Engine rebuild

[JAC1984]

How much to rebuild my engine diy style. Inline six 300. Seems like an overhaul on it would be a solid start to revamping my truck. And while I know almost nothing about mechanic work i do have a friend who know older fords inside and out so rebuild would only cost me materials.

[Gary Lewis]

In my experience you can't properly rebuild an engine for less than about $2000, even if you do all of the assembly work. That's because of the necessary machine shop fees.

None of the wear items will be truly round. The cylinders as well as the rod and main journals on the crank will all be out of round. So you need to bore the cylinders, which means you also need new pistons in addition to new rings. And the crank will need to be turned on both the rod and main bearing journals, and you'll then need new bearing inserts. Plus, frequently the heads have to be reworked, meaning have the seats ground, valves turned, and new stem seals installed. Then you need the rebuild kit, with pistons, rings, bearings, gaskets, etc.

I rebuilt a 351W a few years ago and had a friend who runs a machine shop do the machine work so got a good deal on the price. And he even bought the rebuild kit and sold it to me at his price. And it still cost $2000 when I was done.

[JAC1984]

In my experience you can't properly rebuild an engine for less than about $2000, even if you do all of the assembly work. That's because of the necessary machine shop fees.

None of the wear items will be truly round. The cylinders as well as the rod and main journals on the crank will all be out of round. So you need to bore the cylinders, which means you also need new pistons in addition to new rings. And the crank will need to be turned on both the rod and main bearing journals, and you'll then need new bearing inserts. Plus, frequently the heads have to be reworked, meaning have the seats ground, valves turned, and new stem seals installed. Then you need the rebuild kit, with pistons, rings, bearings, gaskets, etc.

I rebuilt a 351W a few years ago and had a friend who runs a machine shop do the machine work so got a good deal on the price. And he even bought the rebuild kit and sold it to me at his price. And it still cost $2000 when I was done.

Makes sense. So perhaps the more sensible thing to do would be to buy a rebuilt engine?

Rebuilding it just seems more fun, but being a novice i hadnt really considered the machining aspect.

[Gary Lewis]

Makes sense. So perhaps the more sensible thing to do would be to buy a rebuilt engine?

Rebuilding it just seems more fun, but being a novice i hadnt really considered the machining aspect.

A rebuilt engine from someone reputable would include a warranty, which you wouldn't have when doing it yourself. And, there'd be less chance of there being a problem.

[JAC1984]

A rebuilt engine from someone reputable would include a warranty, which you wouldn't have when doing it yourself. And, there'd be less chance of there being a problem.

Who would be someone reputable?

[Gary Lewis]

Who would be someone reputable?

Jasper is a name I see frequently. But some of the local parts houses, like O'Reilly's or Advanced may also have them. Or crate engines, as they are called, could be an option.

[Ford F834]

So much depends on what the engine actually needs and what you expect out of it. I have “rebuilt” a few straight sixes but without all of the machine work and been happy with what I got for the money I spent. In each case I put in about $600-$800 plus my time. The 300 six is a zero balance engine, and the ones I have opened up had no cylinder wear to speak of, and no reason to bore the cylinders. My dad’s old 240 had over 300K miles on it and was clattering like crazy and starting to smoke a little when we pulled it. There was no ridge and you could still see the cross hatching in all of the bores. Some bearings were showing a bit of wear in the Babbitt layers but the crank journals looked great. The clatter and smoke was mostly lifter/rocket arm issues and the smoke was from dried out valve stem seals. I broke the cylinder glaze with a 3-stone hone had the head flattened and new valve guides and seals installed at a machine shop. They lapped the valves and seats but they did not need replacing. I put in a rebuild kit in it, which was basically a cam & timing gear, lifters, oil pump, rings, bearings, freeze plugs and full gasket seal set. The pistons and wrist pins were fine. I don’t know how many miles we put on the rebuild but it was still solid after 18 years when I sold it. Was it perfect? No. It still seeped some oil in places, had a bit of blow-by but it didn’t smoke, had around 50 psi of oil pressure on the highway, ran smooth and quiet and pulled nice and strong.

I do not disagree with Gary. To completely rebuild an engine with all new internal wear parts and return it to factory spec is expensive, and requires enough machine shop work that you may as well have them assemble it and warranty the work. But at least in the case of a 300 I wouldn’t hesitate to freshen up a well cared for unit and run it some more. Worst case scenario if you open it up and find it needs more than that you can still buy a commercial rebuild or have it done. My preference is to search for a local shop with a good reputation. The parts house units are mass rebuilt and it’s no skin off their nose if one fails and has to be replaced under warrantee. But it ~is a big deal for you. Gas engines may be different, but in the 6.9/7.3 diesel world Jasper is a dirty word. Buyers have reported a hodgepodge of new and re-used parts, finger tight bolts, cylinder sleeves that were installed with no step and had dropped before the first start (he opened the 4th warranty engine before installing it) and the list of horrors goes on. It’s so bad that diesel board members will generally pass on any truck advertised to have a Jasper reman under the hood. I take this with a grain of salt as that was one engine model, and they were probably all done at just one of many Jasper plants. I just prefer to work with somebody local, face to face, rather than a crate unit from a parts house. Or do the work myself and know it’s done right. I don’t claim to be a pro, but I’ve never had any of my rebuild jobs go bad or let me down.

[Gary Lewis]

So much depends on what the engine actually needs and what you expect out of it. I have “rebuilt” a few straight sixes but without all of the machine work and been happy with what I got for the money I spent. In each case I put in about $600-$800 plus my time. The 300 six is a zero balance engine, and the ones I have opened up had no cylinder wear to speak of, and no reason to bore the cylinders. My dad’s old 240 had over 300K miles on it and was clattering like crazy and starting to smoke a little when we pulled it. There was no ridge and you could still see the cross hatching in all of the bores. Some bearings were showing a bit of wear in the Babbitt layers but the crank journals looked great. The clatter and smoke was mostly lifter/rocket arm issues and the smoke was from dried out valve stem seals. I broke the cylinder glaze with a 3-stone hone had the head flattened and new valve guides and seals installed at a machine shop. They lapped the valves and seats but they did not need replacing. I put in a rebuild kit in it, which was basically a cam & timing gear, lifters, oil pump, rings, bearings, freeze plugs and full gasket seal set. The pistons and wrist pins were fine. I don’t know how many miles we put on the rebuild but it was still solid after 18 years when I sold it. Was it perfect? No. It still seeped some oil in places, had a bit of blow-by but it didn’t smoke, had around 50 psi of oil pressure on the highway, ran smooth and quiet and pulled nice and strong.

I do not disagree with Gary. To completely rebuild an engine with all new internal wear parts and return it to factory spec is expensive, and requires enough machine shop work that you may as well have them assemble it and warranty the work. But at least in the case of a 300 I wouldn’t hesitate to freshen up a well cared for unit and run it some more. Worst case scenario if you open it up and find it needs more than that you can still buy a commercial rebuild or have it done. My preference is to search for a local shop with a good reputation. The parts house units are mass rebuilt and it’s no skin off their nose if one fails and has to be replaced under warrantee. But it ~is a big deal for you. Gas engines may be different, but in the 6.9/7.3 diesel world Jasper is a dirty word. Buyers have reported a hodgepodge of new and re-used parts, finger tight bolts, cylinder sleeves that were installed with no step and had dropped before the first start (he opened the 4th warranty engine before installing it) and the list of horrors goes on. It’s so bad that diesel board members will generally pass on any truck advertised to have a Jasper reman under the hood. I take this with a grain of salt as that was one engine model, and they were probably all done at just one of many Jasper plants. I just prefer to work with somebody local, face to face, rather than a crate unit from a parts house. Or do the work myself and know it’s done right. I don’t claim to be a pro, but I’ve never had any of my rebuild jobs go bad or let me down.

All good points, Jonathan. I've never rebuilt an inline engine, so will take your word for the even wear - or even that lack of wear. A V-ed engine does wear both the cylinders and crank journals out of round, perhaps because of the V. So I bow to your experience.

As for Jasper, that's disappointing to see. I've never bought one, but just assumed from the advertising that they are good. My bad.

[Ford F834]

All good points, Jonathan. I've never rebuilt an inline engine, so will take your word for the even wear - or even that lack of wear. A V-ed engine does wear both the cylinders and crank journals out of round, perhaps because of the V. So I bow to your experience.

As for Jasper, that's disappointing to see. I've never bought one, but just assumed from the advertising that they are good. My bad.

Gary, prior to the diesel discussions I had heard positive things about Jasper transmissions. I don’t necessarily like to smear a company’s name, but there was enough consensus from enough sources on the diesel board that I wouldn’t buy an idi from them (hopefully they have addressed the shortcomings but I’m not going to spend my money to find out). I don’t know what their practices are regarding their other products, but I have heard over and over that most parts house reman items have the absolute minimum done to them. Like one new brush in a starter motor instead of all replaced etc... and my experience with the quality of these parts supports that notion. This is bad enough with an alternator or carburetor when that’s about all there is to be had, but it makes me very uneasy about a long block or transmission. Especially since they don’t come with a lifetime warranty like many of the smaller parts do.

[1986F150Six]

Gary, prior to the diesel discussions I had heard positive things about Jasper transmissions. I don’t necessarily like to smear a company’s name, but there was enough consensus from enough sources on the diesel board that I wouldn’t buy an idi from them (hopefully they have addressed the shortcomings but I’m not going to spend my money to find out). I don’t know what their practices are regarding their other products, but I have heard over and over that most parts house reman items have the absolute minimum done to them. Like one new brush in a starter motor instead of all replaced etc... and my experience with the quality of these parts supports that notion. This is bad enough with an alternator or carburetor when that’s about all there is to be had, but it makes me very uneasy about a long block or transmission. Especially since they don’t come with a lifetime warranty like many of the smaller parts do.

Another idea:

http://www.powertechengines.com/HEC/HEC649I-EngSpecSheet.pdf