ArdWrknTrk Posted November 9, 2019 Share Posted November 9, 2019 Im feeling very sarcastic right now..... Really? Glad you told me. I had one of those days yesterday. So I understand. I think a plastic tool box with a wooden divider will work. But the wood will eventually fail due to the gases, so maybe you could find piece of plastic to use? Cellular core PVC sheets (like Azek) are pretty cheap at home Depot. I think they call it Veranda. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ray Cecil Posted November 9, 2019 Author Share Posted November 9, 2019 Im feeling very sarcastic right now..... Really? Glad you told me. I had one of those days yesterday. So I understand. I think a plastic tool box with a wooden divider will work. But the wood will eventually fail due to the gases, so maybe you could find piece of plastic to use? I guess I could use plastic. Are the gases really so strong they'd eat a 5/8" piece of plywood? Anyway, I better get back to being with Holly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gary Lewis Posted November 9, 2019 Share Posted November 9, 2019 I guess I could use plastic. Are the gases really so strong they'd eat a 5/8" piece of plywood? Anyway, I better get back to being with Holly. Don't know how bad the gasses will be, but if it were me I'd use plastic since it should be easy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nothing Special Posted November 9, 2019 Share Posted November 9, 2019 I guess I could use plastic. Are the gases really so strong they'd eat a 5/8" piece of plywood? Anyway, I better get back to being with Holly. I'm going to throw another wrench in. Or maybe it's the same wrench again... Are you back to putting a winch on the trailer or are you still planning to mount it to the truck via the double receiver setup you pictured before? If you aren't putting the winch on the trailer (and maybe even if you are) I wouldn't put the battery there. The point of having the battery on the trailer in the first place was to avoid having to have high current passing from the truck (where the battery is) to the trailer (where the winch was going to be). But if the winch is not on the trailer, then what's the point of running big heavy wires from the truck to the trailer to charge the battery, and big heavy wires back from the trailer to the winch? Why not just keep all of the batteries and all of the big heavy wires on the truck? If the winch is going to be mounted on the trailer, if it were me I think I'd only put the battery there for one of two reasons. If the winch was going to be hard-mounted and hard-wired (no electrical quick-connects), or if I wanted to be able to use the winch when the trailer wasn't hooked to the truck(s) that was wired to run the winch. In either of those situations I'd at least strongly consider putting the battery on the trailer. But otherwise I'd run my quick-connect jumper back to the truck. The reason I'd do that is that I think you need even heavier wire to charge the battery than you do to run the winch. Sure the winch will draw more than the alternator will put out, so the ALTERNATOR won't send more current to charge the trailer battery than the winch will pull. But what happens when you don't have the trailer battery hooked to the truck battery and you run it low, then hook it up? The truck battery is going to do it's darnedest to get the trailer battery voltage to match its voltage. That can be a LOT of current. So with your plan (as I understand it) to temporarily mount the winch with a receiver mount, and to have an electrical quick-connect, I'd run big (~1 gauge) wires from the front of the truck to the back and put the quick-connect on the truck. If you want the extra peace-of-mind you could add an auxiliary battery on the truck, either in the back (where it would benefit the winch the most) or in the front where it would still work fine. And if you have an aux battery you could add even more peace-of-mind by putting a fancy battery isolator on it to prevent running the main battery down. But I really don't think any of that is necessary, and unless you are careless and use the winch too long without the engine running I don't think you'll have any trouble with a single battery. Keep in mind, this winch isn't much bigger than the ones they mount on ATVs, and they don't have nearly the battery or alternator your truck has. Having just argued for a cheaper, simpler system, now I'll give you an opportunity to spend more money:nabble_smiley_beam: On my Bronco I put an isolator relay between the battery and the big heavy wires that go to the quick-connects at both ends of the vehicle. That way I normally don't have those wires hot. I don't know how big a deal that is, but I kind of liked the idea of not having a hot wire that would likely start a fire if it shorted out. Sure, if it does short out it'll still be pretty exciting when I turn the relay on! But at least I'm not driving down the freeway at 65 mph when that happens. Just another scope-creep feature to consider! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Danny G Posted November 11, 2019 Share Posted November 11, 2019 I can't really say. Depends on how much charging is done. Electrolysis splits the sulfuric acid electrolyte creating *mostly* hydrogen, and some H2S. Maybe this is a good application for an alternative battery chemistry? How would a NIMH or LiPo battery fare? Because AFAIK neither of those off gas while charging, and if they do, it must be far less corrosive than a lead acid battery. From what I understand there should be no H2S unless seriously over charging the battery, like thermal runaway type temperatures in modern maintenance free batteries, nor would you want it to be anything less as H2S is poisonous and flammable. Without Sulfur or H2S already present individually in the mix, I would think you need to split the sulfate ion into sulfite and sulfur to even start H2S generation which should take decent amount of energy. In the battery lead is oxidized by the sulfuric acid (electrolyte) and forms Lead Sulfate releasing hydrogen ion and causing charge to flow. Oxidation reac: Pb(anode) + SO4 2- > PbSO4 + 2e- Redux reac: PbO2(cathode) + SO4 2- + 4H+ + 2e - > PbSO4 + 2H2O No H2S is inherent to that reaction, but even if it was present I think it doesn't really pose a threat to a raw aluminum battery box. H2S has strong hydrogen bonds, for H2S to react with Aluminum you need an enthalpy change, like serious heat present, like 1000-2000 degrees type heat to generate enough energy to smash H2S apart against aluminum forming aluminum sulfide (decomposes in water) and hydrogen gas. So at normal temps H2S (if actually present) presents no detriment to aluminum. As far as lithium cells, its a salt battery, the only gas present should be oxygen and carbon dioxide. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ArdWrknTrk Posted November 11, 2019 Share Posted November 11, 2019 I can't really say. Depends on how much charging is done. Electrolysis splits the sulfuric acid electrolyte creating *mostly* hydrogen, and some H2S. Maybe this is a good application for an alternative battery chemistry? How would a NIMH or LiPo battery fare? Because AFAIK neither of those off gas while charging, and if they do, it must be far less corrosive than a lead acid battery. From what I understand there should be no H2S unless seriously over charging the battery, like thermal runaway type temperatures in modern maintenance free batteries, nor would you want it to be anything less as H2S is poisonous and flammable. Without Sulfur or H2S already present individually in the mix, I would think you need to split the sulfate ion into sulfite and sulfur to even start H2S generation which should take decent amount of energy. In the battery lead is oxidized by the sulfuric acid (electrolyte) and forms Lead Sulfate releasing hydrogen ion and causing charge to flow. Oxidation reac: Pb(anode) + SO4 2- > PbSO4 + 2e- Redux reac: PbO2(cathode) + SO4 2- + 4H+ + 2e - > PbSO4 + 2H2O No H2S is inherent to that reaction, but even if it was present I think it doesn't really pose a threat to a raw aluminum battery box. H2S has strong hydrogen bonds, for H2S to react with Aluminum you need an enthalpy change, like serious heat present, like 1000-2000 degrees type heat to generate enough energy to smash H2S apart against aluminum forming aluminum sulfide (decomposes in water) and hydrogen gas. So at normal temps H2S (if actually present) presents no detriment to aluminum. As far as lithium cells, its a salt battery, the only gas present should be oxygen and carbon dioxide. Points well taken. Though experience shows that an enclosed LA battery will rust steel and corrode aluminum. But again, these use cases -of mine- are usually marine. There's a reason most everything is PP, PE, or passivated stainless. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Danny G Posted November 11, 2019 Share Posted November 11, 2019 Points well taken. Though experience shows that an enclosed LA battery will rust steel and corrode aluminum. But again, these use cases -of mine- are usually marine. There's a reason most everything is PP, PE, or passivated stainless. I think plastic is always the safest bet in caustic environments. Water, especially salt water will corrode aluminum, heck aluminum oxide forms in open air. Batteries do generate water. Plastic also has the benefit of being typically lighter as well as resistant to a wider range of things, UV may be the most damaging thing it's exposed to. As far as the chemistry goes, I only had all that laying around because I just finished my last undergrad chemistry class lol. One of the last things we did was electro-chemsitry and galvanic cells. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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