Big Blue's Transformation

[Gary Lewis]

Thanks, Bill. I'll give it a try tomorrow and let you know.

As for the vent, I do smell gas at times from Big Blue. But I don't don't want the complexity, although I can see that where you live the humidity mixes all too well with the ethanol.

Well, I missed something when I looked at the logs earlier. And remember, Throttle Position Relative (TP_REL) = Throttle Position (TP) - Throttle Position Ratched Min Voltage (RATCH). These are the readings at idle, and the "0504....../...." is the date and the time stamp:

• 05042022/10-21-52: TP = 1.1 & TP_REL = .03

• 05072022/13-12-14: TP = 1.08 & TP_REL = .8

And today's log has TP = 1.1 and TP_REL = .8. So RATCH changed dramatically from 1.07 to .3 between May 4th, when the ISCFLG was getting set to -1 for RPM Control and May 7th when it wasn't. So maybe it isn't another parameter I changed but something to do with not clearing RATCH?

Might this be mechanical, like the throttle not returning?

 

[85lebaront2]

Thanks, Bill. I'll give it a try tomorrow and let you know.

As for the vent, I do smell gas at times from Big Blue. But I don't don't want the complexity, although I can see that where you live the humidity mixes all too well with the ethanol.

The reason I went that way, the OBD-II system has two modes on EVAP control, one is a normal purge valve, but in order to meet Federal and CA emission standards it has to run a test to confirm system integrity. This is done by pulling a vacuum on the EVAP system, many newer vehicles actually have a vacuum pump, others just use manifold vacuum to do this. This is normal for under 8500 GVW vehicles.

Over 8500 GVW vehicles are allowed a non-sealed system, which is what I used on Darth. I started with the 1990 EVAP system, and extended the line on the frame where it goes past the right side of the cab (needed 35" more). In the front I used the two EVAP canisters from the 1990 F250 and initially used the CANP valve and lines from it. Both tanks have a double nipple valve in the top, one side going to a vent cap like the axle vents use and the other going to the EVAP piping.

After finding I could not satisfy the EEC as far as using a CANP system due to the inability to pass the system integrity test I was faced with 4 options (1) live with a permanent check engine light, (2) disable the CEL in the software, (3) figure out a way to "cheat" the system into thinking it was sealed, (4) get and install a VMV and use it the way it was designed. I did a functional test of the last option with a 1995 Lincoln Continental VMV and after it proved out, found and ordered a correct VMV for a 1996 CA Spec 460.

Once I get the new engine in, I will copy the needed parameters from an FEZ3 EEC into the tune on Darth.

[Gary Lewis]

The reason I went that way, the OBD-II system has two modes on EVAP control, one is a normal purge valve, but in order to meet Federal and CA emission standards it has to run a test to confirm system integrity. This is done by pulling a vacuum on the EVAP system, many newer vehicles actually have a vacuum pump, others just use manifold vacuum to do this. This is normal for under 8500 GVW vehicles.

Over 8500 GVW vehicles are allowed a non-sealed system, which is what I used on Darth. I started with the 1990 EVAP system, and extended the line on the frame where it goes past the right side of the cab (needed 35" more). In the front I used the two EVAP canisters from the 1990 F250 and initially used the CANP valve and lines from it. Both tanks have a double nipple valve in the top, one side going to a vent cap like the axle vents use and the other going to the EVAP piping.

After finding I could not satisfy the EEC as far as using a CANP system due to the inability to pass the system integrity test I was faced with 4 options (1) live with a permanent check engine light, (2) disable the CEL in the software, (3) figure out a way to "cheat" the system into thinking it was sealed, (4) get and install a VMV and use it the way it was designed. I did a functional test of the last option with a 1995 Lincoln Continental VMV and after it proved out, found and ordered a correct VMV for a 1996 CA Spec 460.

Once I get the new engine in, I will copy the needed parameters from an FEZ3 EEC into the tune on Darth.

Bill - I think there is yet another way. That mask I found has a bit for Purge, so it could be turned off and the MIL wouldn't light even if there was a code for Purge.

But your way is the better way. However, I'm confused. Your system is vented as well as having vapor canisters? How does the vapor get to the canister instead of going to the atmosphere?

Mine is just vented, right at the rear of the cab. And when a tank is full and you've driven the truck the heat from the exhaust causes some fumes to come out. I dropped Janey off at Walmart recently and when she got out she said "It smells like gas out here." Yep, and I knew why.

[Gary Lewis]

Bill - I think there is yet another way. That mask I found has a bit for Purge, so it could be turned off and the MIL wouldn't light even if there was a code for Purge.

But your way is the better way. However, I'm confused. Your system is vented as well as having vapor canisters? How does the vapor get to the canister instead of going to the atmosphere?

Mine is just vented, right at the rear of the cab. And when a tank is full and you've driven the truck the heat from the exhaust causes some fumes to come out. I dropped Janey off at Walmart recently and when she got out she said "It smells like gas out here." Yep, and I knew why.

Yippee!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! It WORKS!

I had a thought last night the maybe I just needed to pull the battery cable for a bit and let the computer forget something. For instance, Decipha's writeup says that if you ever open the idle stop screw up that you'll have to pull the TPS connector, start the engine, shut it down, and reconnect. I'd done that but it didn't do the trick, so maybe pulling the battery cable would do it? IT DID!

In the log below of the startup from cold there are several things to note:

• RPM vs Desired RPM: Look at the green line, which is RPM, vs the yellow line, which is Desired RPM. Save for the start and then right at the end it tracks perfectly! And while at the start the actual is a bit below desired, it is much better than the 1400ish it has been going to on a cold start. And the bit at the end where actual goes below desired is right after the throttle blips I did and is surely due to having the dashpot disabled.

• AFR: The blue line is the actual AFR and just before the vertical red line it is running about 18 - 19:1. But that red line is Fuel Source and when it goes to 0 the system goes into closed-loop mode. At that point the AFR goes into the high 14's and stays there.

• ECT: The red trace that goes up to the right is Engine Coolant Temp, which starts at 82F, climbs to 185F where the thermostat opens, and then drops to 178 at the end. But across all of that change the RPM is pretty much holding right where it is supposed to.

So now I need to put some parameters back that I've taken out, like the dashpot, and then start it up again and see if that sorts out some of the issues. But the lean bit before going closed-loop shouldn't be part of that so it'll take a bit more research.

[Machspeed]

Yippee!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! It WORKS!

I had a thought last night the maybe I just needed to pull the battery cable for a bit and let the computer forget something. For instance, Decipha's writeup says that if you ever open the idle stop screw up that you'll have to pull the TPS connector, start the engine, shut it down, and reconnect. I'd done that but it didn't do the trick, so maybe pulling the battery cable would do it? IT DID!

In the log below of the startup from cold there are several things to note:

• RPM vs Desired RPM: Look at the green line, which is RPM, vs the yellow line, which is Desired RPM. Save for the start and then right at the end it tracks perfectly! And while at the start the actual is a bit below desired, it is much better than the 1400ish it has been going to on a cold start. And the bit at the end where actual goes below desired is right after the throttle blips I did and is surely due to having the dashpot disabled.

• AFR: The blue line is the actual AFR and just before the vertical red line it is running about 18 - 19:1. But that red line is Fuel Source and when it goes to 0 the system goes into closed-loop mode. At that point the AFR goes into the high 14's and stays there.

• ECT: The red trace that goes up to the right is Engine Coolant Temp, which starts at 82F, climbs to 185F where the thermostat opens, and then drops to 178 at the end. But across all of that change the RPM is pretty much holding right where it is supposed to.

So now I need to put some parameters back that I've taken out, like the dashpot, and then start it up again and see if that sorts out some of the issues. But the lean bit before going closed-loop shouldn't be part of that so it'll take a bit more research.

It's great when the light comes on and the resulting action proves affective. Good for you, Gary!

[Gary Lewis]

It's great when the light comes on and the resulting action proves affective. Good for you, Gary!

Thanks, John. It was a really good feeling, especially today.

But I'm not quite sure I know what is going on as I went back two steps in tunes and wrote one in that had the proper parameters in for both the dashpot as well as lower limit to go into RPM Control. And when I fired it up the closed-throttle flag wasn't set. So I pulled power for 10 minutes and then fired it up again and then the closed-throttle flag was set and it ran well - save for going quite lean just before going into closed-loop.

So something isn't working right when I write a new tune in. Binary Editor says it is resetting the ECU but that doesn't appear to be happening. So maybe I'll have to do it manually?

Anyway, we need to run to Owasso so are going to take Big Blue for that run and we'll find out how well it does.

[85lebaront2]

Thanks, John. It was a really good feeling, especially today.

But I'm not quite sure I know what is going on as I went back two steps in tunes and wrote one in that had the proper parameters in for both the dashpot as well as lower limit to go into RPM Control. And when I fired it up the closed-throttle flag wasn't set. So I pulled power for 10 minutes and then fired it up again and then the closed-throttle flag was set and it ran well - save for going quite lean just before going into closed-loop.

So something isn't working right when I write a new tune in. Binary Editor says it is resetting the ECU but that doesn't appear to be happening. So maybe I'll have to do it manually?

Anyway, we need to run to Owasso so are going to take Big Blue for that run and we'll find out how well it does.

What Adam told me on Darth, once you reflash the EEC, you need to disconnect the EEC KAPWR, this can be done on Darth by pulling fuse #9 in my underhood fuse box. This is a 30 amp fuse as it feeds all of the EEC system. That is a lot easier than disconnecting the battery.

We discovered this after I was having issues getting changes to actually effect the system, and had disconnected the battery for another reason and found that after a few restarts, everything settled down.

On the lean on startup, I have the same issue with Darth after reflashing and lobotomizing the EEC, engine will go extremely lean shortly after starting until the O2 sensors come on-line and begin controlling the mixture.

 

[Gary Lewis]

What Adam told me on Darth, once you reflash the EEC, you need to disconnect the EEC KAPWR, this can be done on Darth by pulling fuse #9 in my underhood fuse box. This is a 30 amp fuse as it feeds all of the EEC system. That is a lot easier than disconnecting the battery.

We discovered this after I was having issues getting changes to actually effect the system, and had disconnected the battery for another reason and found that after a few restarts, everything settled down.

On the lean on startup, I have the same issue with Darth after reflashing and lobotomizing the EEC, engine will go extremely lean shortly after starting until the O2 sensors come on-line and begin controlling the mixture.

Well, he may tell me the same thing as I just emailed the triumvirate asking what I'm doing wrong.

And yes, if I pulled Fuse 9 it would make it easier, so thanks. That way the radio wouldn't lose its time setting.

As for the AFR, does the ECU figure it out out after several drive cycles? So I shouldn't start changing things?

I think we are "there" on the idle, and here's the proof. This is a 41 second snippet of the end of the datalog of a 20 minute drive, so the engine was good and warm. The yellow line is Desired RPM, and under it is Actual RPM in green - take my word for it. The purple line is the Idle Speed Control Duty Cycle. Where it drops for several seconds is when I turned the A/C off, and then where it goes back up is where I turned the A/C back on. Basically the RPM does not vary when that happens, and you certainly cannot tell when the compressor comes on or goes off.

I love it!

[85lebaront2]

Well, he may tell me the same thing as I just emailed the triumvirate asking what I'm doing wrong.

And yes, if I pulled Fuse 9 it would make it easier, so thanks. That way the radio wouldn't lose its time setting.

As for the AFR, does the ECU figure it out out after several drive cycles? So I shouldn't start changing things?

I think we are "there" on the idle, and here's the proof. This is a 41 second snippet of the end of the datalog of a 20 minute drive, so the engine was good and warm. The yellow line is Desired RPM, and under it is Actual RPM in green - take my word for it. The purple line is the Idle Speed Control Duty Cycle. Where it drops for several seconds is when I turned the A/C off, and then where it goes back up is where I turned the A/C back on. Basically the RPM does not vary when that happens, and you certainly cannot tell when the compressor comes on or goes off.

I love it!

Looks good! The EEC "learns" the optimum duty cycle for the injectors from where it goes once the O2 sensors come on and start controlling. This is also why an OBD-II vehicle has to be run through a drive cycle that is very specific before in can be emission tested.

This is also why I was telling you to drive BB a bit before making changes again.

[Gary Lewis]

Looks good! The EEC "learns" the optimum duty cycle for the injectors from where it goes once the O2 sensors come on and start controlling. This is also why an OBD-II vehicle has to be run through a drive cycle that is very specific before in can be emission tested.

This is also why I was telling you to drive BB a bit before making changes again.

Ok, I'll drive it a few times tomorrow. Maybe it'll dial itself in. But I won't tweak it any more for a while as my grandtwins arrive tomorrow night and will be with us for about 10 days, so there won't be much work done on the truck during that time.