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Power steering belts "matched set"

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26ftcobraBBF

Power steering belts "matched set"

Good evening all I have a question regarding power steering belts. My power steering pump takes two belts recently I noticed that one belt seemed quite a bit looser than the other belt I assumed somebody had replaced just one belt and not the other. Assuming that one of them was older and had been stretched already. So I went and bought two new belts and I'm getting the same result one is looser than the other. They won't tighten evenly. So going back to the auto parts store the guy there That sold me the belts told me something about a "matched set". He said I need to find a match set that are pre-stretched and length is checked to be exactly the same. What I purchase from him previous was two singles. Is this matched set a real thing or am I missing something.
Thank you

Mike
'85 Ford Cobra Econoline E350 7.5L carbureted thing of beauty

ArdWrknTrk

Re: Power steering belts "matched set"

Administrator

Mike, I have the same issue.

A long time ago you could buy 'matched set' belts from Gates.
But I don't think that is the case anymore.

So, yes it is (or was) a real thing.
Since I have to deal with it I will let you know what I find when I talk with my commercial guys at the warehouse.

Jim,
Lil'Red is a '87 F250 HD, 4.10's, 1356 4x4, Zf-5, 3G, PMGR, Saginaw PS, desmogged with a Holley 80508 and Performer intake.
Too much other stuff to mention.

26ftcobraBBF

Re: Power steering belts "matched set"

Thank you Jim looking forward to hearing from you and getting it done right.

Mike
'85 Ford Cobra Econoline E350 7.5L carbureted thing of beauty

Rembrant

Re: Power steering belts "matched set"

In reply to this post by ArdWrknTrk

ArdWrknTrk wrote

Mike, I have the same issue.

A long time ago you could buy 'matched set' belts from Gates.
But I don't think that is the case anymore.

So, yes it is (or was) a real thing.
Since I have to deal with it I will let you know what I find when I talk with my commercial guys at the warehouse.

I've never had to buy a matched automotive set, but I know it is common in the industrial world. We used to buy matched sets all the time. Sometimes, it was a matter of the guy going through the belts he had in-stock to make-up a matched set. They get all mixed up in shipping, but it is often the case that they have belts from the same batch in-stock...they just don't know it until they look.

Here's some reading from Gates: https://ww2.gates.com/IF/facts/documents/Gf000194.pdf

1994 F150 4x2 Flareside. 5.0 w/MAF, 4R70W, stock.
1984 F150 4X2 Flareside. Mild 302 w/ 5spd. Sold.
1980 F150 4X4 Flareside. 300i6 w/ 5spd. Sold in 2021.
1980 F100 4X2 Flareside. 351w/2bbl w/NP435. Sold in 1995

85lebaront2

Re: Power steering belts "matched set"

Administrator

The 460s with full dress (AC, PS, Alt, and dual air pumps) ran a matched set on the power steering pump drive as it was also the fan/water pump primary drive. The AC belt also crossed the water pump pulley but it was more of an idler on the unloaded side. Alternator had a dedicated belt from the crank pulley to it, and a little skinny belt from the alternator drove the dual air pumps.

Here is a picture from the AC and PS side showing the three main drive belts, and yes, the PS set was a matched pair.

Bill AKA "LOBO" Profile

"Getting old is inevitable, growing up is optional" Darth Vader 1986 F350 460 converted to MAF/SEFI, E4OD 12X3 1/2 rear brakes, traction loc 3:55 gear, 160 amp 3G alternator Wife's 2011 Flex Limited Daily Driver 2009 Flex Limited with factory tow package Project car 1986 Chrysler LeBaron convertible 2.2L Turbo II, modified A413

Gary Lewis

Re: Power steering belts "matched set"

Administrator

Yes, "matched set" was a thing. I used to have to buy them for my Super Bee which used them on the big York air conditioning compressor. Boy, would those belts gallop if they weren't matched.

That got me thinking that I'm glad I have serpentine belts (yes, Bill, actually "polygroove") for Big Blue. Then I thought "serpentine, serpentine" and couldn't help myself.

Gary, AKA "Gary fellow": Profile

Dad's: '81 F150 Ranger XLT 4x4: Down for restomod: Full-roller "stroked 351M" w/Trick Flow heads & intake, EEC-V SEFI/E4OD/3.50 gears w/Kevlar clutches
Blue: 2015 F150 Platinum 4x4 SuperCrew wearing Blue Jeans & sporting a 3.5L EB & Max Tow
Big Blue: 1985 F250HD 4x4: 460/ZF5/3.55's, D60 w/Ox locker & 10.25 Sterling/Trutrac, Blue Top & Borgeson, & EEC-V MAF/SEFI

85lebaront2

Re: Power steering belts "matched set"

Administrator

Superbee should have had an Airtemp RV2 compressor unless it was an aftermarket system, and those RV2 units did "gallop" almost as bad as a Harley at idle. Once the rpm came up they didn't have the "drone" of the Tecumseh or York twins.

Bill AKA "LOBO" Profile

Gary Lewis

Re: Power steering belts "matched set"

Administrator

You are right!

Yes, it would have been a Chrysler Airtemp. And the belts galloped badly. There was no way to get them to stop, but a matched set came pretty close.

Gary, AKA "Gary fellow": Profile

grumpin

Re: Power steering belts "matched set"

In reply to this post by Gary Lewis

That’s funny!

Dane
1986 F250HD SC XLT Lariat 4x4 460 C6-Sold
1992 Bronco XLT 4x4 351W E4OD
1998 GMC Sierra SLE K1500 350 4L60E
Arizona

ArdWrknTrk

Re: Power steering belts "matched set"

Administrator

In reply to this post by Rembrant

I've read what Gates has to say about their 'tighter production tolerances'.
That doesn't change the fact that I can't seem to get a pair of belts that tension correctly.
And I don't want to put a huge amount of tension on one belt, destroying the bushings in my water and power steering pumps.

I know that some industrial belts are like multiple V-belts in a single carcass.
I wonder if I can split a pair out of one of those?

As it is now I have to buy belts for a van because the Saginaw pump pulley is a different diameter than my old C2.

I hope to investigate this shortly.

Jim,
Lil'Red is a '87 F250 HD, 4.10's, 1356 4x4, Zf-5, 3G, PMGR, Saginaw PS, desmogged with a Holley 80508 and Performer intake.
Too much other stuff to mention.

Rembrant

Re: Power steering belts "matched set"

ArdWrknTrk wrote

I know that some industrial belts are like multiple V-belts in a single carcass.
I wonder if I can split a pair out of one of those?

Good question. I know that the common industrial A-B series V-belts are not the same as automotive V-belts, but I don't know what the difference is. I know the guys in the belt shops are always complaining about car guys coming in...lol. (Edit...I should say they used to complain...not many v-belt applications left on the road where I live. Just the classics in the summer, and none in the winter months).

ArdWrknTrk

Re: Power steering belts "matched set"

Administrator

Well, ill try not to tic off the guys at the power transmission warehouse.

I'm still going to be looking for a matched set from a quality manufacturer. Dayco, Goodyear, Gates or something else.

Jim,
Lil'Red is a '87 F250 HD, 4.10's, 1356 4x4, Zf-5, 3G, PMGR, Saginaw PS, desmogged with a Holley 80508 and Performer intake.
Too much other stuff to mention.

FuzzFace2

Re: Power steering belts "matched set"

In reply to this post by ArdWrknTrk

ArdWrknTrk wrote

I know that some industrial belts are like multiple V-belts in a single carcass.
I wonder if I can split a pair out of one of those?

Yep At the hospital a lot of my AHU would run 4 to 6 belts we called mats that way.
They looked like they for got to cut the belts apart to make singles.

The 2 & 3 belt units I could get matched single belts but we are talking B & C wide belts.

Also some of the single industrial belts were green to tell you they were industrial belts.
They would last longer than the normal black belts.
Dave ----

Dave G.
81 F100 flare side 300 six / AA OD / NP435 / 2.75 gear
http://cars.grantskingdom1.com/index.php/1980-Ford-F100?page=1
81 F100 style side 300 six/SROD parts truck -RIP
http://cars.grantskingdom1.com/index.php/1981-Ford-F100

26ftcobraBBF

Re: Power steering belts "matched set"

In reply to this post by Rembrant

Rembrandt thank you for the link. That was excellent information to have in my back pocket while chasing these belts down. There are 8 parts stored in my area I had to continuously reiterate "matched set", and explain to more than half of them. Thanks to you I went into this educated about what I needed. A couple of the parts houses told me they had them, then when I showed up they weren't a match. I even had carquest which had one belt call the other car quest that had one belt they determined they were a matched set,I show up to pick up the second belt and no they were not.

Last option was the smallest part store in town just a mom and pop joint i had never been in there. The place always look like it was on the verge of being pushed out by the the corporate parts stored. But guess what?? A matched set of Gates...Victory!!

No more squeeling like a pig.
Again the shop talk here is spot on . Thanks everyone for the lesson.

Mike
'85 Ford Cobra Econoline E350 7.5L carbureted thing of beauty

ArdWrknTrk

Re: Power steering belts "matched set"

Administrator

What number are you using Mike?

15550?

Jim,
Lil'Red is a '87 F250 HD, 4.10's, 1356 4x4, Zf-5, 3G, PMGR, Saginaw PS, desmogged with a Holley 80508 and Performer intake.
Too much other stuff to mention.

Gary Lewis

Re: Power steering belts "matched set"

Administrator

In reply to this post by 26ftcobraBBF

Yippee! Perseverance, combined with education, pays off.

My guess is that the people in the mom & pop joint have been in the business for a long time, including back in the pre-serpentine day when it wasn't unusual to have dual belts. But the kids running the computers in the corporate parts stores have never seen that need.

I walked into O'Reilly's the other day needing speedometer cable lube. The guy behind the counter asked "Year and model?"

Gary, AKA "Gary fellow": Profile

1986F150Six

Re: Power steering belts "matched set"

Administrator

https://ww2.gates.com/IF/facts/documents/Gf000194.pdf

ArdWrknTrk

Re: Power steering belts "matched set"

Administrator

Like i said to Cory, I don't care what Gates says, it doesn't work in practice.
I've gone to the warehouse and pulled adjacent belts out of a fresh case and they don't measure the same on a belt checker.

Either their manufacturing tolerances are not nearly what they would like you to believe or it is an outright lie for some marketing purposes.
I will continue to look for a matched pair, and when I do I'll change out my power steering belts for a pair I can tension together.

Jim,
Lil'Red is a '87 F250 HD, 4.10's, 1356 4x4, Zf-5, 3G, PMGR, Saginaw PS, desmogged with a Holley 80508 and Performer intake.
Too much other stuff to mention.

26ftcobraBBF

Re: Power steering belts "matched set"

In reply to this post by 1986F150Six

Gary funny you mentioned O'Riley's, I did the same there, I was returning an accelerator pump I bought and ended up not using. I gave it to the kid behind the computer with my receipt, and he looks as the package and says, with a cocky attitude" where's the rest of it, where's the pump" that was a good laugh, well deserved I might add.

Jim, Im using Gates 7545. Before I found these the guy at Advance Auto was going to order me the green stripe Gates, but said they don't come in 3/8...

Mike
'85 Ford Cobra Econoline E350 7.5L carbureted thing of beauty

ArdWrknTrk

Re: Power steering belts "matched set"

Administrator

Thank you for that tidbit, Mike!

Jim,
Lil'Red is a '87 F250 HD, 4.10's, 1356 4x4, Zf-5, 3G, PMGR, Saginaw PS, desmogged with a Holley 80508 and Performer intake.
Too much other stuff to mention.