NorCal-Ed

Oppps, I said PIP, which I think is a thing but I meant to say “spout” Maybe I can blame it on the pain meds. LOL Thanks again guys.

Hey Jim and 81 F-150 explorer (not sure of your name sorry) great insights thank you stuff to consider and look into. My goal was to get my 1984 Cali smog and registered Bully F150 automatic running perfect before my right shoulder surgery which was not quite 4 weeks ago, because it is the only automatic vehicle I own and in the event of an emergency I could drive it, my wife doesn’t drive for health reasons but she could and would if the absolute need arrived. Well I did not quite make it. My surgery date came and I was unable to finish but let me fill you in on where I left off now that I am no longer on pain meds and can use both hands which is much easier to type/text. By the way the surgery went well the recovery is going as expected and the reason for the surgery is abuse, misuse and old age. Torn rotator cuff, torn bicep, collar bone spur clean up (grind out arthritis) which leaves you in a total isolation sling for 6 weeks. Then therapy starts and that lasts at least 6 weeks and then living life therapy starts after that. Very important not to abuse it but make sure to use it. Ok on to the Bully. Got a recon carb from Guaranteed Carburetors from Florida. My carb had a broken mixture screw below the base plate surface and I didn’t want to mess with it and mess it up and lose any core value. Side note even with the broken mixture screw Guaranteed Carburetor's still gave me a full core refund. Just a word to the wise the recon carb, I’m guessing any and or all recon carb business’s, do not have any of the necessary adjustments that can be done on the bench or may I say should be done to the carb before mounting. So if you were to mount the carb right out of the box you might be very disappointed. From transfer slot exposures, to high idle adjustments, to choke horn blade position adjustments, electronic choke adjustment, initial mixture screw adjustment, accelerator pump lever adjustment everything was not even close but after bench tuning the carb it fired right up and the choke worked as it should. So I had the mixture screws out from “gently” fully seated, 2 turns. Put the vacuum gauge on (full manifold vacuum) and got the best idle and most vacuum at 3 and a half turns out. Usually you turn the screws in but my carb wasn’t having it? Maybe clogged passages? Messed up passages? Messed up adjustment screws? Thoughts anyone? So I went with it. Hooked my old school RAC tach dwell meter up by putting in a jump wire in on top of the coil plug and hooked the other lead to ground. Selected the 8 cylinder setting and it was way off, like a 1000 rpms higher off. Either my old tach dwell meter is no good or I had it hooked up wrong? Either way I am going to purchase a digital timing light that has a tach built in so I did my timing and idle adjustments by ear and a dial in timing light and a standard timing light. Any suggestions as to a good econo digital timing light? So get this the best I got the old Cali smogged 302 C6 to run with no detonation detected was 17 1/2 degrees btc. Of course the PIP was disconnected and once reconnected other carb adjustments were made as needed because the computer was active again. Is that crazy? This all started out because it had a flat spot that would stall the engine if you didn’t feather and pump the carb while trying to accelerate from full stop and it didn’t seem to have any power. It strained to get to highway speed to be able to set the cruise control. The cruise control could maintain highway speed (65) on flat ground anyways but just didn’t seem to have any power to pass or pull a hill. I’m at 4200 feet elevation. I’m not complaining about how this little 302 has came alive but I was suspect of my dial in timing light so I highlighted all my timing marks on the harmonic balancer and used my regular old timing light, again disconnecting the PIP, and the results were the same. Really hard to see the timing marks by the way with all that’s in the way just like adjusting the carb mixture screws, adjusting those mixture screws was a real HOT PITA trying to use just a straight slot screw driver and a mirror. If anyone has a carb mixture screw adjustment tool/hack please let me know. My thought is to put tight fitting hose over the ends of the screws, like I do to install spark plugs, so I can easily adjust the screws and plan on leaving the hose on and then use a paint marker to index on the hose and a point that would be visible on the carb or whatever the hose is near that is stationary. Love to hear how you all deal with those mixture screws. I realize that those screws are not meant to be adjusted from the factory so their location is not meant to be convenient and they are not convenient to adjust that’s for sure. LOL The down shift linkage adjustment is perfect and no stumble from stop, zero to 60 in way less that an hour like it was. Wasn’t running hot no audible detonation and a ear to ear grin. Pulled into the post office after a pretty hard test drive, turned the truck off went inside to my PO Box got my mail and thumbed through the mail put my seat belt on and no start, just cranked. Flooded? No gas smell. No spark? Way to much advance? I just don’t know. So I gave it one to the floor pump after a couple of tries and went for an extended crank. I don’t know maybe after 5 seconds maybe 15 seconds way longer than normal it was like one cylinder fired I kept cranking then another then another it seemed and sounded like it finally was wanting to stay running and it stumbled a bit then cleared up and was idling just fine and ran just as good. Thunderstorm came so I parked it for the evening planning on using the OBD 1 reader the next day and start to work through any codes. Before I used the OBD 1 reader I planned on doing a cold start and go test drive it again. One pump and started right up on choke and high idle and after it warmed up, choke full off and regular (by ear no tach) idle. Took it for a good hard test drive to try to duplicate the conditions pulled up to my shop turned off the engine waited a few minutes and no start just crank. No fuel smell. Thought I would give it some pumps still no start so did the long crank and it eventually stumbled to a start. Well you got to love consistency. So I pulled the codes via KOEO (key on engine off) “Innova”OBD 1 reader as suggested by one of my new “Bully Buddies” :-) and got a 31 o and a 41 c. According to the booklet, if I am reading the booklet correctly a 31 o could be; Trucks only: EGR valve control sensor (ex. V8 models) does the “ex.” mean except? The other 31 o is; Trucks only: EVAP control system below minimum voltage And a continuous memory code 41 c: HEGO (HO2S) sensor signal out of range/always lean Well, that is right where I left it. The next day I went under the knife. I have not got any shop manuals yet which I should order while I’m convalescing. In the mean time if anybody knows where the trouble shooting procedures are on this forum a nudge in the right direction or a link would be great. Your own experiences and fixes would be even better. Those shop manuals speak “Fordtechspeakanese” and are confusing sometimes. It will be a few weeks before I can get back under the hood. Sorry about the long absence and thank you all in advance for taking the time to read and any responses you have. Ed

Gary and Jim, thank you for the references and links, good stuff!!! I am looking at rockauto’s factory reprint shop manual it’s 75bucks plus shipping but the ebay idea is a great, I am going to start looking right away. I have a 1976 F100 4x4, and looking at that, it has a straight axle and coils, I was thinking if it’s anything like my 96 F250 7.3 Powerstroke manual, crew, 6’ box, I took the Dana 60 out of my 86 F350 6.9 IDI, manual, crew, long bed and everything bolted right up. I was very surprised pleased. I sold that 86 and learned my lesson on robbing Peter to pay Paul so to speak so I will not be taking the front end out of the 76 to put into the 84 but it’s within that 10 year window like my 86 to 96 swap so I’m hoping something like that might be the case it would save me some work but no matter, I have a little metal working skills and sticking a different front end under the 84 shouldn’t be to hard. Hummmmm you made me just remember I have a 1976 3/4 ton Dodge that just might fit the bill!!!! I’ll have to look tomorrow if the drives are on the same sides. Leafs in the front coming right up. Thanks for the idea. Ed

If the assertion by Indiana Jones in Indiana Jones and the Last Crusade, set in 1938, that the Ford MCU Controlled Feedback Carburetor Knight and his brothers began guarding the “Ford service manual” 700 years prior, around 1238, is accurate, then the siblings can't be Ford 2150 service tech’s of the First Crusade per Walter Donovan's "bedtime story" earlier in the film. I took some humorous artistic liberties. I am feeling your point!!!! Your joke might be the reality. Ed :)

These are pics of my timing pointer. There are no wires connected to it. The pointer bracket appears to be bolted around a small block that seems to be part of the block and from what I can tell the little block covered by the pointer bracket is not solid but looks as though something might fit in it? As you can see the pointer bracket has what looks like to me like a peep sight? The Haynes manual does not show any details about timing pointers or harmonic balancers or any mention of external or internal “crankshaft position sensor” So if you can solve this unique mystery timing pointer configuration that would be lovely. I just want to make sure something isn’t missing that will keep me from getting the old Bully Bully from running correctly. Speaking of things that may need adjusting, I got my carb this afternoon and as I was swapping things over from my carb to their rebuilt carb I pondered about the adjustments of the two main vacuum actuated items on this carb which I started researching and have not come up with definitive answers; My vacuum “throttle kicker” slash “dash pot” for my 84 5.0 does not leak vacuum and when I apply vacuum to the diaphragm part of the device the “kicker” doesn’t really move but it doesn’t leak. I have read what Gary has on the forum for the 2150, at least what I was directed to via a Google search and I can not figure how to test or adjust. Stuff I read about on other Google searches dealt with electronic controlled not vacuum and A/C. I found nothing that said the vacuum actuator had to do with A/C and I found nothing on how to test and adjust. However if it is working there is an adjustment that allows you to move the entire unit to obtain a proper curb idle rpm. Same goes for the vacuum “choke pull off” I think is what it is called. I have to transfer these items over to the rebuilt carb and I have not found any test or adjusting instructions. Interesting the Haynes says that the computer input carb was a stop gap to fuel injection and that it will not be covered in the book and to take it to a dealer. Just for fun I called a dealer or two and their response to me bringing the truck to them was they do not work on vehicles that old and do not work on carburetors. It didn’t surprise me, I ran into the same thing on my bike and it’s a 2004.LOL I appreciate that right up front because I would hate to pay someone that would mess things up not as bad as me and it still be wrong. Lol That’s why this forum is so important to me. The knowledge and skills to keep these vehicles alive and well are passing away just like the mechanics that took care of them when they were new. Thank you Gary for all your efforts and one day I hope to become very familiar with using this forum and with the knowledge I acquire to get and keep this 84 running at its best and to be able to help others sort out their unique troubles that seem to be built into these trucks especially if you live in California and have to leave all the transitionary learn as they go smog on. I guess once the mystery is over it will all make sense and will be easy. Oh how I wish I could have a smog delete engine under the hood. Hummmmmm in rural California you only have to smog upon title transfer soooooo I could pull this stock smogged engine and wrap it up and store it and put a proper 5.0 under the hood. Very interesting, hey good talk thanks for the idea. I’m now also looking for a rebuildable 302 besides a front 1/2 ton Ford solid differential for the front of my truck, don’t really want to keep the twin I beam? differential or whatever they call it, not sure of the gear ration but I can change a ring and pinion easy enough. Thank you Chris and anyone else that might have replies and answers to my step by step learning curve. Ed

It looks like this is a thread in the “main” forum? Yes? I’m not sure if I reply clicking on the last posts “reply” button if all, Gary, Jim and Chris will be notified via email or within the forum some how or if I have to Click “reply” to each individual post in this thread? Not even sure if I’m asking the correct question. Anyways a huge thank you to Gary, Jim and Chris for all your information and help and encouragement. I’m not sure if you noticed but this is the second day in a row that I have accessed this forum!!!! Woot woot ;-) Thank you Gary for the link to the login page. Yes Jim and Gary, Chris has the skills. :-) Chris thank you for lots. I have saved the smog sticker and manipulated it and printed it out and saved into my notes. I have not found a “Calibration code” as Gary requested. The stickers have not faired well over the last 40 years just like the wiring and me. Lol Do you happen to have a legible calibration code you could send me a pic of or are they vehicle specific? I went to AutoZone yesterday and picked up an OBD 1 reader, the same one you linked to and the same price as Amazon. I guess Amazon isn’t the most economic choice any more. Same price and I have Prime so no shipping but at AutoZone I walked out the door with it and because I live in such a rural place Amazon takes a minimum of three days. I was surprised usually around here, anyways, the chain auto stores are at least two if not three times internet prices. I have located the OBD 1 plug ins thank you right where you said and YouTube and Google had chasing my tail again and my Haines manual didn’t even mention OBD 1 just OBD II? The Innova 1345 reader, same one you linked to is pinned different than my plug but it covers a few years soooo…… It looks like all I need is; E 359 signal return ground C 658 check engine light ground 1 209 self test output To get the reader to scan besides a carburetor and un shorting wires, minor details. Lol Replacing all vacuum lines with silicone lines sounds like an excellent idea, was that a complete kit or an individual each by each replacement, I can’t recall what you said and I don’t dare navigate away from this reply window. If “Motorcraft” ICM? Module on side of carb are known to fail is there a better brand? Also anybody tried getting the fender mounted heat sync for the module, not sure what year it’s from, and get the module off the distributor and away from direct engine heat? Not sure what it would take to have a 3 prong hook up from distributor to module but if I am going to have to re wire my module/coil, water temp part of the harness I might as well go long and take it to the fender? I got the new module plug but I’m working on a quick fix “Jerry Rig” wiring fix at the moment so I can get the carb, when it gets here, installed and see if the rebuild is any good and get started messing with the timing and carb and OBD 1 codes. Do you happen to know what is up with my timing indicator that I described in my other post? The thing that look like an external crankshaft/harmonic balancer position sensor bracket thingy with no wires attached to it. If you need a pic I can accommodate. Ok well I have some work ahead of me once the carb comes, hoping today but probably tomorrow. Thank you for everything Ed

Thank you AWT, I have been struggling navigating this forum so sorry about this delayed reply. Great links!!! I ran I to this guy on Youtube. One of my mixture screws broke off so I opted to buy a recon carb from Guaranteed Carburetors in Florida. They mistakenly sent me a manual tranny carb so I am waiting for for the correct auto tranny carb supposed to be here in a couple of days. If you can take a peek at my reply to Mr. Culske, I’m working from memory here so sorry if I miss spelled his name, and feel free to field any of the questions or address and solutions to my difficulties I have in that very long reply to him. Still stumbling along but making progress. Thank you for your help. Ed

Dear Mr. Ckuske, My apologies for such a delayed reply. I kid you not I just stumbled on how to log in. I get up every day and mess with the forum until my frustration limit is reached then I put it down and try the next day and can’t seem to navigate this forum worth a hill of beans. Anyhow thank you for such an informative reply. I’m not sure if I am in the “main” forum as it was suggested I post into to get more views and help. I have been searching the internet for what ignition and carb I have and have determined what you posted here weeks ago to be so. Your info is exactly why I want to figure out how to use this forum. Just figuring out the “spout” was a nightmare because Youtube and Google searches produced this result… And this is what I have… I did not have these images in my photos I just did a search just now and captured these images from a Google search which brought me this forum and I captured the images then came back and everything I had written to you was gone. I’m not sure how I searched for an 84 Ford F150 spout before when I could not determine where my spout was, I figured it out with the help of a Haynes manual that I just picked up a couple of days ago, that there is more than one kind of spout but the irony of my search just now on Google came up in the pictures of two different types in “garysgaragemahal” forum is laughable. Oh well hopefully I will get this figured out. The way I stumbled on how to sign in today was I went to the new members page and was going to “re-register” the only other time I kinda successfully interacted with this forum, so I clicked on that link and just happen to turn my iphone sideways and saw a “login” link. I’m guessing there is a more direct link to the login but it’s been weeks that I have been looking and I just got lucky today. To answer your question Mr. Ckuske I believe I have a C6 tranny. 17 pan bolts and not a plain square or rectangle shape but a rectangle with a corner missing if you will and a door jam Vin sticker code of “K” I too have purchased a re built carb from “Guaranteed Carburetors” from Florida. Takes 6-7 days to get here and they sent me a manual tranny carb. They have sent me another and it’s suppose to get here Aug 16 23 with two return labels for my core and their manual carb. Getting traction on this 84 project is proving to be challenging but I am learning things and if I can learn how to use this forum it looks like it will take a lot of the school of hard knocks learning away and stream line everything like who might be the best carb rebuild company or what I even have for an ignition and carb or tranny like you posted to me weeks ago. So here is what I have ran into in preparation for my carb to get here. I can not figure out how to hook up my old school Rac tach/dwell meter to monitor my RPM’s during the vacuum gauge, mixture screw adjusting and while checking/setting my initial timing and seeing what RPM my total timing is coming in at. From what I have deduced all I can set is initial and the ECM? computer does the rest? Nothing inside the distributor except a rotor and a window magnet electronic gizmo. As I removed the coil, module, condensor and manifold plugs to gain better access to that portion of the wiring harness to try to figure out a way to hook up the tach/dwell meter for a temporary tach I discovered my wiring as of right now is crumbling. The insulation off of my spout wire from the plug which is yellowish and a blue wire (PIP?) above it at the module plug is crumbling as are those wires further back in the harness, I have stripped off the loom and tape, also a black with pink stripe is cracking in several places. I’m afraid to keep following, stripping off the loom and tape, for fear of making things worse. Is this a thing? Is there someone out there that reproduces color code matching wiring harnesses? It ran ok with a bit of a stumble until I started working on it. I thought I was kinda handy with mechanical things but then along came my beloved Bullnose. So whats the easy way to hook up a tach? I got under the dash to look for the green yellow wire that goes to the dash tach if you happed to have a tach, which I do not, and said to myself,”oh, not today skippy!” Scary lol If my wiring wasn’t so bad I was thinking of cutting in a splice to the neg side of the coil. Thank you Ford engineers for going to the new and improved square coil with no external + or - terminals and also special thanks for burying it under the AC compressor. Also what’s up with the timing mark indicator? It’s like a bracket that bolts on to the engine block around a small block on the engine block that has like a peep sight looking onto the harmonic balancer then the timing mark indicator edge/point. There are no wires attached to it as if it were some kind of crankshaft position sensor?!? Remember the old ad jingle “Ford has a better idea.” WTH?!?!?! “what the heck” keeping it clean. Lol All this Cali smog stuff is a learning curve and a PITH, pain in the hiney. Lol I will be going out and getting an OBD 1 reader as you suggested. I have not seen an obvious place to hook up a scan tool. May I ask where this is. I’m sure it is on this forum somewhere. Lol I am going to check the Haynes manual. That manual is about as worthless of a manual there is but it was the fastest thing I could put my hands on. Oh yeah I need one more thing for right now to be able to finish this new carb install and check my timing, a picture of a 1984 California smog underhood sticker, mines gone. The Haynes manual says to refer to your sticker for timing info and procedures. I’m looking to get the complete shop manual reprint off of Rockauto for $75 bucks plus shipping unless I get a better alternative from you or others here in the forum. Well a lot to wade through, sorry to include everything in one post I’m just not confident that I will be able to find my way back. Lol Thank you for taking the time to read all this. Ed

Hello, it was suggested I move my post to the “main” forum. Hope this is it. LOL old people and and smart phones. I hope I can learn how to use this site. I have an 84 F150 extra cab automaticlong bed, 4x4, with very low miles for it’s age, under 100,000 miles. It is completely stock and a California vehicle which means I have to leave all the smog in place. I’m hoping to learn everything I can to be able to get this 302 2 bbl to the best tune I can in spite of all the smog. I need to understand all the vacuum from smog to whatever else is actuated with vacuum, I’m guessing a truck this age is going to have cracked vacuum lines which will play havoc on tuning. Need to know how to trouble shoot and find all the vacuum associated items. I have a “stumble” right off throttle. You can feather the throttle and get it past the stumble but the truck just seems to have a hard time getting up to speed. Seems sluggish. The tires are a size or two taller than stock maybe this is part of the sluggish issue? I want to rebuild the carb. Let me revise that, I believe I am going to buy another carb, any suggestions? I’m thinking accelerator pump and this is where I am hoping to tap into your brain trust. Maybe it’s a vacuum issue? Maybe a timing issue? Maybe a carb issue? Maybe it is a combo of things? Looking for everything I can check and eliminate. What is the best kit, or replacement carb. The reason I am leaning to another carb is one of the mixture screws is broke off and I an not really wanting to drill out and heli coil. I have Orilleys, Auto Zone and Napa locally and of course the internet. Carb adjusting, Timing, transmission kick down adjustment, choke adjustment. Overall there is a lot of wires and hoses (smog) I’m guessing to wade through just to get to the engine and I’m guessing that all this smog has got to be working correct to get the best tune I can. Any help with navigating and posting would be appreciated. Right up front I am a computer/Tech dummy, which makes my objective of having access to all the knowledge and help offered here almost out of reach. Thank you in advance Ed from north east California near Nevada and Oregon boarders where the pavement ends and the west is still wild. I know, doesn’t fit the typical image of what people think of California. I live where the Sierra’s end and the Cascade’s begin on the east side of the mountains in the high desert right where the pine trees end and all the farm land for raising hay and ranching begins. I can leave my back yard and for the most part make to Idaho through Nevada or into east Oregon without getting on any pavement (almost) so I need to get this 84 in tip top shape. Thank you again Ed

Woot woot I was unaware that the image would only be text until after it actually posted I am going to try posting the pics from my original post to see if I can send multiple pics in a post. This is a test to see if I can post multiple pics in one post. I added the pics after the first paragraph and all the “text jpeg info” was place at the beginning of the post going to send now to see how it posts. Any direction will be appreciated. ;-)

Thanks Jim for the welcome As far as getting pics posted I mentioned I am using an iphone, not sure if that is an issue, I do not have a computer, it is an issue for me as far as viewing. In a lot of cases I have to turn my phone sideways to view the page for example signing in. Once I put in my email the page moves to the left and I can only see the end of the right side of the password box. I can see the whole box if I turn my phone sideways but the header and footer take up 2/3’s of the screen and make viewing difficult as well. As far as attaching a picture I used the paper clip icon at the top of the text box. It sounds like that might be the wrong choice. I do see an orange button, I think, is it rectangle and second from the left? I am going to give it a try right now and see what happens. Let me try again Well no joy. Same as above “nabble_img src= etc” However it inserts it in the middle of a sentence above in my text. I do really want to get this sorted out so I can move on and be able to communicate effectively with others. What am I doing wrong or is it the fact that I do not have a computer only an iphone? Thank you again Ed

Hello, thank you for your site. I hope I can learn how to use it. I have an 84 F150 extra cab automatic, long bed, 4x4, with very low miles for it’s age, under 100,000 miles. I have pictures but reading how to post a picture was Greek to me. I hopefully was able to post pictures at the end of this post. It is completely stock and a California vehicle which means I have to leave all the smog in place. I’m hoping to learn everything I can to be able to get this 302 2 bbl to the best tune I can in spite of all the smog. I need to understand all the vacuum from smog to whatever else is actuated with vacuum, I’m guessing a truck this age is going to have cracked vacuum lines which will play havoc on tuning. Need to know how to trouble shoot and find all the vacuum associated items. I have a “stumble” right off throttle. You can feather the throttle and get it past the stumble but the truck just seems to have a hard time getting up to speed. Seems sluggish. The tires are a size or two taller than stock maybe this is part of the sluggish issue? I want to rebuild the carb. I’m thinking excellerator pump and this is where I am hoping to tap into your brain trust. Maybe it’s a vacuum issue? Maybe a timing issue? Maybe a carb issue? Maybe it is a combo of things? Looking for everything I can check and eliminate. What is the best kit? I have Orilleys, Auto Zone and Napa locally and of course the internet. Carb adjusting, Timing, transmission kick down adjustment, choke adjustment. Overall there is a lot of wires and hoses (smog) I’m guessing to wade through just to get to the engine and I’m guessing that all this smog has got to be working correct to get the best tune I can. Also I tried to follow the instructions to post an intro of me and the truck. I’m not sure if this is the correct spot. I tried following my initial set of instructions from my email I received from registering and links to get info about me sent so an administrator could evaluate and give me final clearance and access but it was not obvious to me what, where and how to do it. It appears that this forum is designed for a computer and all I have is an iphone. Any help with navigating and posting would be appreciated. Right up front I am a computer/Tech dummy, which makes my objective of having access to all the knowledge and help offered here almost out of reach. Thank you in advance Ed from north east California near Nevada and Oregon boarders where the pavement ends and the west is still wild. I know doesn’t fit the typical image of what people think of California. I live where the Sierra’s end and the Cascade’s begin on the east side of the mountains in the high desert right where the pine trees end and all the farm land for raising hay and ranching begins. I can leave my back yard and for the most part make to Idaho through Nevada or into east Oregon without getting on any pavement (almost) so I need to get this 84 in tip top shape. Thank you again Ed