Weatherproof Connectors

classic Classic list List threaded Threaded
58 messages Options
123
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Weatherproof Connectors

Gary Lewis
Administrator
Just wanted y'all to know I'm trying out a new terminal kit.  It is this one from Amazon.  I just got it in today so haven't used it yet, but plan to do so on Big Blue's EFI upgrade and will let you know how it goes.

The spec's say that the terminals are good for 15 amps, but I'm not sure of that as there are what seem to be identical kits that say they are good for 12 amps.  And some of the pictures show round pins and others show smaller rectangular pins.  The kit I got has the smaller pins, but that isn't going to be a problem as the only application I have that will pull much current at all is the fog lights.  Currently (pun intended) they are only rated at 110 watts, total, so 12 amps would be just adequate.  However I think I'll double up on the pins for the fog lights, just to make sure.

Anyway, at $27 I couldn't resist.  (There I go again.  )

Gary, AKA "Gary fellow": Profile

Dad's: '81 F150 Ranger XLT 4x4: Down for restomod: Full-roller "stroked 351M" w/Trick Flow heads & intake, EEC-V SEFI/E4OD/3.50 gears w/Kevlar clutches
Blue: 2015 F150 Platinum 4x4 SuperCrew wearing Blue Jeans & sporting a 3.5L EB & Max Tow
Big Blue: 1985 F250HD 4x4: 460/ZF5/3.55's, D60 w/Ox locker & 10.25 Sterling/Trutrac, Blue Top & Borgeson, & EEC-V MAF/SEFI

Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: Weatherproof Connectors

85lebaront2
Administrator
Look like Generous Motors stuff. I usually just save the connectors from old harnesses and buy replacement male and female terminals.

The most common are the round wedgelock connectors in size from 1 to 8 commonly, 16 and 42, plus the odd later ones.

The small wedgelock terminals are 0.060" diameter and the large ones are 0.110" diameter.
PNs are:
0.060 male - E7EB-14461-BA - AUVECO 20475
0.060 female - E7EB-14487-AA - Clips & Fasteners A18408
0.110 male - D1AB-14461-AA - Dorman 85345, AUVECO 14887
0.110 female - D1AB-14488-CA - Dorman 85346, AUVECO 14888
Bill AKA "LOBO" Profile

"Getting old is inevitable, growing up is optional" Darth Vader 1986 F350 460 converted to MAF/SEFI, E4OD 12X3 1/2 rear brakes, traction loc 3:55 gear, 160 amp 3G alternator Wife's 2011 Flex Limited Daily Driver 2009 Flex Limited with factory tow package Project car 1986 Chrysler LeBaron convertible 2.2L Turbo II, modified A413

Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: Weatherproof Connectors

Gary Lewis
Administrator
Good info, Bill.  But I've not found a good source for the connectors themselves, so wanted to start with new ones.

I'll probably use a 2-pin connector for the backup lights as they are LED and the 12 amp limit is plenty.  But I'll probably use a 3-pin for the fog lights, one pin for the relay's coil and two for the output, so there's no worries about maybe using a hotter bulb.
Gary, AKA "Gary fellow": Profile

Dad's: '81 F150 Ranger XLT 4x4: Down for restomod: Full-roller "stroked 351M" w/Trick Flow heads & intake, EEC-V SEFI/E4OD/3.50 gears w/Kevlar clutches
Blue: 2015 F150 Platinum 4x4 SuperCrew wearing Blue Jeans & sporting a 3.5L EB & Max Tow
Big Blue: 1985 F250HD 4x4: 460/ZF5/3.55's, D60 w/Ox locker & 10.25 Sterling/Trutrac, Blue Top & Borgeson, & EEC-V MAF/SEFI

Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: Weatherproof Connectors

Rusty_S85
In reply to this post by Gary Lewis
Nice, will have to keep an eye out for this, I am not a fan of the deutsch style weatherproof connectors.  Still looking for what type connectors I will be using for the wiring coming out of my auxiliary fuse/relay box.
"Old Blue" - '56 Fairlane Town Sedan - 292-4V, Ford-O-Matic transmission, 3.22:1
'63 Belair 2dr sdn - 283-4V, Powerglide transmission, 4.56:1
'78 Cougar XR7 - 351-2V, FMX transmission, 2.75:1 9inch
"Bruno" - '82 F150 Flareside - 302-2V, C6 transmission, 2.75:1 9inch, 31x10.50-15 BFG KO2
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: Weatherproof Connectors

FuzzFace2
This post was updated on .
I have a kit like that for years now and used it when I wired in the custom gauges in the Javelin.

I also used a 2 pin on the back up wire harness to plug into the switch on both the T18 when I ran that transmission and now the NP435 in my 81 F100.
Dave ----

edit think I got mine from Summit
Dave G.
81 F100 flare side 300 six / AA OD / NP435 / 2.75 gear
http://cars.grantskingdom1.com/index.php/1980-Ford-F100?page=1
81 F100 style side 300 six/SROD parts truck -RIP
http://cars.grantskingdom1.com/index.php/1981-Ford-F100
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: Weatherproof Connectors

taskswap
I have that kit. It works fine. If the pins are rated to a given capacity, they may very well do what they say - a lot of them are derated by some safety margin and the connector bodies are so thick you'd never know they were overheating "a bit". I wouldn't know because I only use them for low current stuff like radios.

What I like about this kit is also what I hate about it. Those little red tabs are a fiddly extra step in assembling the connector compared to a round-pin style Weather-pack (or clone). Then again they do align the pins much better so you never have to wiggle the connectors to get the pins to line up like with some others.

If anybody is hesitant you can also get the Weatherpack clone here:
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0991M76G5

Regardless of which kit you use I strongly recommend not using a cheap stamped-style crimper. It's just a recipe for frustration. A ratchet-style with appropriate jaws will change your life. I have this one and it's "cheap but works fine":
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B08DRCRRCQ

I see it's discontinued now. Probably a classic "pump and dump" - lots of these vendors will throw something up on Amazon for a few months until negative reviews start bringing down sales, then nuke the listing and make a "new improved product release." But really anything should be fine as long as it has a 04B die.

It's very important that the crimped pin grips BOTH the wire and the insulation. There are two sets of tabs/fingers in the pin. The larger ones are meant to wrap around and grab the insulation to provide strain relief (it should look like a staple) while the smaller fingers grab the wire itself.



That pic doesn't look identical but it works basically the same. If you see negative reviews on connectors keep an open mind. I bet half the people that have issues with them are using the wrong crimper assuming they're "all basically the same". They're absolutely not. Some connectors have small wings that are designed to index the pin in the connector body, and also hold it in place. If you crimp them wrong they don't work right and the differences can be tiny but still cause trouble. IMO, if you get into crimping connections, I think you're best off investing into a type you think will do everything you need and spending more on a good crimper.
--
1981 F-250 Custom. 6.6L V8, 4 barrel Holley carb, ARA aftermarket A/C.
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: Weatherproof Connectors

Gary Lewis
Administrator
I'm glad you mentioned crimpers.  I'm actually planning to solder all of my connections into those terminals - even though I have a ratcheting crimper.  We'll see how that goes, but I'll roll the tabs over the wire itself and solder, and then roll the tabs into the insulation.

And these are the connectors with the wings.  Here's a snip from one of their pages.

Gary, AKA "Gary fellow": Profile

Dad's: '81 F150 Ranger XLT 4x4: Down for restomod: Full-roller "stroked 351M" w/Trick Flow heads & intake, EEC-V SEFI/E4OD/3.50 gears w/Kevlar clutches
Blue: 2015 F150 Platinum 4x4 SuperCrew wearing Blue Jeans & sporting a 3.5L EB & Max Tow
Big Blue: 1985 F250HD 4x4: 460/ZF5/3.55's, D60 w/Ox locker & 10.25 Sterling/Trutrac, Blue Top & Borgeson, & EEC-V MAF/SEFI

Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: Weatherproof Connectors

taskswap
I know soldering is tempting and in automotive it probably won't hurt anything, but it's not necessary and can do some harm in connectors not designed for it. These crimped terminals weren't just invented to improve termination speed. They also solve a problem in stranded wire connections where vibration can cause individual strands to fail/break. Solder introduces a stress point where the solder ends, and the individual strands of the wire vibrate independently. It takes a long time but over 5-10 years this can add up to weakened or failed connections. Also the solder can corrode over time even in a waterproof connector because when you plug it in, you seal in any moisture/humidity already in the air and it has nowhere to go. With the right crimper you get a gas-tight seal around the wires and strain relief just behind that so the solder isn't necessary.

That said it's probably fine, there's a ton of strain relief built into these things anyway. One thing I love about these connectors is how precisely everything gets aligned. No more bent pins...
--
1981 F-250 Custom. 6.6L V8, 4 barrel Holley carb, ARA aftermarket A/C.
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: Weatherproof Connectors

85lebaront2
Administrator
Funny you should mention security of the crimp. One of the tests I had to perform was a "pull out test" on crimped on cable ends for some pretty good size cables. It had a NAVSEA spec based on the size cable. The crimp was a hexagonal shape once made and the cables were copper "strands" with an overall OD from about 3/8" up to probably 3/4".

It could interesting, first getting a grip on the cable, and second getting a good straight pull on the lug. I had a few were the actual lug would pull apart without coming off.
Bill AKA "LOBO" Profile

"Getting old is inevitable, growing up is optional" Darth Vader 1986 F350 460 converted to MAF/SEFI, E4OD 12X3 1/2 rear brakes, traction loc 3:55 gear, 160 amp 3G alternator Wife's 2011 Flex Limited Daily Driver 2009 Flex Limited with factory tow package Project car 1986 Chrysler LeBaron convertible 2.2L Turbo II, modified A413

Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: Weatherproof Connectors

Gary Lewis
Administrator
In reply to this post by taskswap
Thanks.  Yes, I'm aware of the concern about vibration with soldering, but for all of my almost 75 years all of my connections have been soldered and so far I've not had a problem.  And as you said, given the "ton of strain relief built into these things" it isn't likely I'll have a problem.

But, I'll try to crimp a few of the terminals and see how that goes.  That's one of the reasons that I purchased the larger kit with 5 and 6-terminal connectors.  I don't think I'll need anything that big, and that gives me a lot of extra terminals to play with.
Gary, AKA "Gary fellow": Profile

Dad's: '81 F150 Ranger XLT 4x4: Down for restomod: Full-roller "stroked 351M" w/Trick Flow heads & intake, EEC-V SEFI/E4OD/3.50 gears w/Kevlar clutches
Blue: 2015 F150 Platinum 4x4 SuperCrew wearing Blue Jeans & sporting a 3.5L EB & Max Tow
Big Blue: 1985 F250HD 4x4: 460/ZF5/3.55's, D60 w/Ox locker & 10.25 Sterling/Trutrac, Blue Top & Borgeson, & EEC-V MAF/SEFI

Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: Weatherproof Connectors

Rusty_S85
In reply to this post by Gary Lewis
Gary Lewis wrote
I'm glad you mentioned crimpers.  I'm actually planning to solder all of my connections into those terminals - even though I have a ratcheting crimper.  We'll see how that goes, but I'll roll the tabs over the wire itself and solder, and then roll the tabs into the insulation.

And these are the connectors with the wings.  Here's a snip from one of their pages.

Ive been doing custom wiring using American Auto Wire at work before and doing it again as of right now.  I like just crimping those terminals and refuse to add solder as solder is not a industry standard.

I just crimp them as tight as I can get and give a good yank on the wire and the terminal.  If it holds before I crimp the ears into the insulation then its good to go.
"Old Blue" - '56 Fairlane Town Sedan - 292-4V, Ford-O-Matic transmission, 3.22:1
'63 Belair 2dr sdn - 283-4V, Powerglide transmission, 4.56:1
'78 Cougar XR7 - 351-2V, FMX transmission, 2.75:1 9inch
"Bruno" - '82 F150 Flareside - 302-2V, C6 transmission, 2.75:1 9inch, 31x10.50-15 BFG KO2
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: Weatherproof Connectors

Gary Lewis
Administrator
Just because it isn't the auto industry standard doesn't mean a process isn't good.  The auto industry would never use the larger size of wire or cable I use because the smaller size is marginally adequate and saves them money.  But by using larger wire my engine spins faster and my lights burn brighter.

And they don't solder for a number of reasons, a major one of which is the time required to do so.  I'm not bothered by the time it takes as I know my connection is electrically, mechanically, and environmentally tight.  (And I know that solder wicks up the wire and stiffens it, so I provide mechanical support for my connections.)

I'm not at all saying that crimping doesn't work.  The cars that we drive daily prove that crimps work as they are full of them.  But I will say that crimps should only be made with high-quality crimpers.  The stripper/crimpers sold at the parts stores don't qualify as it takes enormous pressure to fuse metal in a crimp like the auto manufacturers do.

Here's a chart from this AMP document that shows that both electrical and mechanical performance depend on the "crimp height", meaning how tightly crimped the connection is.  Obviously there is no scale on that chart so I can't say what amount of pressure it takes to make a good crimp.  But, I can say that if you scroll down and look at their tooling you'll find it is serious stuff.  (I happen to have some of those crimpers, but prefer to solder on small wire.  However, I crimp battery cables.)



Gary, AKA "Gary fellow": Profile

Dad's: '81 F150 Ranger XLT 4x4: Down for restomod: Full-roller "stroked 351M" w/Trick Flow heads & intake, EEC-V SEFI/E4OD/3.50 gears w/Kevlar clutches
Blue: 2015 F150 Platinum 4x4 SuperCrew wearing Blue Jeans & sporting a 3.5L EB & Max Tow
Big Blue: 1985 F250HD 4x4: 460/ZF5/3.55's, D60 w/Ox locker & 10.25 Sterling/Trutrac, Blue Top & Borgeson, & EEC-V MAF/SEFI

Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: Weatherproof Connectors

kramttocs
Administrator
With the Metri-pack 280's that I use I've only ever crimped (20-10awg) and they've always been very secure. This style terminals look the same. Just my .02
Scott
'Camano' 1986 F250 Supercab XLT Lariat 460/C6
'Chanute' 1980 F350 C&C 400/NP 435 - Gin Pole

But there ain't nothin' wrong with the radio
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: Weatherproof Connectors

Gary Lewis
Administrator
Well, I used this terminal kit for the first time today. I like the connectors, but...

My crimper is NOT the right one for these terminals.  It didn't provide a tight crimp of either the wire nor the insulation.  So I'm on the prowl for the right crimper.  Recommendations?

Given that my crimper didn't work I soldered the pins on the wires today and crimped the insulation lugs with pliers.  It worked, but I would like to try crimping.
Gary, AKA "Gary fellow": Profile

Dad's: '81 F150 Ranger XLT 4x4: Down for restomod: Full-roller "stroked 351M" w/Trick Flow heads & intake, EEC-V SEFI/E4OD/3.50 gears w/Kevlar clutches
Blue: 2015 F150 Platinum 4x4 SuperCrew wearing Blue Jeans & sporting a 3.5L EB & Max Tow
Big Blue: 1985 F250HD 4x4: 460/ZF5/3.55's, D60 w/Ox locker & 10.25 Sterling/Trutrac, Blue Top & Borgeson, & EEC-V MAF/SEFI

Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: Weatherproof Connectors

taskswap
I have https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B08DRCRRCQ which is no longer available. I use the 04B jaw from that kit. Those don't seem to be universal-standard names. I see https://www.amazon.com/IWISS-Ratcheting-Automotive-Connector-Non-Insulated/dp/B08G48C5NT for instance as an alternative and its A58B jaw looks the same as mine.

My crimping procedure. I use my fingers or needle nose to pinch the insulation "wings" of the pin a bit, they all seem to come too spread out for most crimpers. I like to put my crimper jaws in so the wider/insulation half of the jaw faces left and the wire/pin part faces right, just my preference. I crimp a click or two to grab the pin, stick the wire in, then crimp for real. One and done.
--
1981 F-250 Custom. 6.6L V8, 4 barrel Holley carb, ARA aftermarket A/C.
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: Weatherproof Connectors

Gary Lewis
Administrator
Thanks!  I just ordered that IWISS crimper on your recommendation.  Should be here Friday.  So while we have errands to run tomorrow, I'll wait to do those last three terminals until the crimper comes in.

And I'll give your process a go.
Gary, AKA "Gary fellow": Profile

Dad's: '81 F150 Ranger XLT 4x4: Down for restomod: Full-roller "stroked 351M" w/Trick Flow heads & intake, EEC-V SEFI/E4OD/3.50 gears w/Kevlar clutches
Blue: 2015 F150 Platinum 4x4 SuperCrew wearing Blue Jeans & sporting a 3.5L EB & Max Tow
Big Blue: 1985 F250HD 4x4: 460/ZF5/3.55's, D60 w/Ox locker & 10.25 Sterling/Trutrac, Blue Top & Borgeson, & EEC-V MAF/SEFI

Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: Weatherproof Connectors

taskswap
Does that mean you'll blame me if it's bad?  IWISS is like Harbor Freight in my experience. "Their air tools are good, their screwdrivers are cheap, and everything else is garbage." You know the drill. I'm pretty happy with my crimper though. I'm guessing it'll work out for you. If you can spare a few pins from your connector cut, do a few dry runs with the different die sizes. I THINK I had the best luck with the 1.0mm but the data sheets were worthless on this point. See what gives you the best crimp in the end and use that.
--
1981 F-250 Custom. 6.6L V8, 4 barrel Holley carb, ARA aftermarket A/C.
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: Weatherproof Connectors

Gary Lewis
Administrator
Yes, I'll blame you.  

Seriously though, I've needed a good crimper so was just looking for a recommendation.  I've used IWISS before with good luck, so was happy that's what you recommended.

As for spare pins, that's a big reason I went with the 780-piece kit.  It gives me a chance to make some mistakes.  So I'll try one and see what happens.

Thanks again.
Gary, AKA "Gary fellow": Profile

Dad's: '81 F150 Ranger XLT 4x4: Down for restomod: Full-roller "stroked 351M" w/Trick Flow heads & intake, EEC-V SEFI/E4OD/3.50 gears w/Kevlar clutches
Blue: 2015 F150 Platinum 4x4 SuperCrew wearing Blue Jeans & sporting a 3.5L EB & Max Tow
Big Blue: 1985 F250HD 4x4: 460/ZF5/3.55's, D60 w/Ox locker & 10.25 Sterling/Trutrac, Blue Top & Borgeson, & EEC-V MAF/SEFI

Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: Weatherproof Connectors

Rusty_S85
In reply to this post by Gary Lewis
I had to take two crimps apart at work today using the same tool I plan to use on my connectors.  No solder but what happened is when crimping a double wire terminal it deformed the end and in the process of straightening it out which I had done about sixty times before I had two that just broke just past the crimp making the terminal useless.

It took me close to ten minutes for each terminal to disassemble it as once I got the crimp off the wire insulation the crimp on the wire itself would not let go, I had to use a small flat headed screw driver to gently lift the crimped wings up enough to get the wire to come out as I couldnt cut it as the wire was the precise length it needed to be.

The way I do the crimps with this crimper is I do an initial crimp using the 14 - 16 AWG position then I move to the 18 - 20 AWG position and it tightens the crimp up more.  Then if the wire still is questionable I will move to the next smaller position.

But like you I am seriously thinking about investing in a ratchet crimper for these kind of terminals as the extra cost should result in a better crimp not just in function but in appearance as well.  Plus I need to look into some made for crimping double wide terminals that are designed to crimp two wires into.  I will need those to link all my relay grounds together and while you can do it with a single width crimp it just isnt able to properly grab into the insulation of the two wires.
"Old Blue" - '56 Fairlane Town Sedan - 292-4V, Ford-O-Matic transmission, 3.22:1
'63 Belair 2dr sdn - 283-4V, Powerglide transmission, 4.56:1
'78 Cougar XR7 - 351-2V, FMX transmission, 2.75:1 9inch
"Bruno" - '82 F150 Flareside - 302-2V, C6 transmission, 2.75:1 9inch, 31x10.50-15 BFG KO2
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: Weatherproof Connectors

taskswap
Once you use a ratcheting style you'll never go back to the stamped/riveted kind. In addition to making much better crimps they're easier on your hands too.

I also love how perfectly they "staple" the insulation wings into the insulation of the wire. I don't have any data to support this, but my instinct is if you do decide to drop a spot of solder in there, I believe the mechanical support where the insulation starts would provide the strain relief to stop any fatigue from vibration. Again, just my opinion.

If you use them for ring/spade terminals or splices, pay attention to the crimp heads. Most of these have two different styles with the same (red/blue/yellow) gauge color coding. One is for heat shrink style terminals and one is for standard. The heat shrink terminals are much softer and fatter before they're shrunk, and if you use the wrong head it won't crimp them right.
--
1981 F-250 Custom. 6.6L V8, 4 barrel Holley carb, ARA aftermarket A/C.
123