Big Blue's Transformation

[Gary Lewis]

Gary, I didn't even realize he had a website, after I moved on and started using BE on the EEC-V systems, I really hadn't thought about him until you mentioned him.

He has a website and a forum. (I'm curious how that works.) And he has good writeups on how to tune. Check out the page on transmissions.

[ratdude747]

Another update. I didn't write that tune to the ECU yesterday as I think it is treating a symptom. I believe the problem is in the MAF curve and I need to address that. However, I just got this in from Decipha on the EFIDynoTuning forum - with the bolding by me:

tunerpro doeant interface with the goose. You need pcmflash to read and write that.

You can read the tune off the ecu using a quarterhorse

since all u have is the goose and no qh you might as well stick with what you have

otherwise if u wanted to swap youd need a quarterhorse and premium membership

So that answers the question - I'll stay with what I have.

And now today's MPG test: 12.6 MPG.

Why? Probably because we had winds in the 30 - 40 MPH range. While we did travel with the wind for maybe 50 of the 200+ miles, we were going directly across it for 100 miles and directly into it for the other 50 miles. And going across the wind certainly does impact drag.

I looked around a bit for documentation on the effect of wind, and found this at the Freightliner site: "For every 10 mph of headwind or crosswind, fuel efficiency is reduced by as much as 13%." I'm sure that is meant for semis, but it does indicate that both a head wind as well as a cross wind significantly hurts fuel economy. And to put it into perspective, 12.6 is 10% off of 14.0 MPG.

Having driven a couple different 1995 Rangers across Kansas where winds are brutal (relatively flat with no trees for a wind break), it's a huge factor (at least when you have a high camper shell I like did/do).

My one with a 3.0 spent most of the time outside of tailwinds on the interstate in 3rd gear (OD couldn't make it past 60mph, and that's with 3.73 gears). Even the 4.0 in the ranger that replaced it still struggled at times (it has 3.08 gears). Just as bad if not worse than the hills in Missouri and southern Indiana in regards to MPG.

[Gary Lewis]

Having driven a couple different 1995 Rangers across Kansas where winds are brutal (relatively flat with no trees for a wind break), it's a huge factor (at least when you have a high camper shell I like did/do).

My one with a 3.0 spent most of the time outside of tailwinds on the interstate in 3rd gear (OD couldn't make it past 60mph, and that's with 3.73 gears). Even the 4.0 in the ranger that replaced it still struggled at times (it has 3.08 gears). Just as bad if not worse than the hills in Missouri and southern Indiana in regards to MPG.

Yes, the camper or shell makes a huge difference. We had a '72 F250 w/a 390 4V/C6/3.73 combo and it carried a 9 1/2' self-contained camper. Took it to Colorado and spent the night in a rest stop on I-70. The next morning the wind was out of the NW and as we rolled down the entrance ramp the tranny dropped into Drive. However, when we reached the level it dropped back into 2nd and it was a huge struggle to keep it on the road, much less going fast.

Apparently we left a big wake as a VW Bug thought he was going to pass but found the sheltered spot in our left rear quarter and stayed there for a looooooong time.

Yesterday I didn't have any problem keeping the truck at speed. The 460 didn't really care about the wind - as long as I fed it. And the AFR stayed in the high 14's and never dropped down into the 13's, even on hills when directly into the wind. So save for maybe some more timing and the idle I think the EFI system is pretty well tuned.

And, I forgot to report on what my brother and his son thought about the truck. Both were very impressed, and my brother thought it made it a completely different vehicle. He'd driven it extensively on the trip to Ouray last year and was blown away with how much difference the EFI made.

His son, who is a mechanical engineer and is running his own automotive shop asked if I had a knock sensor. I told him that they did come on the EFI'd 460's but they are no longer available. He said that a forum he's on is having really good luck with this Bosch knock sensor on a lot of different vehicles. And some are connecting this headphone amplifier to it and say that you can easily tell when knock occurs. We agreed that the thing to do would be to install the combo, put your headphones on awa an oscilloscope, and go for a drive. Note the voltage when the knock occurs and use that to design the right circuit to ensure the EEC-V ECU sets the flag and takes action when knock occurs - assuming it doesn't right out of the box.

[85lebaront2]

Yes, the camper or shell makes a huge difference. We had a '72 F250 w/a 390 4V/C6/3.73 combo and it carried a 9 1/2' self-contained camper. Took it to Colorado and spent the night in a rest stop on I-70. The next morning the wind was out of the NW and as we rolled down the entrance ramp the tranny dropped into Drive. However, when we reached the level it dropped back into 2nd and it was a huge struggle to keep it on the road, much less going fast.

Apparently we left a big wake as a VW Bug thought he was going to pass but found the sheltered spot in our left rear quarter and stayed there for a looooooong time.

Yesterday I didn't have any problem keeping the truck at speed. The 460 didn't really care about the wind - as long as I fed it. And the AFR stayed in the high 14's and never dropped down into the 13's, even on hills when directly into the wind. So save for maybe some more timing and the idle I think the EFI system is pretty well tuned.

And, I forgot to report on what my brother and his son thought about the truck. Both were very impressed, and my brother thought it made it a completely different vehicle. He'd driven it extensively on the trip to Ouray last year and was blown away with how much difference the EFI made.

His son, who is a mechanical engineer and is running his own automotive shop asked if I had a knock sensor. I told him that they did come on the EFI'd 460's but they are no longer available. He said that a forum he's on is having really good luck with this Bosch knock sensor on a lot of different vehicles. And some are connecting this headphone amplifier to it and say that you can easily tell when knock occurs. We agreed that the thing to do would be to install the combo, put your headphones on awa an oscilloscope, and go for a drive. Note the voltage when the knock occurs and use that to design the right circuit to ensure the EEC-V ECU sets the flag and takes action when knock occurs - assuming it doesn't right out of the box.

Two things, first, no EFI 460 I have seen had a knock sensor. 302s until 1996 did. I have some information on knock sensors I will send you later. Sent, hopefully it will be of use.

Second, the link to Decipha's transmission information is great! I now know where to go to keep the TCC engaged at closed throttle when coasting.

[Gary Lewis]

Two things, first, no EFI 460 I have seen had a knock sensor. 302s until 1996 did. I have some information on knock sensors I will send you later. Sent, hopefully it will be of use.

Second, the link to Decipha's transmission information is great! I now know where to go to keep the TCC engaged at closed throttle when coasting.

Bill - I thought you'd enjoy the tranny info.

But, don't forget that you may run into a translation problem. By that I mean that Ford used function #'s (FN#'s) for everything, and TunerPro RT/Decipha and Core Tuning have both translated those #'s into terms that mean something to the mortal man. Unfortunately in most cases they used different terms. For instance FN1360 is "Stabilized Fuel Table" for Decipha and "Base O/L Fuel Table Stabilized" for Core Tuning.

But if you read Decipha's writeup you can usually figure it out, especially when he gives a picture of a table as you can poke around in BE and probably find it. However, if you do figure it out you might let me know so I can keep track of it in my Rosetta Stone spreadsheet.

On the knock sensor, you are right and I was wrong. I thought I remembered the knock sensor wiring in my harness, but I now realize that's the misfire detector wiring. And, I looked through the '96 EVTM and none of the engines used in the full-sized pickups had a knock sensor.

Oddly enough, the strategy I'm using, AGANN, has provisions for a knock sensor. But the calibration, YER2 which is for a CA-spec 460 w/a manual tranny, has it disabled. You can see that in the snag below.

But I don't know if that means the ECU I'm using has the hardware in it to monitor a knock sensor. I'll see if I can figure that out, but I'm seriously doubting if I'll want to try to install a knock sensor. However, I have read what you sent via email, and it all makes sense.

[85lebaront2]

Bill - I thought you'd enjoy the tranny info.

But, don't forget that you may run into a translation problem. By that I mean that Ford used function #'s (FN#'s) for everything, and TunerPro RT/Decipha and Core Tuning have both translated those #'s into terms that mean something to the mortal man. Unfortunately in most cases they used different terms. For instance FN1360 is "Stabilized Fuel Table" for Decipha and "Base O/L Fuel Table Stabilized" for Core Tuning.

But if you read Decipha's writeup you can usually figure it out, especially when he gives a picture of a table as you can poke around in BE and probably find it. However, if you do figure it out you might let me know so I can keep track of it in my Rosetta Stone spreadsheet.

On the knock sensor, you are right and I was wrong. I thought I remembered the knock sensor wiring in my harness, but I now realize that's the misfire detector wiring. And, I looked through the '96 EVTM and none of the engines used in the full-sized pickups had a knock sensor.

Oddly enough, the strategy I'm using, AGANN, has provisions for a knock sensor. But the calibration, YER2 which is for a CA-spec 460 w/a manual tranny, has it disabled. You can see that in the snag below.

But I don't know if that means the ECU I'm using has the hardware in it to monitor a knock sensor. I'll see if I can figure that out, but I'm seriously doubting if I'll want to try to install a knock sensor. However, I have read what you sent via email, and it all makes sense.

I will, but it will be a while, I have to figure out whether I have a head, head gasket or intake leak and then decide on what to do about the issue.

[Gary Lewis]

Bill - I thought you'd enjoy the tranny info.

But, don't forget that you may run into a translation problem. By that I mean that Ford used function #'s (FN#'s) for everything, and TunerPro RT/Decipha and Core Tuning have both translated those #'s into terms that mean something to the mortal man. Unfortunately in most cases they used different terms. For instance FN1360 is "Stabilized Fuel Table" for Decipha and "Base O/L Fuel Table Stabilized" for Core Tuning.

But if you read Decipha's writeup you can usually figure it out, especially when he gives a picture of a table as you can poke around in BE and probably find it. However, if you do figure it out you might let me know so I can keep track of it in my Rosetta Stone spreadsheet.

On the knock sensor, you are right and I was wrong. I thought I remembered the knock sensor wiring in my harness, but I now realize that's the misfire detector wiring. And, I looked through the '96 EVTM and none of the engines used in the full-sized pickups had a knock sensor.

Oddly enough, the strategy I'm using, AGANN, has provisions for a knock sensor. But the calibration, YER2 which is for a CA-spec 460 w/a manual tranny, has it disabled. You can see that in the snag below.

But I don't know if that means the ECU I'm using has the hardware in it to monitor a knock sensor. I'll see if I can figure that out, but I'm seriously doubting if I'll want to try to install a knock sensor. However, I have read what you sent via email, and it all makes sense.

Bill - Have I got a deal for you. I asked Decipha if he has a translate table to go from FN# to his description and he does. But it is in a file that is intended to be loaded up by TunerPro RT.

As I have TPRT installed I opened it and loaded up his RZASA_210517.xdf, his affiliated adx file and, oddly enough, my latest tune from BE.

and was able to get to the info. As shown in the lower right I searched for FN135-WOT and it found it. So then I double-clicked it and it showed it in the overall scheme on the left and in the table in the upper right.

So if you want to install TPRT you could do that and then download the xdf file. But I might could look things up for you when the time comes. Meanwhile I'll poke around and see what I can figure out.

[Gary Lewis]

Bill - Have I got a deal for you. I asked Decipha if he has a translate table to go from FN# to his description and he does. But it is in a file that is intended to be loaded up by TunerPro RT.

As I have TPRT installed I opened it and loaded up his RZASA_210517.xdf, his affiliated adx file and, oddly enough, my latest tune from BE.

and was able to get to the info. As shown in the lower right I searched for FN135-WOT and it found it. So then I double-clicked it and it showed it in the overall scheme on the left and in the table in the upper right.

So if you want to install TPRT you could do that and then download the xdf file. But I might could look things up for you when the time comes. Meanwhile I'll poke around and see what I can figure out.

Well, it has been several days since I posted, and that's 'cause I've been doing other things. But this morning I thought I do some more learning about the EFI and try to figure out why I can't get the idle down to the Desired RPM level of 648. Instead it has been hanging in around 700+ RPM and isn't constant.

In looking at the log of the idle after I'd driven the truck and it was fully warmed up I discovered that the Idle Speed Control Flag (ISCFLG) = 0. But the writeup in BE says that:

-1 = Dashpot

0 = Dashpot Preposition

1 = RPM Control

2 = RPM Lockout (No learning)

So the computer wasn't controlling the RPM. And now I'm on the hunt for what sets the ISCFLG...

I found the parameter Lower Limit to Enter Dashpot RPM Control, which says "When airflow is less than this value the ISC RPM Control is enabled and dashpot decay is complete. When the airflow is greater than this value then ISC Dashpot is active." My parameter has been set to .12 while Bill's is set to .4.

However, the AM value, which is "Mass Air Flow" and I think is the parameter that is being monitored, was running at 1.2 - 1.25 during idling. So I'm going to set the value to 1.4 and see what that does. Hopefully it will case the ECU to control the idle RPM, but without causing other problems.

[Gary Lewis]

Well, it has been several days since I posted, and that's 'cause I've been doing other things. But this morning I thought I do some more learning about the EFI and try to figure out why I can't get the idle down to the Desired RPM level of 648. Instead it has been hanging in around 700+ RPM and isn't constant.

In looking at the log of the idle after I'd driven the truck and it was fully warmed up I discovered that the Idle Speed Control Flag (ISCFLG) = 0. But the writeup in BE says that:

-1 = Dashpot

0 = Dashpot Preposition

1 = RPM Control

2 = RPM Lockout (No learning)

So the computer wasn't controlling the RPM. And now I'm on the hunt for what sets the ISCFLG...

I found the parameter Lower Limit to Enter Dashpot RPM Control, which says "When airflow is less than this value the ISC RPM Control is enabled and dashpot decay is complete. When the airflow is greater than this value then ISC Dashpot is active." My parameter has been set to .12 while Bill's is set to .4.

However, the AM value, which is "Mass Air Flow" and I think is the parameter that is being monitored, was running at 1.2 - 1.25 during idling. So I'm going to set the value to 1.4 and see what that does. Hopefully it will case the ECU to control the idle RPM, but without causing other problems.

Well, 1.4 for the Lower Limit to Enter Dashpot RPM Control didn't do it. After it fully warmed up the idle is more like 850 RPM and the "AM" value is running between 1.4 and 1.5 at idle. But 700/850 * 1.5 = 1.24 which was the AM value before, so that fits. Given that it isn't surprising that the ISCFLG never went to 1 indicating we were in RPM Control.

Said another way, it is idling too high which causes the AM value to exceed the point at which it should go into RPM Control, which would then lower the RPM. Sounds like Catch 22.

At first it sounded like a vacuum leak to me, which would cause it to run fast because the ECU would have to add fuel to make it stay at the desired AFR ratio. But I checked and the Idle Speed Controller's duty cycle is running about 44% at an 850 RPM idle, so that's where the extra air and the associated high idle is coming from.

Looks like I need to track down why the ECU thinks it needs to be pulsing the ISC that much.

 

[Gary Lewis]

Well, 1.4 for the Lower Limit to Enter Dashpot RPM Control didn't do it. After it fully warmed up the idle is more like 850 RPM and the "AM" value is running between 1.4 and 1.5 at idle. But 700/850 * 1.5 = 1.24 which was the AM value before, so that fits. Given that it isn't surprising that the ISCFLG never went to 1 indicating we were in RPM Control.

Said another way, it is idling too high which causes the AM value to exceed the point at which it should go into RPM Control, which would then lower the RPM. Sounds like Catch 22.

At first it sounded like a vacuum leak to me, which would cause it to run fast because the ECU would have to add fuel to make it stay at the desired AFR ratio. But I checked and the Idle Speed Controller's duty cycle is running about 44% at an 850 RPM idle, so that's where the extra air and the associated high idle is coming from.

Looks like I need to track down why the ECU thinks it needs to be pulsing the ISC that much.

And, here's the latest suspect: Dashpot Preposition. As you'll see in the writeup, it says "the basic concept may be envisioned as a sort of parallel throttle", so this is in addition to the air that the ECU thinks is needed to let the engine idle.

In the screenshot below my #'s are on the left and Bill's are on the right. I'm thinking this may well be the culprit, and I think I'll set all of those numbers to 0 and see what happens.