Quick Block Plate Question

[85pig]

Was set on rebuilding a 300 for my 85, but am now leaning hard towards a 351W swap. I'm completely familiar with the "what transmissions will work with what engine" thing, but want to verify that the 300 block plate is the same as the SBF. Just want to make sure I don't have any starter orientation issues.

[Gary Lewis]

They are not the same. Go to Documentation/Driveline/Engine Plates and you'll see the part numbers for both the manual and auto transmission plates and in both cases the 300 takes a different plate than do the Windsors.

 

[85pig]

They are not the same. Go to Documentation/Driveline/Engine Plates and you'll see the part numbers for both the manual and auto transmission plates and in both cases the 300 takes a different plate than do the Windsors.

Sure enough, dang it. Looks like I'll be hunting a manual SBF plate. Thanks, Gary - and excellent resource. I've perused quite a bit from your "Documentation" area, but missed the block plates. And now I know.

Looks like NPD carries them new - with poor reviews.

[Gary Lewis]

Sure enough, dang it. Looks like I'll be hunting a manual SBF plate. Thanks, Gary - and excellent resource. I've perused quite a bit from your "Documentation" area, but missed the block plates. And now I know.

Looks like NPD carries them new - with poor reviews.

I missed the block plates as well. Couldn't find them. So I Googled "garysgaragemahal engine plate" and found them - in Driveline. Well, that sorta makes sense as they go between the engine and the transmission. But I was looking in Engine.

So this evening while watching Bedlam football I'll add an entry in the Engine menu to go to that page.

[Rembrant]

They are not the same. Go to Documentation/Driveline/Engine Plates and you'll see the part numbers for both the manual and auto transmission plates and in both cases the 300 takes a different plate than do the Windsors.

They may haver different part numbers, but they should all be interchangeable. I've had about a dozen of these block plates over the years from pulling engines apart and buying spare parts, and I have honestly never come across any two plates that were the same...but they were all still interchangeable. Some of them are solid, some have holes stamped in them, some of them have patterns stamped in them, but at the end of the day, the SBF pattern is same across those engines, and the starters are all in the same position when the flywheels are the same (as in all 164 tooth flywheels, not that they're all balanced the same).

The only time the SBF starter changes position is between the 157 tooth flywheels and the 164 tooth flywheels, which I used to understand as a car vs truck application thing, but somebody told me a while back that this reference is not correct and that some cars do indeed have the 164 tooth flywheels.

Every once in a while this issue pops up when somebody swaps a car engine into a truck, and they don't realize that the flywheel is incorrect until they hit the starter and it whirrs away not making contact with the flywheel LOL. That's gotta be a depressing sound.

[Gary Lewis]

They are not the same. Go to Documentation/Driveline/Engine Plates and you'll see the part numbers for both the manual and auto transmission plates and in both cases the 300 takes a different plate than do the Windsors.

They may haver different part numbers, but they should all be interchangeable. I've had about a dozen of these block plates over the years from pulling engines apart and buying spare parts, and I have honestly never come across any two plates that were the same...but they were all still interchangeable. Some of them are solid, some have holes stamped in them, some of them have patterns stamped in them, but at the end of the day, the SBF pattern is same across those engines, and the starters are all in the same position when the flywheels are the same (as in all 164 tooth flywheels, not that they're all balanced the same).

The only time the SBF starter changes position is between the 157 tooth flywheels and the 164 tooth flywheels, which I used to understand as a car vs truck application thing, but somebody told me a while back that this reference is not correct and that some cars do indeed have the 164 tooth flywheels.

Every once in a while this issue pops up when somebody swaps a car engine into a truck, and they don't realize that the flywheel is incorrect until they hit the starter and it whirrs away not making contact with the flywheel LOL. That's gotta be a depressing sound.

Cory - So they'll swap auto/manual and 300/Windsor?

[Rembrant]

Cory - So they'll swap auto/manual and 300/Windsor?

Not auto to manual, no, I just mean if all you're doing is swapping SBF pattern engines (300, 302, 351w), and using the same transmission, then the block plates are interchangeable, assuming you also use the correct size flywheel in the swap.

You just need to make sure you buy a truck flywheel (164 tooth), which should be all that is available for the 300, but the 302 and 351 were also in cars, so they can have smaller flywheels.

 

[Rembrant]

Cory - So they'll swap auto/manual and 300/Windsor?

Not auto to manual, no, I just mean if all you're doing is swapping SBF pattern engines (300, 302, 351w), and using the same transmission, then the block plates are interchangeable, assuming you also use the correct size flywheel in the swap.

You just need to make sure you buy a truck flywheel (164 tooth), which should be all that is available for the 300, but the 302 and 351 were also in cars, so they can have smaller flywheels.

Here's a block/starter plate that will work with both size flywheels:

https://www.summitracing.com/parts/sum-700600/make/ford

If you installed it in a Foxbody Mustang with a 5.0, you'd use the 157 tooth starter position. If you installed it in a truck with the larger 164 tooth flywheel, you'd use the outer starter position.

[Gary Lewis]

Here's a block/starter plate that will work with both size flywheels:

https://www.summitracing.com/parts/sum-700600/make/ford

If you installed it in a Foxbody Mustang with a 5.0, you'd use the 157 tooth starter position. If you installed it in a truck with the larger 164 tooth flywheel, you'd use the outer starter position.

Thanks!