time to talk hydraulic clutch systems.

[ArdWrknTrk]

Bumping this up.

I lucked out on a local gig, they had me use their truck for a month or two, so mine ended up on the back burner. Unfortunately I seem to have run them out of work for now, so I want to get my truck back up and going for another Oregon adventure.

I never did get the hydraulics to operate properly, I have tried every bleeding procedure I could find, but I am going to go through and order the smaller bore slave cylinder.

My clutch fork breaking seems to be a deal breaker, it is a 83-86 6.9 and 85-86 460 "over 8500gvwr" t-19 only part apparently. I have been unable to source one, made a post on the wanted section.

If I can't get one, I can pull a bellhousing from a t-18 and run the setup like big brother has pictured, I just don't want to spend $250 on a bellhousing or spend a full day on my back at a u-pull it yard and run a different setup over a discontinued clutch fork.

So if anyone has a t-19 clutch fork laying around, please let me know.

I replied to your WTB.

This is not impossible, I use a 351 slave w/ bleeder to pump a loop to the MC reservoir.

It fits right on.

But DO NOT waste your time with a T-18.

If you're going to swap Gearboxes go with a Zf-5 S42/7

 

[Haystack]

I replied to your WTB.

This is not impossible, I use a 351 slave w/ bleeder to pump a loop to the MC reservoir.

It fits right on.

But DO NOT waste your time with a T-18.

If you're going to swap Gearboxes go with a Zf-5 S42/7

I pretty much have to keep the current t-19. Because the bucket part of the truck is powered by the PTO, the PTO gear can be modified, but from what I can tell, is not only specific to the 1st gear ratio, but likely to be different if I swap the transmission (such as the zfs trans, although I would love to have an OD gear).

I can add either a purely electric hydraulic pump, or a belt driven solution (magnetic clutch belt drive hydraulic pump, like an ac pump uses), but both would cost around 1k to replace, and I don't want to spend $1,000 to replace something that isn't broken, over a clutch fork, that I can't use the truck without anyways. Going to the zfs trans might help some with gas mileage, but the old 6 bolt pto is old enough, they no longer carry or stock parts for them. If the gear mesh is different for the zfs transmission, I would either need a spacer/shims, or I would have to replace the gear all together with a custom machined replacement, which again would cost about $1k. So it would not only be a zfs swap, but likely another $1k on top of that to make the pto or hydraulics for the bucket to work after.

For whatever reason, the bellhousing changed from 83-84 to the same one as the diesel for the 85-86 460. Rock auto lists the same clutch fork for the 83-84 years, but I have purchased two, one uses the za-110 style clutch fork, or the newer zfs style trans like the za-124. (Searching 1985 f-350 with diesel or 460 always says za-126, and is slightly different) one was from a 1985 4wd 460 t-19, the other was from a 1987 zfs 460, and neither match the correct clutch fork.

Or at least that is the theory.

I am finding a 1985-1986 f-250/350's to be difficult to find, and every junkyard truck I have found with the 4spd so far has been 4wd.

I don't see why they would have to change the bellhousing for 4wd, but a sure sign of the t-19 over a t-18 seems to be the dual PTO cover of the t-19 as an easy identifier.

Both 1985 4wd 460's that I have found, have a t-18 style transmission case, and seem to use the same clutch fork as every other 83-86 f-250/f-350. (The za-110 style if searching for a SBF)

Every dual PTO case has a casting for the hydraulics to mount to, but every single PTO case has the bolt on solution like the sbf t-18. I will see if I can add a picture for reference.

[Haystack]

I pretty much have to keep the current t-19. Because the bucket part of the truck is powered by the PTO, the PTO gear can be modified, but from what I can tell, is not only specific to the 1st gear ratio, but likely to be different if I swap the transmission (such as the zfs trans, although I would love to have an OD gear).

I can add either a purely electric hydraulic pump, or a belt driven solution (magnetic clutch belt drive hydraulic pump, like an ac pump uses), but both would cost around 1k to replace, and I don't want to spend $1,000 to replace something that isn't broken, over a clutch fork, that I can't use the truck without anyways. Going to the zfs trans might help some with gas mileage, but the old 6 bolt pto is old enough, they no longer carry or stock parts for them. If the gear mesh is different for the zfs transmission, I would either need a spacer/shims, or I would have to replace the gear all together with a custom machined replacement, which again would cost about $1k. So it would not only be a zfs swap, but likely another $1k on top of that to make the pto or hydraulics for the bucket to work after.

For whatever reason, the bellhousing changed from 83-84 to the same one as the diesel for the 85-86 460. Rock auto lists the same clutch fork for the 83-84 years, but I have purchased two, one uses the za-110 style clutch fork, or the newer zfs style trans like the za-124. (Searching 1985 f-350 with diesel or 460 always says za-126, and is slightly different) one was from a 1985 4wd 460 t-19, the other was from a 1987 zfs 460, and neither match the correct clutch fork.

Or at least that is the theory.

I am finding a 1985-1986 f-250/350's to be difficult to find, and every junkyard truck I have found with the 4spd so far has been 4wd.

I don't see why they would have to change the bellhousing for 4wd, but a sure sign of the t-19 over a t-18 seems to be the dual PTO cover of the t-19 as an easy identifier.

Both 1985 4wd 460's that I have found, have a t-18 style transmission case, and seem to use the same clutch fork as every other 83-86 f-250/f-350. (The za-110 style if searching for a SBF)

Every dual PTO case has a casting for the hydraulics to mount to, but every single PTO case has the bolt on solution like the sbf t-18. I will see if I can add a picture for reference.

Basically, because of the cab and chassis stuff, this is a 12klb gvwr truck. I am guessing the t-19 and bellhousing for the 2wd diesel was just used for the 1985-1986 model years for the heavier duty 2wd dually setup?

I honestly don't know. But if I cannot get the clutch fork (by far the easiest fix) then I am going to run the bellhousing off the 4wd 460 at the junkyard instead.

[Ifitaintbroke]

The ZF-5 is a good swap and fairly easy, but there are a few things you should know.

You will need a new flywheel, as the ZF clutch will not bolt up.

You will need a different trans crossmember, as the ZF's mount is in a different place.

You will need a different floorpan, as the ZF is taller.

Slave was not an issue for me, but my truck is an 86.

[ArdWrknTrk]

I pretty much have to keep the current t-19. Because the bucket part of the truck is powered by the PTO, the PTO gear can be modified, but from what I can tell, is not only specific to the 1st gear ratio, but likely to be different if I swap the transmission (such as the zfs trans, although I would love to have an OD gear).

I can add either a purely electric hydraulic pump, or a belt driven solution (magnetic clutch belt drive hydraulic pump, like an ac pump uses), but both would cost around 1k to replace, and I don't want to spend $1,000 to replace something that isn't broken, over a clutch fork, that I can't use the truck without anyways. Going to the zfs trans might help some with gas mileage, but the old 6 bolt pto is old enough, they no longer carry or stock parts for them. If the gear mesh is different for the zfs transmission, I would either need a spacer/shims, or I would have to replace the gear all together with a custom machined replacement, which again would cost about $1k. So it would not only be a zfs swap, but likely another $1k on top of that to make the pto or hydraulics for the bucket to work after.

For whatever reason, the bellhousing changed from 83-84 to the same one as the diesel for the 85-86 460. Rock auto lists the same clutch fork for the 83-84 years, but I have purchased two, one uses the za-110 style clutch fork, or the newer zfs style trans like the za-124. (Searching 1985 f-350 with diesel or 460 always says za-126, and is slightly different) one was from a 1985 4wd 460 t-19, the other was from a 1987 zfs 460, and neither match the correct clutch fork.

Or at least that is the theory.

I am finding a 1985-1986 f-250/350's to be difficult to find, and every junkyard truck I have found with the 4spd so far has been 4wd.

I don't see why they would have to change the bellhousing for 4wd, but a sure sign of the t-19 over a t-18 seems to be the dual PTO cover of the t-19 as an easy identifier.

Both 1985 4wd 460's that I have found, have a t-18 style transmission case, and seem to use the same clutch fork as every other 83-86 f-250/f-350. (The za-110 style if searching for a SBF)

Every dual PTO case has a casting for the hydraulics to mount to, but every single PTO case has the bolt on solution like the sbf t-18. I will see if I can add a picture for reference.

PTO's are kinda universal.

Is yours Chelsea, Eaton, what???

The same bellhousing 2 or 4wd.

It's the gearbox tailshaft that differs.

I can look up the 1st gear ratios if you like, but there's absolutely no reason to change the gearbox if all you need is a throwout arm.

[Haystack]

PTO's are kinda universal.

Is yours Chelsea, Eaton, what???

The same bellhousing 2 or 4wd.

It's the gearbox tailshaft that differs.

I can look up the 1st gear ratios if you like, but there's absolutely no reason to change the gearbox if all you need is a throwout arm.

I know they are fairly universal, but the distance between the gears changes with gear ratios, meaning if a pto fits a 5:1 1st gear, it will not fit a 4:1 1st gear and will require a different to drive gear. Those are no longer available easily, I called a few places, and the cheapest quote I got for a PTO gear was around $1k.

It is a Chelsea.

Again, I do not want to swap to the zf trans, over a clutch fork. I just need the clutch fork. I have probably looked at over 1000 trucks, every junkyard in my area, and have been unable to find the right one.

I have purchased 4 different clutch forks, all of them from 85 460's, verified by VIN, and none of them have fit and are a different style.

[ArdWrknTrk]

I know they are fairly universal, but the distance between the gears changes with gear ratios, meaning if a pto fits a 5:1 1st gear, it will not fit a 4:1 1st gear and will require a different to drive gear. Those are no longer available easily, I called a few places, and the cheapest quote I got for a PTO gear was around $1k.

It is a Chelsea.

Again, I do not want to swap to the zf trans, over a clutch fork. I just need the clutch fork. I have probably looked at over 1000 trucks, every junkyard in my area, and have been unable to find the right one.

I have purchased 4 different clutch forks, all of them from 85 460's, verified by VIN, and none of them have fit and are a different style.

Then you need to ask yourself why YOUR 460/T-19 combo is wearing some unique freaking throw out arm, because every 460 from '83-'87 has a T-19 and uses one that's commonly available, if not new, (but I think Pioneer makes one)

[ArdWrknTrk]

Then you need to ask yourself why YOUR 460/T-19 combo is wearing some unique freaking throw out arm, because every 460 from '83-'87 has a T-19 and uses one that's commonly available, if not new, (but I think Pioneer makes one)

Maybe, just maybe your truck has the wrong one now, and that's why it doesn't work right?

What does the engineering number say?

[Haystack]

Maybe, just maybe your truck has the wrong one now, and that's why it doesn't work right?

What does the engineering number say?

I pulled two clutch forks off of two separate 4wd 460's. Both had a t-18 looking transmission (only passenger side PTO provision) and appear to be regular t-18 clutch forks.

The two I ordered online were listed as correct for the truck (ordered for an 85 460), but both were the newer zfs external clutch fork style used from 87 up.

If you can find me a diesel t-19 clutch fork, I would gladly buy it. Every diesel I found at the parts yards were either already gone or automatics, and every online listing I have found for then are out of stock (including rock auto). When researching part numbers (googling the part number) I found posts as old as 2006 from guys saying they were no longer available and best bet was used at a junkyard.

Like an idiot, when I got the first junkyard clutch fork that looked right, I threw away the broken clutch fork it has thinking it was the same, I should have looked closer.

I don't see why ford wouldn't use the same clutch fork in a 4wd 460, both both I found were wrong at looked like a t-18 trans. One truck was very minty looking, had low miles, good paint and a full interior.

I have not been able to find a single t-19 trans truck in the junkyard, or I would have just done that.

The t-18 style fork looks almost exactly the same, but the pivot ball mount is too far in, and hits the bellhousing when installing.

The t-19 clutch fork has nearly the same profile, but is clearance on the back side and has a slight forward curve while the t-18 style is basically flat with no bends.

If you can find me an online t-19 clutch fork that is in stock, let me know. I even emailed two different suppliers that showed out of stock, and they both said the part was discontinued and no longer in production.

[ArdWrknTrk]

I pulled two clutch forks off of two separate 4wd 460's. Both had a t-18 looking transmission (only passenger side PTO provision) and appear to be regular t-18 clutch forks.

The two I ordered online were listed as correct for the truck (ordered for an 85 460), but both were the newer zfs external clutch fork style used from 87 up.

If you can find me a diesel t-19 clutch fork, I would gladly buy it. Every diesel I found at the parts yards were either already gone or automatics, and every online listing I have found for then are out of stock (including rock auto). When researching part numbers (googling the part number) I found posts as old as 2006 from guys saying they were no longer available and best bet was used at a junkyard.

Like an idiot, when I got the first junkyard clutch fork that looked right, I threw away the broken clutch fork it has thinking it was the same, I should have looked closer.

I don't see why ford wouldn't use the same clutch fork in a 4wd 460, both both I found were wrong at looked like a t-18 trans. One truck was very minty looking, had low miles, good paint and a full interior.

I have not been able to find a single t-19 trans truck in the junkyard, or I would have just done that.

The t-18 style fork looks almost exactly the same, but the pivot ball mount is too far in, and hits the bellhousing when installing.

The t-19 clutch fork has nearly the same profile, but is clearance on the back side and has a slight forward curve while the t-18 style is basically flat with no bends.

If you can find me an online t-19 clutch fork that is in stock, let me know. I even emailed two different suppliers that showed out of stock, and they both said the part was discontinued and no longer in production.

T-18 (single PTO) was never factory fitment beneath ANY 460, 2 or 4wd.

There is a difference between 2 & 4wd 1st gear ratios, but the gearbox remained T-19.

I will have to dig all this crap up from my phone because I don't have my books here, while recovering from the hospital at my brother's.

I've got some time before the sun comes up and I can start beating on stuff or using an impact gun in this neighborhood.

Let me see what I can find......