Rembrant Posted April 24, 2023 Share Posted April 24, 2023 Can you buy one new? 'Rebuilt' pumps can be very hit or miss. Type F is cheap, and if it doesn't help you can pump it into a bucket like I outlined above. But I'm pragmatic (and 'skint') Ultimately I want to find the cause rather than being a parts swapper. I've now purchased three reman C2 pumps, and only had one out of the bunch that still made a little bit of noise. It performed fine otherwise. They're cheap, but a bit of a pain to swap the pulley if it's rusted on there. The other two I bought were quiet, including the one on my current 302. By the way, I primed this new pump and system with a drill before starting the engine up. I don't know if it mattered (or helped) or not, but I figured it was one less thing to worry about while starting up a new engine. Reminder for anybody that is feeling wealthy (and also has a case of the CII blues...lol), Lee Power Steering makes a CII Ford pump with Saginaw internals. This would be super nice as a drop-in replacement...but it IS expensive by comparison. Maybe not so bad with the increasing rarity of the Ford Saginaw swap parts. https://leepowersteering.com/collections/power-steering-pumps/products/ford-cii-power-steering-pump-replacement One thing to note is that the Lee pump has the Metric fitting, so to install it on a Bullnose you would probably have to buy a later (1992-1996?) F-series pressure line (but they're also very cheap, so NBD). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ArdWrknTrk Posted April 25, 2023 Share Posted April 25, 2023 Can you buy one new? 'Rebuilt' pumps can be very hit or miss. Type F is cheap, and if it doesn't help you can pump it into a bucket like I outlined above. But I'm pragmatic (and 'skint') Ultimately I want to find the cause rather than being a parts swapper. I've now purchased three reman C2 pumps, and only had one out of the bunch that still made a little bit of noise. It performed fine otherwise. They're cheap, but a bit of a pain to swap the pulley if it's rusted on there. The other two I bought were quiet, including the one on my current 302. By the way, I primed this new pump and system with a drill before starting the engine up. I don't know if it mattered (or helped) or not, but I figured it was one less thing to worry about while starting up a new engine. Reminder for anybody that is feeling wealthy (and also has a case of the CII blues...lol), Lee Power Steering makes a CII Ford pump with Saginaw internals. This would be super nice as a drop-in replacement...but it IS expensive by comparison. Maybe not so bad with the increasing rarity of the Ford Saginaw swap parts. https://leepowersteering.com/collections/power-steering-pumps/products/ford-cii-power-steering-pump-replacement One thing to note is that the Lee pump has the Metric fitting, so to install it on a Bullnose you would probably have to buy a later (1992-1996?) F-series pressure line (but they're also very cheap, so NBD). I defer to your experience with C2 rebuilds Cory. The two times I've used Cardone remans they weren't quiet, but better than puking shaft seals. Though everyone seemed to rave about the adapted Saginaw--> C2 pumps Cardone used to make (and sold for ~$83).... then Definitely worthwhile to prime the pump on install since the belt is already off. I don't know about cycling it lock to lock if the wheels aren't in the air but at least it won't start dry or catch a slug of air right away. 👍 Lee sure are proud of their Saginaw gutted C2! 😳 I also see that it's "only for 1500 series" trucks, so Id imagine not good for my 250 or 350 like Big Brother. They do have the 11/16 shaft for a C2 pulley instead of the 3/4 found on a Sag. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigBrother-84 Posted April 25, 2023 Author Share Posted April 25, 2023 I defer to your experience with C2 rebuilds Cory. The two times I've used Cardone remans they weren't quiet, but better than puking shaft seals. Though everyone seemed to rave about the adapted Saginaw--> C2 pumps Cardone used to make (and sold for ~$83).... then Definitely worthwhile to prime the pump on install since the belt is already off. I don't know about cycling it lock to lock if the wheels aren't in the air but at least it won't start dry or catch a slug of air right away. 👍 Lee sure are proud of their Saginaw gutted C2! 😳 I also see that it's "only for 1500 series" trucks, so Id imagine not good for my 250 or 350 like Big Brother. They do have the 11/16 shaft for a C2 pulley instead of the 3/4 found on a Sag. Guys, that's a lot of information, thanks so much! If prefer to not go with additives for the moment, will start from the base. So, my plan will be: 1- Flush the fluid. It's probably the oldest one in this truck, other ones were recently renewed (brakes and radiator). 2- Verify that cap o-rings are sealed. Renew if needed. 3- If still very noisy after pouring new ps fluid, will probably look for a pump swap. Will have to make a decision between a new C2, a Saginaw, or this "Sag-organs-in-a-C2-Body" I wasn't aware of. And thanks to Jim, will need to confirm if this latter can support a F-350 before going that way. I'll let you know where each step is taking me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
81-F150-Explorer Posted April 25, 2023 Share Posted April 25, 2023 Guys, that's a lot of information, thanks so much! If prefer to not go with additives for the moment, will start from the base. So, my plan will be: 1- Flush the fluid. It's probably the oldest one in this truck, other ones were recently renewed (brakes and radiator). 2- Verify that cap o-rings are sealed. Renew if needed. 3- If still very noisy after pouring new ps fluid, will probably look for a pump swap. Will have to make a decision between a new C2, a Saginaw, or this "Sag-organs-in-a-C2-Body" I wasn't aware of. And thanks to Jim, will need to confirm if this latter can support a F-350 before going that way. I'll let you know where each step is taking me. The CII can be very noisy when new even. I can hear that noise a "mile away", and then I start looking for the Old Classic Ford it is attached to. Fluid can break down over time, so putting new in is a good idea. Also these pumps tend to make more noise when hot. Does your truck have a Power Steering cooler? The PS cooler was an option and it's just basically a longer return hose tube that follows and loops the length of the engine crossmember a couple of times. The non-cooler line for comparison just has a small loop that attaches to the left side of the crossmember. The non cooler and cooler return lines are interchangeable between the same engine family. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigBrother-84 Posted April 27, 2023 Author Share Posted April 27, 2023 I can hear that noise a "mile away", and then I start looking for the Old Classic Ford it is attached to. Ralph, you're right! But I am sure that Big Bro is much noisier than ever this spring. Does your truck have a Power Steering cooler? Nope. But this can be an option I can consider. Thanks for the info! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigBrother-84 Posted April 27, 2023 Author Share Posted April 27, 2023 Lee sure are proud of their Saginaw gutted C2! 😳 I also see that it's "only for 1500 series" trucks, so Id imagine not good for my 250 or 350 like Big Brother. Jim, I was curious so I asked Lee about their pump compatibility with a F-350 4x4 CrewCab 351W. Here is their answer: «Our pump should work fine with stock tires and no hydroboost.» Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ArdWrknTrk Posted April 27, 2023 Share Posted April 27, 2023 Lee sure are proud of their Saginaw gutted C2! 😳 I also see that it's "only for 1500 series" trucks, so Id imagine not good for my 250 or 350 like Big Brother. Jim, I was curious so I asked Lee about their pump compatibility with a F-350 4x4 CrewCab 351W. Here is their answer: «Our pump should work fine with stock tires and no hydroboost.» Well that's good to hear! I'm a bit confused what they meant with that bolded statement on the linked page???? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigBrother-84 Posted April 27, 2023 Author Share Posted April 27, 2023 Well that's good to hear! I'm a bit confused what they meant with that bolded statement on the linked page???? In fact, they first replied with the question «stock tires?». It is after I confirmed, that they concluded with their final answer, including the Hydroboost precision. The tires size appears to be their main concern. I suppose that the weight of the truck plus large tires ground friction can be an issue. Hydroboost comes in second place. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ArdWrknTrk Posted April 27, 2023 Share Posted April 27, 2023 In fact, they first replied with the question «stock tires?». It is after I confirmed, that they concluded with their final answer, including the Hydroboost precision. The tires size appears to be their main concern. I suppose that the weight of the truck plus large tires ground friction can be an issue. Hydroboost comes in second place. Wide tires are a huge issue, more so on pavement and when not moving. But as you expect, wider tires and wheels can only be to the outside of the pivot point drawn through your kingpin or ball joints. That additional leverage gets multiplied back through the tie rods and pitman arm. I'm still interested to understand what they mean by 1500 series. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AmericanSavage Posted April 27, 2023 Share Posted April 27, 2023 I went through this on my truck—ended up changing it 3 times. I thought about converting to a SAG but did not have the ability or time to fab a bracket. I understand there is a total convert kit somewhere for it. At first I got a reman Cardone. I cannot urge enough to stay away. Anyway, I went with a NEW LARES c2. It is and has been quiet for months now. Highly recommend. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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