Sway bars

[Littlebeefy]

How’s this??

Very helpful. It looks like those are two different part numbers L/R. I'm looking at Gary's included sway bar diagrams and it appears (based on the circles and triangles) that the brackets switch frame rails for 4WD vs 2WD. I wonder why?

If I follow the schematic and the parts list, the bracket on the drivers side is E0TZ-5486-A. The diagram (not the parts list) shows the other side bracket as 5D485. Green has both E0TZ-5D485-A and E1TZ-5D485-A (listed as stabilizer bracket). Anyone know which is for what?

[Littlebeefy]

Very helpful. It looks like those are two different part numbers L/R. I'm looking at Gary's included sway bar diagrams and it appears (based on the circles and triangles) that the brackets switch frame rails for 4WD vs 2WD. I wonder why?

If I follow the schematic and the parts list, the bracket on the drivers side is E0TZ-5486-A. The diagram (not the parts list) shows the other side bracket as 5D485. Green has both E0TZ-5D485-A and E1TZ-5D485-A (listed as stabilizer bracket). Anyone know which is for what?

I did some more digging and I think I have it sorted out. Would somebody confirm my thinking here?

From what I can tell Bronco and F-150 4x4 used brackets E0TZ-5D485-a and -b for the L/R frame rails.

F-150 4x4 with HD suspension used E1TZ-5d485-a and -b for the L/R frame rails.

 

[Gsmblue]

I did some more digging and I think I have it sorted out. Would somebody confirm my thinking here?

From what I can tell Bronco and F-150 4x4 used brackets E0TZ-5D485-a and -b for the L/R frame rails.

F-150 4x4 with HD suspension used E1TZ-5d485-a and -b for the L/R frame rails.

I cannot confirm or deny. But if you need any more pics let me know, my front end is about to be even more pulled apart.

[Littlebeefy]

I cannot confirm or deny. But if you need any more pics let me know, my front end is about to be even more pulled apart.

Well, I learned the hard way that the Bronco used the E1TZ brackets, not the E0TZ brackets. More on that here.

I did the SAS swap to a D44HD, so I want to adapt an '80+ sway bar to the axle. In looking at the versions of the sway bars, my original Bronco bar gives the most clearance for steering linkage in TROK applications, especially with even a moderate lift. And I found out about the c-caps that they used to have on the quad shock builds.

I checked the existing radius arm c-caps against the stock Bronco sway bar and they line up shockingly well. I know I can't use the stock links, but I can definitely find some off the shelf ones that will work. Also, I think I can flip those c-caps over to move the eyelet to the top or the bottom.

I'll post pictures when I get around to installing that in like 3 years hahaha.

[Machspeed]

Well, I learned the hard way that the Bronco used the E1TZ brackets, not the E0TZ brackets. More on that here.

I did the SAS swap to a D44HD, so I want to adapt an '80+ sway bar to the axle. In looking at the versions of the sway bars, my original Bronco bar gives the most clearance for steering linkage in TROK applications, especially with even a moderate lift. And I found out about the c-caps that they used to have on the quad shock builds.

I checked the existing radius arm c-caps against the stock Bronco sway bar and they line up shockingly well. I know I can't use the stock links, but I can definitely find some off the shelf ones that will work. Also, I think I can flip those c-caps over to move the eyelet to the top or the bottom.

I'll post pictures when I get around to installing that in like 3 years hahaha.

Well, hoping that won't be three years....LOL! I have to admit though, I posted on this over a year ago and have not moved on it. At the time, looked like too much work and at an expense I didn't want to deal with.

[BigBrother-84]

Well, hoping that won't be three years....LOL! I have to admit though, I posted on this over a year ago and have not moved on it. At the time, looked like too much work and at an expense I didn't want to deal with.

Gentlemen, I am a complete rookie about stabilizer bars.

My question is only motivated by curiosity, since I personally do not plan such work on Big Bro.

Question: Does a truck need bars on front AND rear, or they can be installed independently and have no influence each on the other?

[Gary Lewis]

Gentlemen, I am a complete rookie about stabilizer bars.

My question is only motivated by curiosity, since I personally do not plan such work on Big Bro.

Question: Does a truck need bars on front AND rear, or they can be installed independently and have no influence each on the other?

Ford didn't have an option for sway bars on one end or the other, just both ends. But they work independently so you don't have to have them on both ends.

I've driven trucks with and without them. Dad's truck has them and it has a very comfortable ride. And Big Blue came with them but when I was trying to figure out why the ride was so brutal Ken from New Zealand suggested I disconnect them and that made a big improvement in the ride.

I can say that comparing similar trucks like Rusty or the '82 Explorer to Dad's, all 1/2 ton with about the same GVWR, the sway bars seemed to make the truck more "planted" on the road. I remember Ray installing them on his 1/2 ton and telling me that they made a huge difference.

But on the HD suspension, like Big Blue, they seem to stiffen things up. So I've not installed them on Big Blue after I did the D60 swap. My reasoning is that the ride is still fairly stiff and the handling is adequate. And I know that sway bars hurt the articulation when offroading, so I do w/o.

[BigBrother-84]

Ford didn't have an option for sway bars on one end or the other, just both ends. But they work independently so you don't have to have them on both ends.

I've driven trucks with and without them. Dad's truck has them and it has a very comfortable ride. And Big Blue came with them but when I was trying to figure out why the ride was so brutal Ken from New Zealand suggested I disconnect them and that made a big improvement in the ride.

I can say that comparing similar trucks like Rusty or the '82 Explorer to Dad's, all 1/2 ton with about the same GVWR, the sway bars seemed to make the truck more "planted" on the road. I remember Ray installing them on his 1/2 ton and telling me that they made a huge difference.

But on the HD suspension, like Big Blue, they seem to stiffen things up. So I've not installed them on Big Blue after I did the D60 swap. My reasoning is that the ride is still fairly stiff and the handling is adequate. And I know that sway bars hurt the articulation when offroading, so I do w/o.

Gary, thank you for the clarification, very appreciated!

[Littlebeefy]

Gary, thank you for the clarification, very appreciated!

I like Gary's answer because it is real world on our trucks.

I will give you a little practical theory on it. Of course this only applies to street driving because sway bars are problematic in off-road situations when you need the articulation, as Gary pointed out. On the road, the sway bar is impacting the spring rate to help the vehicle "settle" when the contour of the road suddenly changes or when there is centripetal force from a change in direction. It is replacing a more gentle oscillation with a rapid flattening and responding much more urgently to pitch in turns with its own effective spring rate. That's why some people say it makes their suspension feel stiffer. In my mind the greatest single benefit to the sway bar is when you have to make an emergency evasive maneuver at high speeds (like on the highway). When you turn suddenly and then try to turn back, the compounding weight transfer can cause complete loss of control and lead to a roll-over in a lifted truck or anything with a high center of gravity (that's one of the reasons an SUV is 4 times as likely to roll over in a highway accident as a passenger car). While you can't completely eliminate that, having sway bars gives you a fighting chance to maintain control of your truck and keep the shiny side up in that situation.

In street driving, the general rule is stiffer sway bar up front means more understeer and stiffer sway bar in the rear means more oversteer. That again has to do with weight transfer and resulting camber. But it is complicated by IFS, FWD vs. RWD, slip in differential, and whether it is a Tuesday in a month that ends in Y. When it comes to stiffening front vs. rear vs. both, YMMV, so it depends on who you ask and what/how they drive.

[85lebaront2]

I like Gary's answer because it is real world on our trucks.

I will give you a little practical theory on it. Of course this only applies to street driving because sway bars are problematic in off-road situations when you need the articulation, as Gary pointed out. On the road, the sway bar is impacting the spring rate to help the vehicle "settle" when the contour of the road suddenly changes or when there is centripetal force from a change in direction. It is replacing a more gentle oscillation with a rapid flattening and responding much more urgently to pitch in turns with its own effective spring rate. That's why some people say it makes their suspension feel stiffer. In my mind the greatest single benefit to the sway bar is when you have to make an emergency evasive maneuver at high speeds (like on the highway). When you turn suddenly and then try to turn back, the compounding weight transfer can cause complete loss of control and lead to a roll-over in a lifted truck or anything with a high center of gravity (that's one of the reasons an SUV is 4 times as likely to roll over in a highway accident as a passenger car). While you can't completely eliminate that, having sway bars gives you a fighting chance to maintain control of your truck and keep the shiny side up in that situation.

In street driving, the general rule is stiffer sway bar up front means more understeer and stiffer sway bar in the rear means more oversteer. That again has to do with weight transfer and resulting camber. But it is complicated by IFS, FWD vs. RWD, slip in differential, and whether it is a Tuesday in a month that ends in Y. When it comes to stiffening front vs. rear vs. both, YMMV, so it depends on who you ask and what/how they drive.

Chad, you hit it quite well, on pickup trucks the frame does not have the longitudinal stiffness of most car frames against twisting, this coupled with heavy duty rear springs will actually cause the cab and bed to visibly move in relation to each other.

Having had what was described as a "brand new clapped out race car for the street" (a 1966 Shelby GT350 that I stiffened up the front and added a rear sway bar to) I actually have pictures of that car at an autocross course I was setting up at the Norfolk Ford Assembly plant parking lot, one going in to a 360° right hand loop where the right rear wheel is off the ground and one coming out of the loop where the right front wheel is off the ground.

I also had a 1978 Oldsmobile Delta 88 Royale Diesel, that was supposed to be ordered with the F41 handling package. It did have G78/15 radials instead of the F78s that were standard, but only the small front and no rear sway bar. 30 mins in the parts department and the required parts were ordered. Once installed, I also put 4 Koni shocks on. Car would go around an on or off ramp at double the posted "safe" speed with no problems. Other than the Diesel engine, it was essentially and unmarked police car. Scared more than a few people with it due to it having the GM B body "cop car" stance.