Gary Lewis Posted June 14, 2019 Author Share Posted June 14, 2019 Shaun - Just check to make sure that you have the right nuts on yours. Not the rounded-hex ones with the tapered shoulder on them. Mine have already been converted, luckily. Good! 👍 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
salans7 Posted June 14, 2019 Share Posted June 14, 2019 Good! 👍 Here's an issue though. You and I have the same axle shafts, but check out this image from the Monobeam section... Did you have that snap ring? Because I didn't, and the end of my axle shaft doesn't have a groove for a snap ring. Is the outer lock ring sufficient for retention of a manual lock hub setup? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve83 Posted June 14, 2019 Share Posted June 14, 2019 Is the outer lock ring sufficient for retention of a manual lock hub setup? The outer ring is the primary thing that holds the lock body in the hub. The one on the axle stub shaft is what holds the U-joint in-line between the ball joints/king pins. AFAIK, all stubs have an outer groove, but most with auto hub locks use a different snap ring at the inboard end of the splines to retain the stub & keep the U-joint in-line. It's the "C" at the bottom center of this pic: https://supermotors.net/getfile/72047/thumbnail/b35.jpg Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gary Lewis Posted June 14, 2019 Author Share Posted June 14, 2019 Is the outer lock ring sufficient for retention of a manual lock hub setup? The outer ring is the primary thing that holds the lock body in the hub. The one on the axle stub shaft is what holds the U-joint in-line between the ball joints/king pins. AFAIK, all stubs have an outer groove, but most with auto hub locks use a different snap ring at the inboard end of the splines to retain the stub & keep the U-joint in-line. It's the "C" at the bottom center of this pic: https://supermotors.net/getfile/72047/thumbnail/b35.jpg Shaun - I think you are looking at the wrong FSM. Look at the one on the tab labeled Ball Joint, which has the '95 FSM, and on Page 2 you'll see this illustration which shows no snap ring. And also note that it shows the outer and inner lock nuts and lock washer, but not the wonky rounded-hex nut and c-clip. (Now you see why I'm ) And my stub doesn't have a groove for a snap ring: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nothing Special Posted June 14, 2019 Share Posted June 14, 2019 The outer ring is the primary thing that holds the lock body in the hub. The one on the axle stub shaft is what holds the U-joint in-line between the ball joints/king pins.... The conversation about this snap ring comes up relatively frequently on all of the Ford boards I'm on. The consensus always comes down to what Steve said here. It also always boils down to the snap ring on the stub shaft not really being necessary. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gary Lewis Posted June 14, 2019 Author Share Posted June 14, 2019 The conversation about this snap ring comes up relatively frequently on all of the Ford boards I'm on. The consensus always comes down to what Steve said here. It also always boils down to the snap ring on the stub shaft not really being necessary. Since Ford, or maybe Dana, eliminated it some time between '86 and '95 I guess that proves it isn't necessary. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
salans7 Posted June 15, 2019 Share Posted June 15, 2019 Shaun - I think you are looking at the wrong FSM. Look at the one on the tab labeled Ball Joint, which has the '95 FSM, and on Page 2 you'll see this illustration which shows no snap ring. And also note that it shows the outer and inner lock nuts and lock washer, but not the wonky rounded-hex nut and c-clip. (Now you see why I'm ) And my stub doesn't have a groove for a snap ring: 95-97 FSM makes no difference here, since my axle has been converted to an older style setup that would have the snap ring according to the older FSM's. My question was whether that snap ring is necessary on a manual lockout setup since it isn't there on the auto due to the reasons provided by Steve. The illustration you provided is misleading in this situation since although it shows the axle shaft, it does not show the lockout end of the hub which is where this snap ring would be located. For that we need section 5-03C which AFAIK is not posted in the Tech section as of yet. I think that section is what will clear up your confusion on the auto VS manual hubs for the 95-97 trucks because it should show your funky auto spindle nut. But Steve basically answered my question, since the large outer lock ring is what really keeps the lockout body in the hub. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gary Lewis Posted June 15, 2019 Author Share Posted June 15, 2019 Shaun - I think you are looking at the wrong FSM. Look at the one on the tab labeled Ball Joint, which has the '95 FSM, and on Page 2 you'll see this illustration which shows no snap ring. And also note that it shows the outer and inner lock nuts and lock washer, but not the wonky rounded-hex nut and c-clip. (Now you see why I'm )And my stub doesn't have a groove for a snap ring:95-97 FSM makes no difference here, since my axle has been converted to an older style setup that would have the snap ring according to the older FSM's. My question was whether that snap ring is necessary on a manual lockout setup since it isn't there on the auto due to the reasons provided by Steve. The illustration you provided is misleading in this situation since although it shows the axle shaft, it does not show the lockout end of the hub which is where this snap ring would be located. For that we need section 5-03C which AFAIK is not posted in the Tech section as of yet. I think that section is what will clear up your confusion on the auto VS manual hubs for the 95-97 trucks because it should show your funky auto spindle nut. But Steve basically answered my question, since the large outer lock ring is what really keeps the lockout body in the hub. I posted the lockout illustrations earlier, but they didn't have the part list. So let me do that again, with the parts list.Having said that, mine won't match the after March of '95 illustration. But it will match the Torque King 4x4 illustration.Here's the early, prior to March '95, illustration and it includes the snap ring: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
salans7 Posted June 15, 2019 Share Posted June 15, 2019 I posted the lockout illustrations earlier, but they didn't have the part list. So let me do that again, with the parts list.Having said that, mine won't match the after March of '95 illustration. But it will match the Torque King 4x4 illustration.Here's the early, prior to March '95, illustration and it includes the snap ring:Well that's frustrating, but at least Torque King had a useful diagram. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gary Lewis Posted June 15, 2019 Author Share Posted June 15, 2019 Well that's frustrating, but at least Torque King had a useful diagram. Yes, it is frustrating. I ordered the '95 FSM to have the official word on the axle, only to find out that mine doesn't match what it says. But I was pleasantly surprised when I talked to the people at Torque King. They really knew what they were talking about and had the parts I needed available. The o-rings, the nuts, the washers, the socket, etc. And while their prices may be a bit higher than other places I've seen, I'm happy to pay it for the consulting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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