Hvac controls.

classic Classic list List threaded Threaded
20 messages Options
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Hvac controls.

IDIBronco
I have been looking through the documentation, but suspect a simple question posted may dig up information from the experts faster...

My question is if the heater boxes interchange between bullnose trucks and bricknoses.  

I had a 1988 bronco that had a fully cable operated hvac setup.  It would be nice if such a thing could be readily swapped into a 1984 dash, or convert the vacuum box over to cable.  I have never had boxes out side by side to see if it is possible.  

The big draw for me is the manual selectability of the recirculating blend door, and manual compressor clutch switch.  I could also fully delete the vacuum system on the bronco then.  Just a passing thought that I hope someone out there has some knowledge about.
1985 Bronco 6.9 IDI,C6 T19, hydroboost brakes, 8 Lug coil sprung D44ttb, 10.25 3:55, modified BRICKNOSE warn classic bumper, 8274 warn winch, Saginaw Conversion Currently looking to get Non Defrost rear window for a bronco Available to trade or sell Parting a 1991 F250 extended cab, 5.8, zf5 4x4 Parting a 1980 E150 4 speed manual van
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: Hvac controls.

Gary Lewis
Administrator
Yes, I think that is very possible.  I just, today, put a 1990 underhood plenum on my '85 and it fit like a glove, although you have to make a minor change to the wiring and vacuum lines.  And Bill/85lebaront2 has put a later in-cab A/C system in his '86.

But he'd be the one to ask about that specifically.
Gary, AKA "Gary fellow": Profile

Dad's: '81 F150 Ranger XLT 4x4: Down for restomod: Full-roller "stroked 351M" w/Trick Flow heads & intake, EEC-V SEFI/E4OD/3.50 gears w/Kevlar clutches
Blue: 2015 F150 Platinum 4x4 SuperCrew wearing Blue Jeans & sporting a 3.5L EB & Max Tow
Big Blue: 1985 F250HD 4x4: 460/ZF5/3.55's, D60 w/Ox locker in front & 10.25 Spicer/Trutrac in back, & EEC-V MAF/SEFI

Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: Hvac controls.

Ford F834
Administrator
In reply to this post by IDIBronco
Was this exclusive to Bronco? My ‘89 parts truck still uses vacuum. I would be interested in a full cable set up for the reasons you mentioned... although I want cruise control on my crew cab and that still requires vacuum.
SHORT BED 4-DOOR DIESEL: 1986 F350 4x4 under construction-- 7.3 IDIT ZF5+GVOD

STRAIGHT SIX 4X4: 1981 F150 2wd to 4x4-- 300 I6 close ratio diesel T19, hydroboost brakes, Saginaw steering

BIG F: 1995 F-Superduty under construction— converting to 6.9L IDI diesel ZF5+DNE2
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: Hvac controls.

IDIBronco


Here is a picture of the control unit.  I only have seen it in the Bronco I owned several years ago.  I didn't realize at the time it was particularly special.  I know my brothers bronco (a similar year) didn't have this control setup and was a vacuum operated selector.  That bronco has been gone several years, but as soon as I got a different full size ford I missed the control.  It gave me the ability to vent or recirculated air in any position, plus completely control when the ac compressor would run.

Blow cold air at your feet if you so choose even with or without outside air.

At the time I had thought maybe it was a dealer installed ac system to use cables already in the dash with a possible heat only system, but I never researched it then.  Google doesn't turn up much information either.  I do know the control unit is "similar" (the same?) on the dash front as the controls in my 1984 bronco2.  The 88 fullsize had that "similar" unit.  Perhaps I need to look at how the cable ends mount on the B2 hvac box to determine if the parts could interchange onto my big bronco in place of the vacuum stuff.

I guess I need to get under the hood of the parts B2 and take pictures to compare.  

I was hoping it was some common knowledge for someone here.

When the rain stops I will try to see if any useful observation can come from the b2...
1985 Bronco 6.9 IDI,C6 T19, hydroboost brakes, 8 Lug coil sprung D44ttb, 10.25 3:55, modified BRICKNOSE warn classic bumper, 8274 warn winch, Saginaw Conversion Currently looking to get Non Defrost rear window for a bronco Available to trade or sell Parting a 1991 F250 extended cab, 5.8, zf5 4x4 Parting a 1980 E150 4 speed manual van
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: Hvac controls.

Gary Lewis
Administrator
That's an interesting control!  I'd love to have all that flexibility.

I checked our page at Documentation/HVAC/HVAC Systems and we didn't have the Bronco/U-Series controls in.  I've added the ones for the Bullnose trucks, but you are talking about the later Broncos as well as the BII, so I'll give the later part of the full list here.  The "B" is the Bronco II, and if you can get an ID # of it I should be able to cross-ref to a part #.

Gary, AKA "Gary fellow": Profile

Dad's: '81 F150 Ranger XLT 4x4: Down for restomod: Full-roller "stroked 351M" w/Trick Flow heads & intake, EEC-V SEFI/E4OD/3.50 gears w/Kevlar clutches
Blue: 2015 F150 Platinum 4x4 SuperCrew wearing Blue Jeans & sporting a 3.5L EB & Max Tow
Big Blue: 1985 F250HD 4x4: 460/ZF5/3.55's, D60 w/Ox locker in front & 10.25 Spicer/Trutrac in back, & EEC-V MAF/SEFI

Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: Hvac controls.

IDIBronco
E7TH-18532-AA

Found in a quick Google search...

But still a lot of questions about the box differences.

Also after some quick looking in my files, I seem to now think that bronco in question was an early 87 model.  Maybe it was a short window of time that got that control unit.
1985 Bronco 6.9 IDI,C6 T19, hydroboost brakes, 8 Lug coil sprung D44ttb, 10.25 3:55, modified BRICKNOSE warn classic bumper, 8274 warn winch, Saginaw Conversion Currently looking to get Non Defrost rear window for a bronco Available to trade or sell Parting a 1991 F250 extended cab, 5.8, zf5 4x4 Parting a 1980 E150 4 speed manual van
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: Hvac controls.

85lebaront2
Administrator
In reply to this post by Ford F834
The later all electronic cruise control fits where the current vacuum unit goes and uses the same steering wheel controls. You would have to add the updated "dump" switch (the one replacing the fire starting one) and get the harness plug for the actuator with it. They started in 1993 so they were on the mechanical injection IDI Diesels.
Bill Profile

"Getting old is inevitable, growing up is optional" Darth Vader 1986 F-350 460 converted to MAF/SEFI, E4OD 12X3 1/2 rear brakes, traction loc 3:55 gear, 160 amp 3G alternator Wife's 2011 Flex Limited Daily Driver 1994 Taurus LX Project car 1986 Chrysler LeBaron convertible 2.2L Turbo II, modified A413

Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: Hvac controls.

IDIBronco
In reply to this post by IDIBronco


This is a picture of the control unit from the bronco2 parked outside.
1985 Bronco 6.9 IDI,C6 T19, hydroboost brakes, 8 Lug coil sprung D44ttb, 10.25 3:55, modified BRICKNOSE warn classic bumper, 8274 warn winch, Saginaw Conversion Currently looking to get Non Defrost rear window for a bronco Available to trade or sell Parting a 1991 F250 extended cab, 5.8, zf5 4x4 Parting a 1980 E150 4 speed manual van
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: Hvac controls.

Gary Lewis
Administrator
In reply to this post by 85lebaront2
The number 18532 doesn't appear in the MPC.  I'll see if I can cross-ref it when I get out to the shop.

Would really be interesting to see if the one in that B-II can be used in an F-Series.  Or if there's one in an '87/88 Bronco that will.  Note in the snippet below that there was one for 1987/88 Broncos before 4/88 and one for 88 Broncos after 4/88.  And that the 87/89 control mentions "vac system".  Does that imply that not all had vacuum systems?

From my time perusing the MPC I've come to believe that many different people entered the data.  So it might have been a different person that added the "87/89" line than did the earlier ones.  And, one person could have assumed we should know that they have vacuum while another might not.

I'm going to ask Bill/Numberdummy.

Gary, AKA "Gary fellow": Profile

Dad's: '81 F150 Ranger XLT 4x4: Down for restomod: Full-roller "stroked 351M" w/Trick Flow heads & intake, EEC-V SEFI/E4OD/3.50 gears w/Kevlar clutches
Blue: 2015 F150 Platinum 4x4 SuperCrew wearing Blue Jeans & sporting a 3.5L EB & Max Tow
Big Blue: 1985 F250HD 4x4: 460/ZF5/3.55's, D60 w/Ox locker in front & 10.25 Spicer/Trutrac in back, & EEC-V MAF/SEFI

Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: Hvac controls.

IDIBronco


Well I tore the bronco2 dash apart before jumping into my paying work today...  the panel mounts on the ends like I think the 87-91 bricknose trucks mount.  It is also physically to wide to fit the dash space where the bull nose panel sits, but I am not opposed to the light modification probably required to make it fit.  

E47h 19808 aa







I took a walk over to the 1991 parts truck and the b2 control would bolt right in...

As much as I like the bull nose interior I can see an advantage or 2 to brick nose interiors...

Realistically the b2 had some great features I wish the full size trucks had...  the 84 came with 2 dash mounted speakers under a steel removable panels ay either end of the dash and only a small vinyl pad...  hvac controls where superior (in my opinion), the tilt mechinism was out past the key tumbler so there where no issues related to starting from the tilt...  key tumbler was removable without removing the steering wheel.

I wonder now if the column itself could be swapped in.  Perhaps I will have to pull that out and check into it when I get more free time.  

For now though, it looks like without serious modification (or perhaps a different year truck 78-79 cable operated controlled?) I will be stuck with vacuum operation...  I will dig it this deeper after I get done with work today.  See if I can find any images of the older trucks parts, or maybe vans, or maybe some other ford, Lincoln,  Mercury of the era.  I was just a really big fan of this setup.

Or maybe go bullnose sheetmetal/brick nose interior in the future?  More to follow later.
1985 Bronco 6.9 IDI,C6 T19, hydroboost brakes, 8 Lug coil sprung D44ttb, 10.25 3:55, modified BRICKNOSE warn classic bumper, 8274 warn winch, Saginaw Conversion Currently looking to get Non Defrost rear window for a bronco Available to trade or sell Parting a 1991 F250 extended cab, 5.8, zf5 4x4 Parting a 1980 E150 4 speed manual van
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: Hvac controls.

Gary Lewis
Administrator
I can't find E47h 19808 aa in the cross-ref.  Not saying it isn't there as it should be, but I can't find it.  However, I did send Bill/Numberdummy a note.  Maybe he can help.
Gary, AKA "Gary fellow": Profile

Dad's: '81 F150 Ranger XLT 4x4: Down for restomod: Full-roller "stroked 351M" w/Trick Flow heads & intake, EEC-V SEFI/E4OD/3.50 gears w/Kevlar clutches
Blue: 2015 F150 Platinum 4x4 SuperCrew wearing Blue Jeans & sporting a 3.5L EB & Max Tow
Big Blue: 1985 F250HD 4x4: 460/ZF5/3.55's, D60 w/Ox locker in front & 10.25 Spicer/Trutrac in back, & EEC-V MAF/SEFI

Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: Hvac controls.

IDIBronco




From the b2 control...
1985 Bronco 6.9 IDI,C6 T19, hydroboost brakes, 8 Lug coil sprung D44ttb, 10.25 3:55, modified BRICKNOSE warn classic bumper, 8274 warn winch, Saginaw Conversion Currently looking to get Non Defrost rear window for a bronco Available to trade or sell Parting a 1991 F250 extended cab, 5.8, zf5 4x4 Parting a 1980 E150 4 speed manual van
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: Hvac controls.

1986F150Six
In reply to this post by Gary Lewis
Gary Lewis wrote
I can't find E47h 19808 aa in the cross-ref.  Not saying it isn't there as it should be, but I can't find it.  However, I did send Bill/Numberdummy a note.  Maybe he can help.
I found this, but it is listed as: E87H-19808-AA. It is listed as being for Bronco 11 and Ranger.

https://www.ebay.com/itm/87-88-Ford-Bronco-II-Ranger-Truck-Heater-Control-W-AC-OEM-PART-E87H-19808-AA-/202807759656


1986 F150 4.9L manual O.D. 3.08 Duraspark MSD ignition w/ no EGR
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: Hvac controls.

ArdWrknTrk
Administrator
In reply to this post by IDIBronco
Looks like my '87, but I don't have the AC button.


 Jim,
Lil'Red is a '87 F250 HD, 4.10's, 1356 4x4, Zf-5, 3G, PMGR, Saginaw PS, desmogged with an Edelbrock 1826 and Performer intake.
Too much other stuff to mention.
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: Hvac controls.

IDIBronco
ArdWrknTrk wrote
Looks like my '87, but I don't have the AC button.


What does the underdash portion of your 87 truck look like, specifically the cable end conections?  I have been trying to find pictures of the cable ends where they mount like a vacuum motor would mount.  I am guessing they have some brackets that screw down and you could interchange vacuum motor for this setup...

If it isn't too much troube see if you can grab a few of those images please, I would imagine snapping a picture of the outside air blend door actuator would be pretty easy to get a picture of under the hood.  It would be much appreciated.

Also, after going through Steve83's supermotors site I found an interesting diagram.  



I am definitely adding these parts to the must be included in final incarnation of my bronco/truck project.  I would be willing to swap the whole dash out to bricknose if required to gain this set of controls, but perhaps they can be mounted into the bullnose dash.

Research continues.  



1985 Bronco 6.9 IDI,C6 T19, hydroboost brakes, 8 Lug coil sprung D44ttb, 10.25 3:55, modified BRICKNOSE warn classic bumper, 8274 warn winch, Saginaw Conversion Currently looking to get Non Defrost rear window for a bronco Available to trade or sell Parting a 1991 F250 extended cab, 5.8, zf5 4x4 Parting a 1980 E150 4 speed manual van
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: Hvac controls.

Gary Lewis
Administrator
I did get a response back from Bill/Numberdummy this morning.  After a misunderstanding as to what the question was, I posted:

Thanks, but the question is whether there was an all-cable, meaning no vacuum, version of the factory-installed A/C controls for the 1987 Broncos.
We aren't looking for the cables, but to understand if there was such a control system.

To which he said:

No all cable system...

So, I don't know what's going on.  But I'm interested and following along.

Also, it looks like "100%" worked nicely.  
Gary, AKA "Gary fellow": Profile

Dad's: '81 F150 Ranger XLT 4x4: Down for restomod: Full-roller "stroked 351M" w/Trick Flow heads & intake, EEC-V SEFI/E4OD/3.50 gears w/Kevlar clutches
Blue: 2015 F150 Platinum 4x4 SuperCrew wearing Blue Jeans & sporting a 3.5L EB & Max Tow
Big Blue: 1985 F250HD 4x4: 460/ZF5/3.55's, D60 w/Ox locker in front & 10.25 Spicer/Trutrac in back, & EEC-V MAF/SEFI

Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: Hvac controls.

IDIBronco
Gary Lewis wrote
Also, it looks like "100%" worked nicely.  
Technically, I cheated...  I just downloaded the image at a resolution I liked and the uploaded it.  I did mention where it came from though.  It made it easy to zoom in and look at even on my small phone screen.
1985 Bronco 6.9 IDI,C6 T19, hydroboost brakes, 8 Lug coil sprung D44ttb, 10.25 3:55, modified BRICKNOSE warn classic bumper, 8274 warn winch, Saginaw Conversion Currently looking to get Non Defrost rear window for a bronco Available to trade or sell Parting a 1991 F250 extended cab, 5.8, zf5 4x4 Parting a 1980 E150 4 speed manual van
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: Hvac controls.

FuzzFace2
IDIBronco wrote
Gary Lewis wrote
Also, it looks like "100%" worked nicely.  
Technically, I cheated...  I just downloaded the image at a resolution I liked and the uploaded it.  I did mention where it came from though.  It made it easy to zoom in and look at even on my small phone screen.
The only thing I see or don't see is if you have 2 tanks or Bronco rear window, where does the switch go?
Was it placed somewhere else and if so where / how?
Dave ----
Dave G.
81 F100 flare side 300 six / AA OD / NP435 / 2.75 gear
http://cars.grantskingdom1.com/index.php/1980-Ford-F100?page=1
81 F100 style side 300 six/SROD parts truck -RIP
http://cars.grantskingdom1.com/index.php/1981-Ford-F100
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: Hvac controls.

IDIBronco
My bronco is unique...

I got fed up with the power window issue recently and converted to a rear manual window.  While a little unorthodox, I am very pleased with the change.  The lack of that switch is no issue for me.  I may have interest in figuring out a control switch for a rear heat/ac fan (if I ever get that far down the to do list that I install a rear unit...), but I believe some use of relays could accomplish the same result with the rear fan slaved to the front fan.  Maybe with a high speed fan override for the rear to run the on high regardless of front setting.
1985 Bronco 6.9 IDI,C6 T19, hydroboost brakes, 8 Lug coil sprung D44ttb, 10.25 3:55, modified BRICKNOSE warn classic bumper, 8274 warn winch, Saginaw Conversion Currently looking to get Non Defrost rear window for a bronco Available to trade or sell Parting a 1991 F250 extended cab, 5.8, zf5 4x4 Parting a 1980 E150 4 speed manual van
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: Hvac controls.

FuzzFace2
Could you use the wiring for the rear window to run the fan and just install a 2nd rear fan switch.
My 02 Durango has a front / rear HVAC. I can control the rear system from the front and then switch the front to rear control and there is a control panel in the top panel just above my head that they can use if they want.

IIRC my 73 Toyota LC had a rear heater / fan and the fan switch was on the dash. I cant remember if it was 1 speed or more as its been to long ago.
Dave ----
Dave G.
81 F100 flare side 300 six / AA OD / NP435 / 2.75 gear
http://cars.grantskingdom1.com/index.php/1980-Ford-F100?page=1
81 F100 style side 300 six/SROD parts truck -RIP
http://cars.grantskingdom1.com/index.php/1981-Ford-F100