Fuel Injection upgrade

[Gary Lewis]

Looking at your photos of your build I dont know if I can make it work with the valve covers I have and where the breathers are placed.

This is the photo from your build that has me thinking this right now.

And the valve covers that I have for clearing my Scorpion roller rockers.

And a couple photos with the valve covers installed with pcv and with breather. It appears the snorkel would be sitting right where the breather/pcv would have to go. Would have to rotate the aircleaner some to off set the passenger side snorkel then mount the driver side a bit further back to balance the angle out I think. Or relocate both snorkels.

Basically none of Ford's dual snorkel air cleaners were balanced, meaning had both snorkels coming off at the same angle left vs right. But my cleaner cleared the valve covers for my Scorpion rockers on Dad's engine. So I think you can get it done. Mock it up and play with it some. I really think it'll work.

And save for the piece that goes directly to the radiator support, all of the Ford cold air pieces work on the driver's side. However the one that goes to the radiator support is going to take some surgery.

Also, since you have EFI and don't need heated air, you can cut the fitting for heated air off each snorkel and that gives you a bit more clearance.

[Rusty_S85]

Basically none of Ford's dual snorkel air cleaners were balanced, meaning had both snorkels coming off at the same angle left vs right. But my cleaner cleared the valve covers for my Scorpion rockers on Dad's engine. So I think you can get it done. Mock it up and play with it some. I really think it'll work.

And save for the piece that goes directly to the radiator support, all of the Ford cold air pieces work on the driver's side. However the one that goes to the radiator support is going to take some surgery.

Also, since you have EFI and don't need heated air, you can cut the fitting for heated air off each snorkel and that gives you a bit more clearance.

I noticed that after I made the post as I was doing a bunch of reading.

I also came across a listing on ebay for an insanely priced 5.8L HO aircleaner more money than I want to spend but I can see just how offset they had the snorkel.

And I did this quick overlay of the aircleaner to verify what I was seeing, looks to be quite a offset on the driverside snorkel. Looks like its moved over enough to allow access to the breather cap.

I know with the location of the breather filter on the back of the aircleaner tells me with this aircleaner the breather was in the back and pcv in the front like my '78 Mercury. I dont want to do that how ever as the IAC on the sniper stealth 4150 is in the front and running pcv off the front manifold vacuum port actually will over time gum up the IAC. I had planned on running this on the rear. So what I will have to do is drill a hole to locate the breather filter in a position to use a driverside front breather cap.

I might have to rethink my breather cap though.

This is a oil separator breather, I got this as Ive had problems with my stock 302 seeping oil out of my OE twist in cap with OE valve covers, so I figured this with the oil separator baffling along with the baffling in the valve cover itself should stop any oil leakage. I also got it with the 45 degree angled nipple as my idea with the OE single snorkel aircleaner I have a NOS snap in elbow for the pcv filter and was going to run a short length of hose and have it snap in.

But with a dual snorkel setup this would result in a problem as the snorkel is right where the filter should go. I could put the filter on the back side of the snorkel but this would present a problem of having to have the hose run a long ways and this hose is not exactly a soft flexible hose. I think my only option would be to put the filter in the front but then that poses a problem as Id have to loop the hose. I think what my first course needs to be is to either locate a reasonably priced dual snorkel or source a single snorkel and use my stock engine still in the truck to space out where I need the driver side located at. Then once I get the snorkel mounted right then when I assemble my engine I can play with the breather and routing on the engine stand as the snorkel itself would have already been set for the truck and how the A/C is laid out.

For the duct work itself I plan to use the replacement style duct but I do have a duplicate passengerside duct and I would do like was shown over on FTE and cut the duct and flip it around so it will mount properly on the driverside. After doing that I can blend it in and use some of that Eastwood plastic resurfacer to make both ducts look like fresh black plastic.

On the heated air aspect. I thought about possibly doing like you did and just have one side active, not really for the maintaining ambient air temp but more so to stop icing, I know carbs can ice when cold and humid and I know TBI`s can as well and here in Texas near the coast it is like 80% humidity nearly year round. But I also thought about at least hooking it all up because I do have the duct work to clamp to the header tubes but I could always plug the vacuum hose with a BB before installing it on the vacuum motor to make them non functional.

[Gary Lewis]

I noticed that after I made the post as I was doing a bunch of reading.

I also came across a listing on ebay for an insanely priced 5.8L HO aircleaner more money than I want to spend but I can see just how offset they had the snorkel.

And I did this quick overlay of the aircleaner to verify what I was seeing, looks to be quite a offset on the driverside snorkel. Looks like its moved over enough to allow access to the breather cap.

I know with the location of the breather filter on the back of the aircleaner tells me with this aircleaner the breather was in the back and pcv in the front like my '78 Mercury. I dont want to do that how ever as the IAC on the sniper stealth 4150 is in the front and running pcv off the front manifold vacuum port actually will over time gum up the IAC. I had planned on running this on the rear. So what I will have to do is drill a hole to locate the breather filter in a position to use a driverside front breather cap.

I might have to rethink my breather cap though.

This is a oil separator breather, I got this as Ive had problems with my stock 302 seeping oil out of my OE twist in cap with OE valve covers, so I figured this with the oil separator baffling along with the baffling in the valve cover itself should stop any oil leakage. I also got it with the 45 degree angled nipple as my idea with the OE single snorkel aircleaner I have a NOS snap in elbow for the pcv filter and was going to run a short length of hose and have it snap in.

But with a dual snorkel setup this would result in a problem as the snorkel is right where the filter should go. I could put the filter on the back side of the snorkel but this would present a problem of having to have the hose run a long ways and this hose is not exactly a soft flexible hose. I think my only option would be to put the filter in the front but then that poses a problem as Id have to loop the hose. I think what my first course needs to be is to either locate a reasonably priced dual snorkel or source a single snorkel and use my stock engine still in the truck to space out where I need the driver side located at. Then once I get the snorkel mounted right then when I assemble my engine I can play with the breather and routing on the engine stand as the snorkel itself would have already been set for the truck and how the A/C is laid out.

For the duct work itself I plan to use the replacement style duct but I do have a duplicate passengerside duct and I would do like was shown over on FTE and cut the duct and flip it around so it will mount properly on the driverside. After doing that I can blend it in and use some of that Eastwood plastic resurfacer to make both ducts look like fresh black plastic.

On the heated air aspect. I thought about possibly doing like you did and just have one side active, not really for the maintaining ambient air temp but more so to stop icing, I know carbs can ice when cold and humid and I know TBI`s can as well and here in Texas near the coast it is like 80% humidity nearly year round. But I also thought about at least hooking it all up because I do have the duct work to clamp to the header tubes but I could always plug the vacuum hose with a BB before installing it on the vacuum motor to make them non functional.

I think your plan to get the engine together and put a single-snorkel HO air cleaner on and figure out where to attach the second one is the best approach. And you may find you need a different breather. But with the right droop to the snorkel you may not have a problem.

On the heated air, yes it is possible to have icing. I remember a few times in the six years we lived in Katy where it got cold and was humid. But usually the cold comes after a front passes through and pushes the humidity out in the Gulf.

I think I'd try it w/o the hot air ducting. You can always add it if needed.

[85lebaront2]

I noticed that after I made the post as I was doing a bunch of reading.

I also came across a listing on ebay for an insanely priced 5.8L HO aircleaner more money than I want to spend but I can see just how offset they had the snorkel.

And I did this quick overlay of the aircleaner to verify what I was seeing, looks to be quite a offset on the driverside snorkel. Looks like its moved over enough to allow access to the breather cap.

I know with the location of the breather filter on the back of the aircleaner tells me with this aircleaner the breather was in the back and pcv in the front like my '78 Mercury. I dont want to do that how ever as the IAC on the sniper stealth 4150 is in the front and running pcv off the front manifold vacuum port actually will over time gum up the IAC. I had planned on running this on the rear. So what I will have to do is drill a hole to locate the breather filter in a position to use a driverside front breather cap.

I might have to rethink my breather cap though.

This is a oil separator breather, I got this as Ive had problems with my stock 302 seeping oil out of my OE twist in cap with OE valve covers, so I figured this with the oil separator baffling along with the baffling in the valve cover itself should stop any oil leakage. I also got it with the 45 degree angled nipple as my idea with the OE single snorkel aircleaner I have a NOS snap in elbow for the pcv filter and was going to run a short length of hose and have it snap in.

But with a dual snorkel setup this would result in a problem as the snorkel is right where the filter should go. I could put the filter on the back side of the snorkel but this would present a problem of having to have the hose run a long ways and this hose is not exactly a soft flexible hose. I think my only option would be to put the filter in the front but then that poses a problem as Id have to loop the hose. I think what my first course needs to be is to either locate a reasonably priced dual snorkel or source a single snorkel and use my stock engine still in the truck to space out where I need the driver side located at. Then once I get the snorkel mounted right then when I assemble my engine I can play with the breather and routing on the engine stand as the snorkel itself would have already been set for the truck and how the A/C is laid out.

For the duct work itself I plan to use the replacement style duct but I do have a duplicate passengerside duct and I would do like was shown over on FTE and cut the duct and flip it around so it will mount properly on the driverside. After doing that I can blend it in and use some of that Eastwood plastic resurfacer to make both ducts look like fresh black plastic.

On the heated air aspect. I thought about possibly doing like you did and just have one side active, not really for the maintaining ambient air temp but more so to stop icing, I know carbs can ice when cold and humid and I know TBI`s can as well and here in Texas near the coast it is like 80% humidity nearly year round. But I also thought about at least hooking it all up because I do have the duct work to clamp to the header tubes but I could always plug the vacuum hose with a BB before installing it on the vacuum motor to make them non functional.

I like the oil separating breather cap, looks suspiciously like something off a Mopar engine. Ford had a similar design back in the 60s & 70s, but the PCV valve or closure hose went in the top of it.

[Rusty_S85]

I think your plan to get the engine together and put a single-snorkel HO air cleaner on and figure out where to attach the second one is the best approach. And you may find you need a different breather. But with the right droop to the snorkel you may not have a problem.

On the heated air, yes it is possible to have icing. I remember a few times in the six years we lived in Katy where it got cold and was humid. But usually the cold comes after a front passes through and pushes the humidity out in the Gulf.

I think I'd try it w/o the hot air ducting. You can always add it if needed.

Thankfully I havent taken my stock engine out just yet. So I can use my stock engine to figure where the snorkel will fit best and mark it out.

Then since I am running an aftermarket intake with a 1" phenolic spacer with a 1/8" heat insulating gasket I will do my final mock up on the built engine to make sure it will clear the valve covers I will be using.

There are other breathers out there I was looking at but this was the only one in the right size for my valve covers that had a crimped in nipple for a hose to be attached to. The others had a rubber grommet that a hose connector slipped into and lots of reviews talked about how it doesnt stay in place. I will try my best to make what I have work before I bin it and come up with something else. If need be ill get just a plain old breather with the rubber grommet that holds the hose connect in and take and weld it up then have it coated. Really would like to maintain the chrome breather how ever to complement the polished stainless steel bolts I picked up from ARP for my valve covers. I always did like the polished stainless bolts on my OE ford blue valve covers.

I probably will try it without and if it seems to work fine I might take and do like you were saying and just cut off the attachment point on the underside and just plate it in. Might even just out right remove the vacuum motors as well and plate it in on top as well.

[Rusty_S85]

I like the oil separating breather cap, looks suspiciously like something off a Mopar engine. Ford had a similar design back in the 60s & 70s, but the PCV valve or closure hose went in the top of it.

Moroso might have got the idea from them for the design. I went to summit punched in the nipple size for the valve covers to only view what will fit my aftermarket valve covers then I punched in the size of the barb for the breather hose to the aircleaner based off the OE 90* snap in elbow on the aircleaner and this was one of a handfull of hits I got. most of the other hits didnt have the nipple actually attached to the breather but was held in by a grommet.

Ive seen too many bad reviews of those about the nipple falling out and we had one at work we had that was similar and it kept falling out as well. Not sure if its because they use a straight smooth tube with no kind of flare to help hold it in or what. But the attachment is what sold me on this one and the fact that it is an oil separator breather it tells me it should help solve problems of oil mist and oil getting up into the breather element in the air cleaner.

[Rusty_S85]

Looking at your photos of your build I dont know if I can make it work with the valve covers I have and where the breathers are placed.

This is the photo from your build that has me thinking this right now.

And the valve covers that I have for clearing my Scorpion roller rockers.

And a couple photos with the valve covers installed with pcv and with breather. It appears the snorkel would be sitting right where the breather/pcv would have to go. Would have to rotate the aircleaner some to off set the passenger side snorkel then mount the driver side a bit further back to balance the angle out I think. Or relocate both snorkels.

Ok aside from the air cleaner aspect I got two new areas that I may or may not make a change.

I already mentioned finding a 3/8" hardline stainless steel fuel supply line that I could cut up to mount on my truck and use it for routing my fuel along the frame the factory route and using the vapor guard fuel hose to make connections from fuel tank to fuel filter/regulator and between hardlines.

Well this would require I buy extra fittings. Either buy three -6 male to male adapters to connect the female end of a AN flared hardline to the female barbed hose end. Well I looked and found that Earls make a black Vaporguard hose end with a -6 male threaded end for $7.55. So I could just buy three of theses and use them to make my connections at the hardline on the frame and the engine. But it also requires I invest in the eastwood AN flare tool to make the flares. I also will have to invest in AN tube nuts as well. Really not sure if I want to go this route. I think it would look cool having the metal hardline instead of all this rubber hose and I can make it look legit like a carb setup. Would also save me from having to buy the 25ft roll of hose as the little hose I will need I should be able to get by with the $50 10ft roll.

740166ERL - Earls Performance Vapor Guard Hose End - 3/8" hosebarb to -6AN male thread x3

SS581806ERL - Earls Performance Tube Nuts SS - -6AN pair x3 to x4

SS581906ERL - Earls Performance Tube Sleeve SS - -6AN pair x3 to x4 (questionable)

The stainless steel tube nuts I am not sure about, I like to keep like metals when it comes to stuff like this where possible. I do not know if I want to try and attempt to have stainless steel coiled tubing to make up the hardline on my engine itself. I feel that might be a pita to try and shape properly. But if I do decide on stainless then it would mean I would have to get 3 pairs for the engine alone, a pair at the front and rear TBI, a pair for the two TBI feed lines at the Tee, and a pair for the hardline from tee down to mechanical fuel pump location to make my hose connection.

There is also another problem. I dont see no mention of the tube nuts coming with the tube sleeve that you have to have with 37* AN flares. If the tube nuts do not come with the tube sleeves then I may just scrap this whole fancy idea and just run a vapor guard hose down the frame to the transmission and up the bell housing to the TBI. Cause the SS tubing nuts are $11.42 a pair and the tubing sleeves are $10.27 a pair. So for 3 of each would set me back some $65.07 which would negate the $50 I save by going with hardline over 25ft of hose.

I really need to verify if these tube nuts come with the sleeves cause if they do come with the sleeves like traditional tube nuts then im looking at less than $40 for these fittings not including the $100 for the AN flare turret adapter for my flare tool.

On a side note I also got in the mail my newer gas pedal that I will be trying to take measurements of this weekend to compare to my OE pedal and see if it really does have more pull for the cable or not.

[Rusty_S85]

Ok aside from the air cleaner aspect I got two new areas that I may or may not make a change.

I already mentioned finding a 3/8" hardline stainless steel fuel supply line that I could cut up to mount on my truck and use it for routing my fuel along the frame the factory route and using the vapor guard fuel hose to make connections from fuel tank to fuel filter/regulator and between hardlines.

Well this would require I buy extra fittings. Either buy three -6 male to male adapters to connect the female end of a AN flared hardline to the female barbed hose end. Well I looked and found that Earls make a black Vaporguard hose end with a -6 male threaded end for $7.55. So I could just buy three of theses and use them to make my connections at the hardline on the frame and the engine. But it also requires I invest in the eastwood AN flare tool to make the flares. I also will have to invest in AN tube nuts as well. Really not sure if I want to go this route. I think it would look cool having the metal hardline instead of all this rubber hose and I can make it look legit like a carb setup. Would also save me from having to buy the 25ft roll of hose as the little hose I will need I should be able to get by with the $50 10ft roll.

740166ERL - Earls Performance Vapor Guard Hose End - 3/8" hosebarb to -6AN male thread x3

SS581806ERL - Earls Performance Tube Nuts SS - -6AN pair x3 to x4

SS581906ERL - Earls Performance Tube Sleeve SS - -6AN pair x3 to x4 (questionable)

The stainless steel tube nuts I am not sure about, I like to keep like metals when it comes to stuff like this where possible. I do not know if I want to try and attempt to have stainless steel coiled tubing to make up the hardline on my engine itself. I feel that might be a pita to try and shape properly. But if I do decide on stainless then it would mean I would have to get 3 pairs for the engine alone, a pair at the front and rear TBI, a pair for the two TBI feed lines at the Tee, and a pair for the hardline from tee down to mechanical fuel pump location to make my hose connection.

There is also another problem. I dont see no mention of the tube nuts coming with the tube sleeve that you have to have with 37* AN flares. If the tube nuts do not come with the tube sleeves then I may just scrap this whole fancy idea and just run a vapor guard hose down the frame to the transmission and up the bell housing to the TBI. Cause the SS tubing nuts are $11.42 a pair and the tubing sleeves are $10.27 a pair. So for 3 of each would set me back some $65.07 which would negate the $50 I save by going with hardline over 25ft of hose.

I really need to verify if these tube nuts come with the sleeves cause if they do come with the sleeves like traditional tube nuts then im looking at less than $40 for these fittings not including the $100 for the AN flare turret adapter for my flare tool.

On a side note I also got in the mail my newer gas pedal that I will be trying to take measurements of this weekend to compare to my OE pedal and see if it really does have more pull for the cable or not.

Might have found a aircleaner to modify from a single snorkel to a dual snorkel.

First one I came across that isnt too crazy on the price is a used aircleaner from a 1985 F150 5.0L with AC. it is quite dirty but it appears it may be a HO style steel base.

Second one I came across that might work is a 5.0L EFI aircleaner that came off a '83 foxbody Cougar. It looks similar to the truck units but there is only one photo.

Third one I found that is a bit on the pricy side being closer to $200 but it is quite clean its a 5.0L EFI aircleaner with decals and its listed as for a '85 Ford/Lincoln/Mercury with it working great on foxbody mustangs. To me this looks kinda like the '85 Mustang single snorkel unit. Not sure how good of a base this would be for modifying and maybe it might be fine to just leave it the way it is considering its a legit aircleaner for a earlier EFI setup. But for some reason I dont think it is cause I dont remember Foxbody mustangs having a TBI like EFI reusing the carb style aircleaner. Going to have to message the individual and see if they can give me the measurement of the opening on the aircleaner as part of me is a little worried it may be just like the aircleaner I already have that has the 1/8" larger opening. But I have a sneaking suspicion that this aircleaner is just like the one I currently have that doesnt fit based off the identical locating tab layout to the one I have. Doesnt have the locating tab positioning like the 5.8L HO dual snorkel setup posted above.

But if this one is legit I may very well just purchase this one and modify this one for a dual snorkel setup. The 5.0L EFI is quite clean and would go nicely with my EFI upgrade.

This is a photo of the unit in question. I wish I could make out what the sticker on the aircleaner says and I wished I would have noticed it before I messaged the owner about the diameter of the mounting neck.

[LARIAT 85]

Might have found a aircleaner to modify from a single snorkel to a dual snorkel.

First one I came across that isnt too crazy on the price is a used aircleaner from a 1985 F150 5.0L with AC. it is quite dirty but it appears it may be a HO style steel base.

Second one I came across that might work is a 5.0L EFI aircleaner that came off a '83 foxbody Cougar. It looks similar to the truck units but there is only one photo.

Third one I found that is a bit on the pricy side being closer to $200 but it is quite clean its a 5.0L EFI aircleaner with decals and its listed as for a '85 Ford/Lincoln/Mercury with it working great on foxbody mustangs. To me this looks kinda like the '85 Mustang single snorkel unit. Not sure how good of a base this would be for modifying and maybe it might be fine to just leave it the way it is considering its a legit aircleaner for a earlier EFI setup. But for some reason I dont think it is cause I dont remember Foxbody mustangs having a TBI like EFI reusing the carb style aircleaner.

The only Ford vehicle in the 1980s that got a dual snorkel air cleaner was the 1982 - 1985 Ford Mustang GT. The 1982 version was unique in that it was smaller because it was designed to fit over the Motorcraft 2150 the Mustang GT used that one year. The 2V carburetor was replaced by a 4V Carburetor in 1983, so they used a larger air cleaner that was the same size as the one used on the 460 engine.

The 1983 - 1985 Mustang GT dual snorkel air cleaner used the same size [metal] base as the 460 and 351 H.O. engines, but the air cleaners on those engines only had one snorkel.

Mustang GTs with a manual transmission used one version of the dual snorkel air cleaner, while the 1984 and 1985 models with an AOD transmission used another. Why? Because the manual transmission model used a Motorcraft 4180 carbureted setup, while the automatic (AOD) model used throttle-body fuel injection. The air cleaner locating prongs are spaced further apart to fit over the throttle body. The sticker on the air cleaner lid reads "5.0 Liter E.F.I. H.O."

 

[Gary Lewis]

Might have found a aircleaner to modify from a single snorkel to a dual snorkel.

First one I came across that isnt too crazy on the price is a used aircleaner from a 1985 F150 5.0L with AC. it is quite dirty but it appears it may be a HO style steel base.

Second one I came across that might work is a 5.0L EFI aircleaner that came off a '83 foxbody Cougar. It looks similar to the truck units but there is only one photo.

Third one I found that is a bit on the pricy side being closer to $200 but it is quite clean its a 5.0L EFI aircleaner with decals and its listed as for a '85 Ford/Lincoln/Mercury with it working great on foxbody mustangs. To me this looks kinda like the '85 Mustang single snorkel unit. Not sure how good of a base this would be for modifying and maybe it might be fine to just leave it the way it is considering its a legit aircleaner for a earlier EFI setup. But for some reason I dont think it is cause I dont remember Foxbody mustangs having a TBI like EFI reusing the carb style aircleaner.

The only Ford vehicle in the 1980s that got a dual snorkel air cleaner was the 1982 - 1985 Ford Mustang GT. The 1982 version was unique in that it was smaller because it was designed to fit over the Motorcraft 2150 the Mustang GT used that one year. The 2V carburetor was replaced by a 4V Carburetor in 1983, so they used a larger air cleaner that was the same size as the one used on the 460 engine.

The 1983 - 1985 Mustang GT dual snorkel air cleaner used the same size [metal] base as the 460 and 351 H.O. engines, but the air cleaners on those engines only had one snorkel.

Mustang GTs with a manual transmission used one version of the dual snorkel air cleaner, while the 1984 and 1985 models with an AOD transmission used another. Why? Because the manual transmission model used a Motorcraft 4180 carbureted setup, while the automatic (AOD) model used throttle-body fuel injection. The air cleaner locating prongs are spaced further apart to fit over the throttle body. The sticker on the air cleaner lid reads "5.0 Liter E.F.I. H.O."

I knew Rick was the right one to answer that. Far better than I could have done.

I believe I have one of the Mustang dual snorkel cleaners. It may wind up on Big Blue as at first blush it is close to fitting.