85 460 dual tanks

[Haystack]

Just wondering out loud, but if this truck came stock with an electric pump, would it have a fuel pump eccentric on the cam gear?

The "hot fuel package" is listed as a tsb for trucks from 1982 to 1987, I am assuming there weren't too many fuel injected trucks in 1982, and the hot fuel package bolts to the cover plate for the mechanical pump, replacing it in the tsb, so I would assume it has what's needed to be run. My understanding is that most efi 85 302's still had the eccentric on the cam, that's how my EFI 85 gt motor was, and the 460 was carbed until 1987, so I don't see them pulling the timing chain cover and cam depending on which fuel tank was matched with the body.

I really need to drop the tank to figure out what they previous owner did, but I am sort of putting it off, because the more I dig on this truck, the more I end up replacing. I have a feeling the selector valve died so they just cut the wires and ran their own, a common theme so far.

[85lebaront2]

The "hot fuel package" is listed as a tsb for trucks from 1982 to 1987, I am assuming there weren't too many fuel injected trucks in 1982, and the hot fuel package bolts to the cover plate for the mechanical pump, replacing it in the tsb, so I would assume it has what's needed to be run. My understanding is that most efi 85 302's still had the eccentric on the cam, that's how my EFI 85 gt motor was, and the 460 was carbed until 1987, so I don't see them pulling the timing chain cover and cam depending on which fuel tank was matched with the body.

I really need to drop the tank to figure out what they previous owner did, but I am sort of putting it off, because the more I dig on this truck, the more I end up replacing. I have a feeling the selector valve died so they just cut the wires and ran their own, a common theme so far.

There were no EFI 460s until 1988. The hot fuel handling package was originally for the ambulance chassis as they would spend a lot of time idling and in the hotter areas would vapor lock which in a ambulance is not a good thing.

The electric in-tank pumps were just one part, the other was a plastic shield over the front of the mid frame tank as the left side exhaust comes rather close on a standard cab. On a super cab it is 22 inches further back and a crew cab, 35 inches further back.

If you own a super cab or crew cab that has the plastic shield on the mid frame tank, I recommend removing it as all it does is collect dirt and rust the top side of the tank seam until the tank leaks.

[Ifitaintbroke]

Just wondering out loud, but if this truck came stock with an electric pump, would it have a fuel pump eccentric on the cam gear?

Bill is correct. My truck is an 86 with the hot fuel handling package, and originally had electric fuel pumps. It has the eccentric. After several months of frustration trying to find electric pumps that would work, I put on a Holley mechanical and have never look back. One of the problems you will find is that, unless you buy the expensive high-perfprmance stuff, fuel pumps these days are garbage. I have had some pumps that ran exactly one time and quit. If you must have one, the Holleys are ok. Insanely loud, but they work. In my experience, a mechanical pump is just so much simpler, and I trust it more. Just my $0.00000002.

[85lebaront2]

Bill is correct. My truck is an 86 with the hot fuel handling package, and originally had electric fuel pumps. It has the eccentric. After several months of frustration trying to find electric pumps that would work, I put on a Holley mechanical and have never look back. One of the problems you will find is that, unless you buy the expensive high-perfprmance stuff, fuel pumps these days are garbage. I have had some pumps that ran exactly one time and quit. If you must have one, the Holleys are ok. Insanely loud, but they work. In my experience, a mechanical pump is just so much simpler, and I trust it more. Just my $0.00000002.

When I was trying to find a pair in 1994 when I bought Darth, Pep Boys was the only place that even had a listing for them. Rock Auto showed them on the 16th when I was looking.

[Haystack]

Been doing little things here and there, mostly related to the bucket and hydraulics.

I did figure out and wire in the resistive wire, it didn't seem to make any difference to the fuel pressure.

Had to break the dizzy to get it out (was timed at 32° with no vacuum advance), luckily new ones are relatively cheap and available. Pretty sure I am one tooth off, doesn't have the power it did before and it back fires under load with the vacuum advanced hooked up, but timing is correct unless the balancer marks spun.

Spark plugs looked brand new, was going to wire in the fuel sending units, but found another 20 or so wires in a butchered harness, all related to the fuel system. I think it's better off leaving it alone until I decide to tackle the fuel system.

Man this hydraulic clutch is almost impossible to bleed, I have gotten to the point that I have just enough travel to pop it in 1st and reverse. There was lots of burned up clutch material jammed in the bell housing, cleaning that up seemed to make the clutch move more easily and the clutch still feels fine, but I will probably replace it when it warms up.

Next up is the heater, mirrors (they are there, but glass has so many chips it's impossible to even see at night) and ideally a radio, but that's last on the list.

For now it is registered and driveable, and I have no need for it until this spring. For now, I think I am just going to use it to hang Christmas lights and I'll start tackling all the little stuff as I have time, and the fuel system when it warms up.

Has anyone who has done the 38 gallon tank swap done it in a cab chassis? It definitely has the narrow straight 34" frame. It looks like the f26a tank is narrower (listed at 34 1/4") while the f26d and f26e seem to be 34 3/4, but the f26a does not have the vent on top.

I do want to keep the dual tanks for reliability and to maximize range, but a mechanical pump and a single tank sure seems like the easiest way to go. Otherwise I need to add/replace all the wiring, fuel selector valve, front tank/pump ECT. It also seems like a waste to replace the only working fuel tank, but that electric pump zip tied to the frame rail has to go either way.

[ArdWrknTrk]

Been doing little things here and there, mostly related to the bucket and hydraulics.

I did figure out and wire in the resistive wire, it didn't seem to make any difference to the fuel pressure.

Had to break the dizzy to get it out (was timed at 32° with no vacuum advance), luckily new ones are relatively cheap and available. Pretty sure I am one tooth off, doesn't have the power it did before and it back fires under load with the vacuum advanced hooked up, but timing is correct unless the balancer marks spun.

Spark plugs looked brand new, was going to wire in the fuel sending units, but found another 20 or so wires in a butchered harness, all related to the fuel system. I think it's better off leaving it alone until I decide to tackle the fuel system.

Man this hydraulic clutch is almost impossible to bleed, I have gotten to the point that I have just enough travel to pop it in 1st and reverse. There was lots of burned up clutch material jammed in the bell housing, cleaning that up seemed to make the clutch move more easily and the clutch still feels fine, but I will probably replace it when it warms up.

Next up is the heater, mirrors (they are there, but glass has so many chips it's impossible to even see at night) and ideally a radio, but that's last on the list.

For now it is registered and driveable, and I have no need for it until this spring. For now, I think I am just going to use it to hang Christmas lights and I'll start tackling all the little stuff as I have time, and the fuel system when it warms up.

Has anyone who has done the 38 gallon tank swap done it in a cab chassis? It definitely has the narrow straight 34" frame. It looks like the f26a tank is narrower (listed at 34 1/4") while the f26d and f26e seem to be 34 3/4, but the f26a does not have the vent on top.

I do want to keep the dual tanks for reliability and to maximize range, but a mechanical pump and a single tank sure seems like the easiest way to go. Otherwise I need to add/replace all the wiring, fuel selector valve, front tank/pump ECT. It also seems like a waste to replace the only working fuel tank, but that electric pump zip tied to the frame rail has to go either way.

Do you need the vent on top?

If this truck is as butchered as you say I doubt the charcoal canister is hooked up anyhow.

I cannot say I've installed a deep tank on a straight frame truck.

Edit: the C&C trucks have a unique rear tank for '85-86 E5TZ 9002-E

Bleeding the hydraulic clutch is a challenge.

My best advice is to drive it on a rough road and the vibration will shake the bubbles up to the reservoir.

(I know this sounds weird but you have to have faith)

 

[85lebaront2]

Do you need the vent on top?

If this truck is as butchered as you say I doubt the charcoal canister is hooked up anyhow.

I cannot say I've installed a deep tank on a straight frame truck.

Edit: the C&C trucks have a unique rear tank for '85-86 E5TZ 9002-E

Bleeding the hydraulic clutch is a challenge.

My best advice is to drive it on a rough road and the vibration will shake the bubbles up to the reservoir.

(I know this sounds weird but you have to have faith)

Jim, the C & C trucks have a different rear frame due to the use of a Dana rear axle rather than the wider Sterling 10.25".

On bleeding the clutch hydraulics, from a Mercedes-Benz manual (their clutch master is inside and essentially is where a mechanical clutch rod would go, so is near vertical) They use the nearest front caliper to reverse bleed.

Take a suitable hose that is a snug fit on the bleeder screws connect the clutch slave bleeder to the caliper bleeder. Open the clutch slave bleeder at least 1/2 turn. Bleed the caliper through the clutch slave until all the bubbles are gone.

Two items (a) M-B clutch hydraulics use the brake system reservoir (b) it works better if the clutch supply line is at the upper fitting on the slave.

This also works on rear or mid engine hydraulic clutches (Fiat X1/9).

[ArdWrknTrk]

Jim, the C & C trucks have a different rear frame due to the use of a Dana rear axle rather than the wider Sterling 10.25".

On bleeding the clutch hydraulics, from a Mercedes-Benz manual (their clutch master is inside and essentially is where a mechanical clutch rod would go, so is near vertical) They use the nearest front caliper to reverse bleed.

Take a suitable hose that is a snug fit on the bleeder screws connect the clutch slave bleeder to the caliper bleeder. Open the clutch slave bleeder at least 1/2 turn. Bleed the caliper through the clutch slave until all the bubbles are gone.

Two items (a) M-B clutch hydraulics use the brake system reservoir (b) it works better if the clutch supply line is at the upper fitting on the slave.

This also works on rear or mid engine hydraulic clutches (Fiat X1/9).

I know the rear frame and springs are narrower.

*They came with Dana or Sterling as shown on the next page...

I'm just trying to point out that there is a unique part # for the C&C trucks and i don't think there's any chance that the 38G pickup tank will fit.

Those Spectra #s are for variations (small bung pre '85, big bung with inner vent retaining ring '85&86, and '87 up with the bigger bung but set for fill through the center and vent around the outside, no ring)

These trucks don't have any slave bleeder.

There's just an Allen set screw and the fluid pees out the end of the plastic slave. (Akebono used to sell a metal slave with an actual bleed nipple, but i haven't seen one of those in a decade)

I have one, and just fed a hose back up into the reservoir. Pump in a loop and you eventually get some pedal (enough to drive it and shake the bubbles loose)

Gary didn't believe me either, until he tried it.

[Gary Lewis]

I know the rear frame and springs are narrower.

*They came with Dana or Sterling as shown on the next page...

I'm just trying to point out that there is a unique part # for the C&C trucks and i don't think there's any chance that the 38G pickup tank will fit.

Those Spectra #s are for variations (small bung pre '85, big bung with inner vent retaining ring '85&86, and '87 up with the bigger bung but set for fill through the center and vent around the outside, no ring)

These trucks don't have any slave bleeder.

There's just an Allen set screw and the fluid pees out the end of the plastic slave. (Akebono used to sell a metal slave with an actual bleed nipple, but i haven't seen one of those in a decade)

I have one, and just fed a hose back up into the reservoir. Pump in a loop and you eventually get some pedal (enough to drive it and shake the bubbles loose)

Gary didn't believe me either, until he tried it.

Jim - Yes, I was skeptical but driving around the neighborhood did bounce the bubbles out and, after several miles and lots of pumping of the pedal, all was good.

But I'm confused about the rear tank. You said "the C&C trucks have a unique rear tank for '85-86 E5TZ 9002-E". And while I see that PN in your snippet, I also see that it was used on the 85/86 F150/350's. And from what I remember they take the same tank shape/size as a Bronco, albeit smaller in capacity.

What am I missing?

[ArdWrknTrk]

Jim - Yes, I was skeptical but driving around the neighborhood did bounce the bubbles out and, after several miles and lots of pumping of the pedal, all was good.

But I'm confused about the rear tank. You said "the C&C trucks have a unique rear tank for '85-86 E5TZ 9002-E". And while I see that PN in your snippet, I also see that it was used on the 85/86 F150/350's. And from what I remember they take the same tank shape/size as a Bronco, albeit smaller in capacity.

What am I missing?

Maybe I'm delirious?

I swear i could barely get my new tank in when i replaced it back around Halloween.

Perhaps the flanges are narrower on the C&C trucks and the space between rails is similar to pickups?

I know axles don't interchange because the spring perches are closer together.

The 32 gallon Bronco tanks are shorter front to back and really need a piece of angle to support the bash plate if you try to use them in a pickup.

At any rate Haystack needs a tank with the 3 5/8 bung for his sender so the Bronco tank is out.

And he wants a fill neck with the ring to support the vent tube so that means the F26-A and -E are out.