im sure this has been covered somewhere but i figured open

[mat in tn]

I'm sure this has been discussed here somewhere already but I'm asking anyway. i have an 81 f250 camper special with the 351m with c6. yesterday morning it took a few tries to get the starter to catch. it spins before engagement or slips out of engagement. either way. I had the engine out last month doing other work and inspected the plate since I had it off. all looked good and until now the starter had only done this a couple times but before I get it rebuilt or replace it, I would like to know if there is a pmgr upgrade that has been successful from another stock vehicle. I like the idea of being able to get a parts store option if I were to have an issue out on the open road so to speak.

[Gary Lewis]

I've been told that the M-block starters interchanged with the 460's. But I don't know that is true. In fact, our interchange page (Documentation/Interchange/Starters) says that the M-Blocks take a E1TZ 11002-AX and the 460's take a E1TZ 11002-CX.

So I'd go to Rock Auto and look up starters and see if they cross. If so, then you could go with a PMGR for a 460.

[mat in tn]

I've been told that the M-block starters interchanged with the 460's. But I don't know that is true. In fact, our interchange page (Documentation/Interchange/Starters) says that the M-Blocks take a E1TZ 11002-AX and the 460's take a E1TZ 11002-CX.

So I'd go to Rock Auto and look up starters and see if they cross. If so, then you could go with a PMGR for a 460.

that is exactly my natural plan but i figured i would ask it here first as i may not be the only one. like when that other kid asks the question you felt was stupid, but you still got your answer anyway. the whole class got schooled and it was that other kid that looked stupid. oh wait, now it's me. crap!

[mat in tn]

that is exactly my natural plan but i figured i would ask it here first as i may not be the only one. like when that other kid asks the question you felt was stupid, but you still got your answer anyway. the whole class got schooled and it was that other kid that looked stupid. oh wait, now it's me. crap!

as expected, the cross-reference search is still a bit of a mystery. the search for an 81 351m does not combine with 460 of the same year. no 460 listed. the years of the 460 had no 351m to cross with. the only difference I can glean from pictures is the absence of the top mounting ear being threaded yet the starter for the 1994 460 does have it. so, my question is whether anyone has successfully done this. upgrading the starter is such a beneficial thing but a reman for the original is only 25 bucks so no real hardship there.

[85pig]

as expected, the cross-reference search is still a bit of a mystery. the search for an 81 351m does not combine with 460 of the same year. no 460 listed. the years of the 460 had no 351m to cross with. the only difference I can glean from pictures is the absence of the top mounting ear being threaded yet the starter for the 1994 460 does have it. so, my question is whether anyone has successfully done this. upgrading the starter is such a beneficial thing but a reman for the original is only 25 bucks so no real hardship there.

You won't find one for trucks, I don't believe. Check out a 77 Lincoln Continental; they came with both the 400 and 460 - the 400 is just a stroked 351M. Same starter for both. (Rock Auto also lists that same starter number for a 79 F150 with a 5.8 (351M) under the AC Delco part number. I'll let you research that further, but I'd put money that a 460 starter would work, at least for an auto trans.

[Gary Lewis]

as expected, the cross-reference search is still a bit of a mystery. the search for an 81 351m does not combine with 460 of the same year. no 460 listed. the years of the 460 had no 351m to cross with. the only difference I can glean from pictures is the absence of the top mounting ear being threaded yet the starter for the 1994 460 does have it. so, my question is whether anyone has successfully done this. upgrading the starter is such a beneficial thing but a reman for the original is only 25 bucks so no real hardship there.

I think it is "we" as I want a PMGR starter for Dad's 400.

But I don't know what reference you are using as our starter page (Documentation/Engines/Starters) has both engines, as shown below, although the applications are pickup vs van for the early years. However, there was a change on both of them as of 1/81. Still, in the same year range the part numbers are different.

So I've asked Tim Meyer what the situation is since he built the engine for Dad's truck and I want to put a PMGR in it. We shall see.

[85pig]

I think it is "we" as I want a PMGR starter for Dad's 400.

But I don't know what reference you are using as our starter page (Documentation/Engines/Starters) has both engines, as shown below, although the applications are pickup vs van for the early years. However, there was a change on both of them as of 1/81. Still, in the same year range the part numbers are different.

So I've asked Tim Meyer what the situation is since he built the engine for Dad's truck and I want to put a PMGR in it. We shall see.

I think Ford went to a smaller starter body in the later years of the 351M/400. That may be the difference. A PMGR is going to be a whole lot smaller than that, I'm sure. Tim will know.

[Gary Lewis]

I think Ford went to a smaller starter body in the later years of the 351M/400. That may be the difference. A PMGR is going to be a whole lot smaller than that, I'm sure. Tim will know.

Tim pointed out that Powermaster's 9605 fits "Ford 351M, 400, 429, 460", as you can see here. So that tells me that they do interchange.

Here's a snippet of their page and you can see that both the 9605 and the 9505 fit those engines:

[mat in tn]

Tim pointed out that Powermaster's 9605 fits "Ford 351M, 400, 429, 460", as you can see here. So that tells me that they do interchange.

Here's a snippet of their page and you can see that both the 9605 and the 9505 fit those engines:

according to that I would say getting one for a 95 460 is a go. I will report on the results.

[Gary Lewis]

according to that I would say getting one for a 95 460 is a go. I will report on the results.

I agree as those should be PMGR. Please let us know as I want a PMGR for Dad's truck but want to use one from a local parts store rather than the high dollar Powermaster.