1983 F150 5.8L 351W 4x4 Project

After many months, I'm finally going to take steps to replace the Motorcraft Variable Venturi Carb in my truck.  I've had the carb rebuilt, I've tried to make adjustments; but, at the end of the day, it is very unreliable.

When I fist became a Bullnose member, back in October 2019, Gary kindly recommended to replace with either a Motorcraft 2150 or an Edelbrock 1406 carb and a new intake manifold.

Here are some circumstances regarding this project.  Although I have done brakes, mufflers, oil, tires, some electrical work, some body work  - I am a true rookie regarding this level of engine work.

I am not looking for anything aggressive.  I love having the truck for trips to the hardware store or lumber yard.  I would probably put two or three thousand miles a year on the odometer.

Given the age of the truck - 37 years old - my State of Vermont does not require any emissions testing.  The current VV carb has an electronic choke.  The pollution air pump is disengaged and not working.  It has an EEC-III/Duraspark III distributor and ignition System.

It seems that in replacing the carb, I would need to also possibly replace parts of the ignition system.  I haven't been able to find resources that would outline that work for my 1983 truck.

Finally, there are too many vacuum hoses to mention.  I'm hoping that a carb swap would do away with many of those hoses.

My first step will be to make a decision on which path to take - either the Motorcraft 2150 or a new Edelbrock intake manifold with an Edelbrock 1406 carb.  

If you do have any information or knowledge that you would like to share, that would be awesome!  As I take these first steps any advice would be appreciated very much!

Thanks so much,

Tom

Hi Tom,

Where are you in VT? (as I've been stranded here for weeks!  ()

The 2150 is the path of least resistance.
It's a very reliable carburetor installed on millions and millions of vehicles.
Being a two barrel, you wouldn't need to change your intake manifold or figure out how to hook up the throttle cable.

I have an aftermarket intake and Edelbrock carb, so we can go there, if you want.

The only real vacuum lines you can remove relate to the emissions system.
You still need a brake booster, and if you have AC you need climate control.
If you want to eliminate the EGR, you will need a carb spacer in addition to doing some distributor tuning.

Gary is correct. It's all or nothing with EEC-III & IV.
In changing your ignition so that it isn't computer controlled you're going to need to add ANOTHER vacuum line (to the distributor) so the ignition can adjust for throttle position.

The two options are:
Reverting to a DuraSpark II system with the ignition module on the inner left fender liner, or using an 'all in one' HEI style distributor.

Most of us have the DS-II system.
To implement this you need the distributor, coil, ignition module and the harness that ties it all together.
Everything is plug 'n' play from there.
Your truck already has all the other wiring to accept this.

With an HEI you need to add a relay that is hot in start and run and large gauge wire to power it.
I just mentioned in Josh's thread that this would be a good time to document the HEI conversion.

The EEC computer and its wiring is independent of the rest of the truck, so it is easy to remove it cleanly.

Tom, I have an 86 351W HO that had a Ford/Holley Carb on it. I'm not familiar with what's on yours but mine is newer and typically with newer comes more integration into the electronics and such. The carb on my truck gave me all kinds of grief and I  just could not take it anymore. Anyway, I removed it along with all the pollution garb and went with an Edlebrock 1406 carb and intake.  I have headers and true dual exhaust. I also have the original ignition system. The removal of this stuff on my truck was both a huge improvement in performance and fuel mileage and that Edlebrock 1406 is a great carb, easy to rebuild and reliable. That being said, others on here know far more than me about how things are integrated and the affect of their removal and/or replacement. Good luck in your project.  

John,
Your H.O. came with a DSII ignition and a Holley 4180 four barrel carb.

His has EEC and a two barrel solenoid controlled variable venturi carb.

"Getting rid of all that emissions crap" is always an option for some, who don't have a visual inspection or aged out altogether.

But the starting points are starkly different, as is the path of least resistance.

That's why I deferred to the likes of you, brother!!!  

Indeed, sounds like he has more mess to contend with.

But it seems -for the most part- Blackie is behaving well!

And I'm really glad you're getting to enjoy him.  👍

Thanks John!  I'm going to follow Jim's advice, and likely go with the Motorcraft 2150.  I think I still need to better understand all that is involved with this carb replacement project.  Being a total novice in this area, I'll be looking for lots of suggestions as this project unfolds!  Thanks again for connecting!
Best,
Tom

Hi Jim,

I live in Fairfax, Vermont.  We are about 30 miles or so north of Burlington.  Stop by if you are in the area!  Regarding your advice, I'm thinking that maybe the 2150 is the way to go.  I'm inferring that it is probably the simplest replacement; which, would be a good starting place for me.  Unless you have another perspective, I'll probably take this path.

That said, do you have any online recommendations on purchasing a Motorcraft 2150?  I've done a bit of searching, and am coming up short so far.

Given that I don't need to have an emissions inspection, I imagine that I can remove all of those related parts, such as the air pump.  Also, I do not have AC.  

And, what would be your recommendations regarding the Duraspark II or the HEI distributor system?  I'm not sure which would be better.

Thanks so much for your help!

Best,

Tom

Hi Tom,

I'm WAY down in the southwest corner -Readsboro- right now. Piecing together my transfer case.

The 2150 is probably the most direct replacement (non-emissions) carb for you.
They're highly regarded, and if you want tuning info turn to Bill *Vose (85LebaronT2) here on the forum.
He ran a carb and tune-up shop for years when these were popular.

I think the advantage to DuraSpark is that most parts stores will have a spark box, coil or distributor available off the shelf.
While the HEI is easier to adjust the ignition curve and consolidates your entire ignition in one inexpensive unit.

I'll look around for a 2150 for you.
I only have 4V's on the shelf.

Quick note on the DSII systems. That's what my truck came with originally (351w HO). It sat for about ten years before I got it and the ignition module needed to be replaced. Replaced it with a parts store module, bad decision. I think I put 4 new modules in it before I bought a MSD 6AL box. The modules would last about a year then leave me stranded. Last time the module only lasted a week or two before it gave up. Thankfully I had my MSD box mounted and ready to go but hadn't terminated the wires yet so I got to finish my wiring at about 2am on the side of the road. Just food for thought.

Now a factory Duraspark module is known to be very good. Unfortunately finding one is hard in my experience. The MSD is very good and reliable imo. And it is very very similar to the Duraspark. The only differences I know are the multiple sparks below 3,000rpm for each firing event with the MSD and the magnetic pickup signal wires are swapped. Ford Racing actually had a Duraspark box with MSD internals at one point if that tells you something.

If all emissions equipment is
removed the distributor will need to be recurved as well.

I'd recommend a Duraspark II distributor from Scott at Parkland Performance (custom curved), MSD box, MSD Blaster coil, and good plug wires. That's what I did because mine is my daily driver, I wanted the best. They're easy to wire and the trucks idles and runs a lot better. Just my experience though. If you can find a good Duraspark module you won't be disappointed, it's a really good system. Looking forward to what you do and hopefully what I said can be useful.

I've been using the NAPA (Echlin) TP40 modules and have NO problems with them.
My "known good" spare under the seat got swapped out after the better part of a decade.

The start retard functions properly and they have no problem to 6k.

I think Gary has them in Big Blue now too.

Jacob - What coil were you running?  A high-intensity coil will kill a DS-II module.

But I agree that having Scotty curve a new dizzy is the way to go.  


Jim - You mean this?    As you know, the idea of having a spare module under the seat is all well and good, but why not have it "to hand"?

Also, your point about the retard function is spot-on.  Not all modules have it, but Big Blue's old 460 didn't like to start w/o it.  With it, piece of cake.

Jim- I'm glad to hear y'all have good experiences with them. I got mine from O'Reilly's but I don't know who manufactures them. I'll see if I can find out. But in all honesty I may have been doing something wrong that led to them going out prematurely as I read what Gary said

Gary- You might be on to something there. The first replacement coil I think was stock. After that I used Accel Super Stocks. Once I was fed up with those going out I stepped up to the MSD Blaster. And now that I think about it I had most trouble with the ignition boxes when I upgraded to the MSD coil. That's good to know, I had no idea. I'll remember that next time I mess with one.

Thank you Jacob!  I'll reference this information as I get to that point in the replacement.  Right now I'm just trying to sort of develop a basic understanding of how all of these parts work together.  BTW, what does 'HO' stand for when you describe your truck with a 351W HO.  Thanks!
Tom

Awesome!  Thanks Jim.  I'll start by labeling and taking everything apart.  Looks like Duraspark is the way to go.  I'll check out Jacob's recommendations at Parkland and also see what I can find at parts stores.  Here I go!

If you do get to Northern Vermont, let me know.  I'd love for you to take a look at the truck!

Best,

Tom

HO is high output.
It is a heavy (8500+) gross weight truck with a 4-barrel carb, no catalytic converters and no computer controlled ignition timing.

Low impedance coils put a lot of load on the transistor in the DuraSpark box, and tend to cause it to overheat.

The potting melts out and the transistor loses contact with the heatsink of the case.

It's not long from there to failure.

I'm putting together a parts list and this is what I have so far:

Motorcraft 2150 carburetor
Duraspark II Distributor
Duraspark II Ignition Coil
Duraspark II Ignition Module
Duraspark II Wiring Harness

I'm guessing that if I can't find OEM parts, I'll be able to use aftermarket parts.

Here are the first steps I'll take:

Remove old VV carb and label all vacuum hoses
Remove air pump (it looks as if it has seized); and plug any hoses
Remove EEC unit under the driver's seat

I reckon I'll keep the EGR, although maybe this is something that should be replaced since it is 37 years old!

Let me know what you think, and thanks for the help so far.  I've been spending a lot of time looking on line for parts, without much luck.  I'll head to an auto parts store tomorrow.

Thank you!!!

I've been poking around and it seems there are a LOT of 2100 reproductions available quite inexpensive.

Many people will say "I don't want that Chinese garbage on my truck" but the reality is that any number of members have bought Carter YF clones for their 300's and we don't get reports that they don't work.

Another thing you should probably address is the thermactor pipe that bridges the two cylinder heads at the back.
Without the air pump blowing through it, exhaust gases will rot it out and you will have a loud tick against the firewall.
The ports it connects to can be plugged with a short 5/8-11 bolt and a copper or aluminum crush washer.

I'm using a Standard brand replacement coil. I'll get the number for you...

The recommendation for one of Scotties recurved DSII distributors is a good one.
You know it will be set up correctly and tested, unlike some random reman from the parts store.

Hi Jacob,
I just took some time to review the msd website.  I think I have a better understanding now of the difference between a msd ignition system and a factory ignition system.  I see that msd makes most of the components that I would need - distributor, coil, ignition module.  Thanks for the heads up!  Learning a lot about all of the options!
Tom