Gary Lewis Posted November 16, 2020 Share Posted November 16, 2020 Tore her down tonight (pulley supposed to come in today, but no mail truck yet :( ). Wrong shim type indeed. It is like the FS10 in that they go on the threaded end of the shaft. I do have a junk FS-10 (off my ranger, bad shaft seal/shaft) that I can cannibalize for shims if needed. Root cause is degraded rubber in the clutch disc. It's made like a harmonic balancer. The rubber rotted, and the disc drifted towards the pulley until it rubbed when not engaged. Was some grease behind the clutch on the shaft. Not PAG or mineral oil at least... hoping I don't have a trashed shaft seal. That's been the bane of my existence on FS10's; the sealing area of the shafts gall up and eat the shaft seals. Both of my 1995 rangers lost their A/C over that issue (and didn't hold a charge until given new compressors). You are making good progress. But I hate to see that the FS10's have a problem - I just moved to an FS10. Anyway, keep on keeping on! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ratdude747 Posted November 17, 2020 Author Share Posted November 17, 2020 You are making good progress. But I hate to see that the FS10's have a problem - I just moved to an FS10. Anyway, keep on keeping on! Dunno if it's a 1995 specific problem... and this was after 20+ years mind you (the second ranger lost it's charge a year or so after I bought it, spring of 2018 or so I think?). Don't know if the second compressor (the one I still have) has a galled shaft... but with a bad shaft seal (felt dust cover soaked in PAG oil), and having had the previous ranger eat a shaft seal kit for lunch, I didn't take any chances and and replaced the compressor on sight (new Denso from rockauto, who is/was the OEM). $100 is cheap insurance. Kept the old one (no core return on a new compressor) for the clutch parts and shim. --- Anyway, I got the pulley in (mailman running a late shift as usual). Got her installed... Had to remove 0.090" of the existing 0.150" of shim to get the gap in spec. It's a bit narrow (0.20-0.25"), but I'll happily take that over wide open any day. The shims are 1/2" OD, 5/16" ID ring shims. I had two 0.60" shims and a 0.30" shim in my compressor originally. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
86 12 Brutus Posted November 17, 2020 Share Posted November 17, 2020 Dunno if it's a 1995 specific problem... and this was after 20+ years mind you (the second ranger lost it's charge a year or so after I bought it, spring of 2018 or so I think?). Don't know if the second compressor (the one I still have) has a galled shaft... but with a bad shaft seal (felt dust cover soaked in PAG oil), and having had the previous ranger eat a shaft seal kit for lunch, I didn't take any chances and and replaced the compressor on sight (new Denso from rockauto, who is/was the OEM). $100 is cheap insurance. Kept the old one (no core return on a new compressor) for the clutch parts and shim. --- Anyway, I got the pulley in (mailman running a late shift as usual). Got her installed... Had to remove 0.090" of the existing 0.150" of shim to get the gap in spec. It's a bit narrow (0.20-0.25"), but I'll happily take that over wide open any day. The shims are 1/2" OD, 5/16" ID ring shims. I had two 0.60" shims and a 0.30" shim in my compressor originally. Gary: Do you have your FS10 in use yet? If so how does it compare to the FS6? just out of curiosity. I have a FS10 in my Crown vic, owned it since new. The AC works very well, but is slow, very slow to get cold. the new system i put in Brutus, FS6, at least in my situation performs leaps and bounds better then the vic's FS10. Very quick to cool down and am using just the mechanical clutch fan in brutus. The crown vic has a clutch fan and electric fan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ratdude747 Posted November 17, 2020 Author Share Posted November 17, 2020 Gary: Do you have your FS10 in use yet? If so how does it compare to the FS6? just out of curiosity. I have a FS10 in my Crown vic, owned it since new. The AC works very well, but is slow, very slow to get cold. the new system i put in Brutus, FS6, at least in my situation performs leaps and bounds better then the vic's FS10. Very quick to cool down and am using just the mechanical clutch fan in brutus. The crown vic has a clutch fan and electric fan I'm not Gary, but at least in my ranger, the A/C can be fast to cold, but can be slow on occasion. No better/worse than the F150's FS6 IMHO. The ranger has the stock mechanical clutch fan. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gary Lewis Posted November 17, 2020 Share Posted November 17, 2020 I'm not Gary, but at least in my ranger, the A/C can be fast to cold, but can be slow on occasion. No better/worse than the F150's FS6 IMHO. The ranger has the stock mechanical clutch fan. George - No, I don't have the FS10 in service yet. The FS6 was marginal, so I'm hoping for a significant improvement. But, I did fully insulate and seal the underhood box, so that should help. If you want to talk about A/C systems then Bill/85lebaront2 is the guy. He converted Darth from FS6 to FS10. Ratdude - Good you got the gap you were looking for. You are on a roll! Well done. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
86 12 Brutus Posted November 17, 2020 Share Posted November 17, 2020 George - No, I don't have the FS10 in service yet. The FS6 was marginal, so I'm hoping for a significant improvement. But, I did fully insulate and seal the underhood box, so that should help. If you want to talk about A/C systems then Bill/85lebaront2 is the guy. He converted Darth from FS6 to FS10. Ratdude - Good you got the gap you were looking for. You are on a roll! Well done. Gary, i am just curious is all. All the stuff in Brutus is brand new and have no plans on swapping anything out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
85lebaront2 Posted November 17, 2020 Share Posted November 17, 2020 George - No, I don't have the FS10 in service yet. The FS6 was marginal, so I'm hoping for a significant improvement. But, I did fully insulate and seal the underhood box, so that should help. If you want to talk about A/C systems then Bill/85lebaront2 is the guy. He converted Darth from FS6 to FS10. Ratdude - Good you got the gap you were looking for. You are on a roll! Well done. Gary, the primary reason for the compressor change was the EFI system and polygroove belts. The compressor mount changed from axial (FS6) to tangent (FS10). That and the different refrigerant lines for the FS10 when I scored a complete 1996 system from an F150 (including the FS10) required the update. I had previously converted the original system to R134a and had no problem other than it took a while to pull the temperature down after a hot soak and restart. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
86 12 Brutus Posted November 18, 2020 Share Posted November 18, 2020 Gary, the primary reason for the compressor change was the EFI system and polygroove belts. The compressor mount changed from axial (FS6) to tangent (FS10). That and the different refrigerant lines for the FS10 when I scored a complete 1996 system from an F150 (including the FS10) required the update. I had previously converted the original system to R134a and had no problem other than it took a while to pull the temperature down after a hot soak and restart. Bill, I remember talking to you about your ac system when i was putting the new ac in the truck. So i really am curious here, now that i know that you did have a functioning fs6 converted. Other then the slow cool down, did you notice anything different between the 6 and the 10, the only reason i'm asking is really for curiosity sake. I have done r134a retrofits and have done very extensive research into it. What i find right now, at least in my situation. My crown vic has the fs10 compressor, i've owned it since new takes much longer to get cold then the fs6 based system i have in the truck. Now i'm not really sure about this or not, but the oil i used in the fs6 system had ice32 in it. The fs6 system in the truck works almost good as r12 did. It gets ice cold just sitting there idling. The crown vic at idle, the ac is just a bit cold and dosent get cold until the car starts to move. which has me wondering if ice32 is whats making the truck so cold. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
85lebaront2 Posted November 18, 2020 Share Posted November 18, 2020 Bill, I remember talking to you about your ac system when i was putting the new ac in the truck. So i really am curious here, now that i know that you did have a functioning fs6 converted. Other then the slow cool down, did you notice anything different between the 6 and the 10, the only reason i'm asking is really for curiosity sake. I have done r134a retrofits and have done very extensive research into it. What i find right now, at least in my situation. My crown vic has the fs10 compressor, i've owned it since new takes much longer to get cold then the fs6 based system i have in the truck. Now i'm not really sure about this or not, but the oil i used in the fs6 system had ice32 in it. The fs6 system in the truck works almost good as r12 did. It gets ice cold just sitting there idling. The crown vic at idle, the ac is just a bit cold and dosent get cold until the car starts to move. which has me wondering if ice32 is whats making the truck so cold. Damn system just dumped everything I had written. When I converted Darth I had the entire 1994-96/7 system, new multipass condenser, larger evaporator core and the 1996 inside ducts with the blend door that actually closes off the heat in full cold. The evaporator case has the insulator pad on it too. On your CV, does it have just the engine fan, or the auxiliary or even the huge electric one? Try, if you have one, putting a decent size electric (house fan) in front of the CV and see if it cools better, check the pressures when it is running. Keep in mind, I have twice the cab size (crew cab) and a 460 underhood so (a) more area to cool (b) more underhood heat with less area for it to get out through. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
86 12 Brutus Posted November 18, 2020 Share Posted November 18, 2020 Damn system just dumped everything I had written. When I converted Darth I had the entire 1994-96/7 system, new multipass condenser, larger evaporator core and the 1996 inside ducts with the blend door that actually closes off the heat in full cold. The evaporator case has the insulator pad on it too. On your CV, does it have just the engine fan, or the auxiliary or even the huge electric one? Try, if you have one, putting a decent size electric (house fan) in front of the CV and see if it cools better, check the pressures when it is running. Keep in mind, I have twice the cab size (crew cab) and a 460 underhood so (a) more area to cool (b) more underhood heat with less area for it to get out through. The crown vic has both the clutch fan and the huge electric fan. when you start the car and put the ac on, the electric fan starts up. This was one of the reasons i started a thread about electric condenser fans. I wanted to put one in the front of the condenser on the truck, but after installing the system, i feel there is no need for one, let alone the room. although i would like to put one, there is just no room. Also on the crown vic, the computer has some to do with the ac, ie: if you accelerate hard, the computer shuts the compressor off until the car gets back into overdrive Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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